CAL GUYS, PAY not as they stated in writting.

[Hpilot]

As a probationary pilot? I'd classify that as poor judgment.

Totally agree with that. A guy at Airwisky brought this kind of attention on himself. They waited until the year probation meeting then said "don't let the door hit you on the way out".

 

[Lear70]

A) Never seen a pilot fired for something so small. Never seen a probie fired at all, and I have seen some probies do some pretty darn dumb stuff.

You must have worked at some very cool places.

I've seen it happen many, many times.

However, of those that happened, most occurred because the person in question either had the tact of a pit bull or the brain of one.

Sounds like the question has already been answered: you read your letter incorrectly. Glad this forum was good for something helpful to you (clarification). Sorry it's not in your favor (pay).

As far as Skybus? Get the type rating, use it to go Ex-Pat DEC for $150k+ a year. Keep their training costs SKY high...

 

[Bavarian Chef]

While we may not be at the bottom, we can see if from here.

Folks are walking from CAL and JB. Age 60 has meant that the FO wages better be livable, because some of us are going to be on them for a while. I think we got a shot across the industry on these next contracts for some serious improvements...

Its not a question of whether guys will leave their company or their industry. Its happening already.

Skybus? Nobody will stay. They'll fill some classes with some new meat that want A320 type ratings, but just as JB is having a hard time filling classes as the train has slowed and rapid upgrades aren't happening--Skybus will see the same thing.

And do you refuse to prep any of them, especially those dirtbags from jb or skybus?

(toungue in cheek, albie. actually a deeper question than the mob will take it for.)

 

[talespin]

CAL has always had sub-par pay even before 9/11 with a weak pilot group. Any place that lets scabs be union officals should raise some flags.

Well there is a lot of new young blood at this company who have been eating sh!t for a long time at the regional carriers, so hopefully we will stand together for contract 08. I know everyone I talk with is pissed and won't settle for less. I hope this holds true as we approach the table. You guys keep in mind we are the first ALPA carrier to go through this since 9/11 and all the bullsh!t cuts, so what ever airline your at a little support would be nice and hopefully our contract will pay off in the end when yours comes around.

 

[Uniform Shop]

This cracks me up. If you have only been at XJT for a few years and you won't go to CAL, and still look for a "better" airline while you're there, you're nuts. It's a lot easier to leave CAL for another airline then it is from XJT. Why someone wouldn't make the move is beyond me.

First year pay does suck and no insurance for the first 6 months is total B.S. That will change, I guarantee it. I wish you could see our private message boards. That's one of the hottest topics. I also guarantee that our pay is going to go up substantially on the next contract. If it doesn't you will see pilots leaving everyday.

As far as new hires leaving. There are a few people leaving but not as much as this message board makes it out to be. I know people who have gone back to DAL because of their pension settlement and longevity. I would leave too if I was going to get 200,000 into my 401K and 7th year pay. Everyone has their reasons for leaving.

I honestly believe that we have some of the best flying in the industry. As a new hire you have the option to fly all over the world in wide body aircraft or fly 737's all over the U.S., South America, Caribbean and Mexico. If you combine our flying with a decent contract then you would have one of the most desired places to be.

They gave up way too much on the last contract but it was negotiated by morons during the worst downturn in Aviation history and it will get better.

 

[pkober]

An ex-CAL guy (left after 9 months for SWA) was in the XJT weather room yesterday telling a story that his hotel room wasn't scheduled in IAH the night before his IOE. He called scheduling and they told him it wasn't their problem and advised him to sleep in the crew room. He said it happened to 4 other guys in his new hire class.

There is no way I cold work for that place after hearing so many stories. Yes, for you history buffs, I interviewed, was hired, and turned them down when they called me with a class date. Definitely wost major IMO.

I was most concerned that nothing is going to change there for a long time.

bye farr da bust speeling seene 2 dait!

Good luck with your career choices. Every airline I have worked for, 3 majors, has problems. If your looking for a dream airline job, keep looking. Anyone who thinks that the airline they work for is perfect must be smoking crack.

 

[pkober]

CAL has always had sub-par pay even before 9/11 with a weak pilot group. Any place that lets scabs be union officals should raise some flags.

I guess you feel the same way about UAL. If the scab issue bothers you than you should be mad a ALPA national. They welcomed the CAL scabs back into the fold with open arms. It's all about money. I don't like what the scabs did either and they suck as pilots. But you can't lump all of CAL into some kind of scab group. Most of us are "loyal" ALPA members in good standing.

As far as pay goes, look at our pay now compared to the other majors. If we are now sub-par, then most others are sub-parrier. First year pay sucks and hopefully will be addressed in 08.

 

[Andy]

A) Never seen a pilot fired for something so small. Never seen a probie fired at all, and I have seen some probies do some pretty darn dumb stuff.

B) Ignorance on the subject? Disagreement is not a sign of ignorance. How many airlines have you been employed by? This is my third in 9 years, so I think its safe to say I have the ability and background to draw a rational opinion on this subject.

I personally know two pilots who were canned during their probationary year; one at United and one at Alaska. I know both of them and was on a first name basis with both of them. I know of several others who were canned from various airlines during probationary year.
If you say that you've never seen a probie fired at all, then yes, you are ignorant on the subject. Either you haven't noticed or you don't know many pilots. So by your statement that you've never known a probie to be fired indicates that you do not have the ability and background to discuss this subject.
How many airlines have I been employed by? Two. But I know hundreds of pilots at all different airlines.

The problem here is that you do not know if the original poster draws attention to themselves on a regular basis. If so, the very best recommendation is that they keep a low profile for a year.
SOVT has posted the letter that he received from CAL; this whole thread is because the original poster was unable to comprehend the concept of being a reserve pilot vs being in training. That tells me that the original poster is not the sharpest knife in the drawer (harsh statement, but the letter is clear enough). Based on this, I would say that the very best advice that could be given to the original poster is to have a low profile for a year.

 

[pianoman]

An ex-CAL guy (left after 9 months for SWA) was in the XJT weather room yesterday telling a story that his hotel room wasn't scheduled in IAH the night before his IOE. He called scheduling and they told him it wasn't their problem and advised him to sleep in the crew room. He said it happened to 4 other guys in his new hire class.

There is no way I cold work for that place after hearing so many stories. Yes, for you history buffs, I interviewed, was hired, and turned them down when they called me with a class date. Definitely wost major IMO.

I was most concerned that nothing is going to change there for a long time.

Oh no a scheduling problem?! That NEVER happened to me at XJT!

I've always defended the choice of guys who want to stay at XJT and pass up CAL. Would you mind laying off slamming my choice for a little while? There are ups and downs to every place but, honestly, you're just making yourself look petty and immature by doing this.

 

[IslandDriver]

Just Food for thought

First year pay at Continental : $27,360
First Year at SWA: $48,672 - $7,000 for type = $41,672 plis you do not have to pay COBRA to keep your family insured......


All based on min gaurantee 737

In short over your first 4 years at CAL you will make $190,000 (min on 73) SWA you will make $320,000 (min on 73) at CJC you can make $225,000 on the Q over the next 4 years as a Captain....something to think about when you jump ship for CAL.

 

[ferlo]

Just suck it up for now, get off probation and call in sick for a couple 4 days...You're going to get your money one way or another...Airlines never seem to understand that.

 

[pkober]

Just Food for thought

First year pay at Continental : $27,360
First Year at SWA: $48,672 - $7,000 for type = $41,672 plis you do not have to pay COBRA to keep your family insured......


All based on min gaurantee 737

In short over your first 4 years at CAL you will make $190,000 (min on 73) SWA you will make $320,000 (min on 73) at CJC you can make $225,000 on the Q over the next 4 years as a Captain....something to think about when you jump ship for CAL.

You can get insured with other plans that they offer on day one. You don't have to buy COBRA. The whole insurance thing is blown out of proportion. Mostly by people who don't work at CAL and don't know. You can get insured for less than what you will pay once on CAL's insurance. You will have a high deductible, that's all. You're not left in the cold.


You forgot to add the upgrade time at CAL right now may be as low as two years. Junior captain is a 2001 hire with approx 4 years of furlough time. He is making more that $50/hr. So first year $27,000. Second year $65,000. He is a captain now for years three and four, $140,000 x 2 = $280,000. $280,000 + $65,000 + $27,000 = $372,000. Than add into that about 8 on time bonus checks at $65 dollars a pop for and additional $2080 and you now have $374,000 over four years. He may make a few cents more on per diem so lets make it $374,352.69.

You like SWA and thats peachy. I like it here at CAL and that's swell. Can't we all just get along.

 

[Whataburger]

If you say that you've never seen a probie fired at all, then yes, you are ignorant on the subject. So a lawyer that has never seen someone get a lethal injection can't argue for or against the death penalty? I went thru my memory banks - yes I did see one fired for stealing from a shop in DCA while in uniform. How about we both stick to what we know. You stick with mil stuff and I'll stick with civ. Just because you've sat around the crewroom 5 years ago does not make you an expert on major airlines. Maby an expert on being furlougheed. Seems you've been furloughed longer than flying the line.Either you haven't noticed or you don't know many pilots. I know tons of pilots. Good, you get the "knows the most pilots" award. So by your statement that you've never known a probie to be fired indicates that you do not have the ability and background to discuss this subject. Wrong again.
How many airlines have I been employed by? Two. But I know hundreds of pilots at all different airlines.

The problem here is that you do not know if the original poster draws attention to themselves on a regular basis. If so, the very best recommendation is that they keep a low profile for a year.
SOVT has posted the letter that he received from CAL; this whole thread is because the original poster was unable to comprehend the concept of being a reserve pilot vs being in training. You've never misread something? That tells me that the original poster is not the sharpest knife in the drawer (harsh statement, but the letter is clear enough). Based on this, I would say that the very best advice that could be given to the original poster is to have a low profile for a year.

Seems that someone cant have another opinion than yourself. That's pretty weak. Some of our opinions can be right or wrong, but to call someone ignorant or "not the sharpest knife in the drawer for a small oversight is a bit pompous dont ya think?

 

[Uniform Shop]

All based on min gaurantee 737

In short over your first 4 years at CAL you will make $190,000 (min on 73) SWA you will make $320,000 (min on 73) at CJC you can make $225,000 on the Q over the next 4 years as a Captain....something to think about when you jump ship for CAL.

Did you compare CJC's and CAL for the next 25 years? There are a lot more factors to consider before you look at worst case scenario. As a new hire you could get the 757/767 or the 777. If you were awarded the 737 as a new hire you can jump to the 757/767 or 777 on the next bid. You will also receive a profit sharing check. Last year was about a months pay. This year it should be more because we made money in the first quarter compared to a big loss last year.

You also have to look at movement. In a 1.5 years I am only 350 numbers from Captain in EWR. I should hold that within the next 2 years (worst case). I understand that it's all subject to change tomorrow but if there is a drastic change it will be industry wide, not just at CAL.

I'm not happy about flying 90 hours a month but we are so short staffed that you should be looking at at least 85 hours a month for pay, not 72. That doesn't change the crappy hourly rate but it will help you through the tough first year.

I'm not trying to convince anyone to come here. It was a tough decision for me to be honest with you but you can't base your decision on Airlinepilotpay.com. I'm glad I made the move but I was hired at the beginning of the hiring so maybe I'm a little more biased.

Good Luck.

 

[Jonny Sacko]

Seems that someone cant have another opinion than yourself. That's pretty week. Some of our opinions can be right or wrong, but to call someone ignorant or "not the sharpest knife in the drawer for a small oversight is a bit pompous dont ya think?

I think you've proved his point quite well. Maybe you'll re-read your post, then think a little. Maybe run a spell checker or two. It's interesting how many of you Southwest Pukes think you've got this thing all figured out. The arrogance will diminish rapidly when the rest of the industry returns to normal. Once again, I don't expect you to understand, cause UND, Riddle, or which ever rock you snaked through didn't elicit history, just arrogance it seems.