Busted Checkride - How to Explain?

[lowslow]

So, eh, how long is a TAF good for?

You tend to forget these things after awhile anyway.

 

[siucavflight]

I have one, my student pass ratio is superb... a bust is more a refection on the instructor than the student. Outside my PPL I never received ANY ground from my instructor.



Incorrect, you need to know the examiner I went with. I have been referred to as "crazy" and "masochistic" for my choice in examiners. This mans pass rate is about 50%.... now you tell me how many checkride you would have bused had you failed 50% of them?

Now the excuses are kicking in and I see why this would be a problem on an interview. Remember IT IS YOUR FAULT. Dont blame the instructor, dont blame the examiner, IT IS ALL YOUR FAULT.

By the way, if I failed 50% of my checkrides, I would be looking for a new career as I would not trust myself in an airplane. But luckily I have not busted 1.

 

[KigAir]

So, eh, how long is a TAF good for?

You tend to forget these things after awhile anyway.

Till the next one is issued?

 

[lowslow]

That's what I thought, as in valid for the time it says it's valid for? But I'm sure there is a real, short answer here somewhere.

 

[LavMan]

Nobody is perfect. We are only human. It doesn't make you a better or worse pilot. Thier are many things people are good at besides flying when it comes to getting a job. Character, personality, social skills. Just another side of it to look at.

 

[Bjammin]

There are really 2 TAF's a 24 hour and a 9 hour. The 9 hour is mostly used over seas.
The date and validity is on the TAF itself. It will read something like "111150 111212" meaning the TAF was made on the 11th at 1150Z and is valid from 1200Z on the 11th until 1200Z on the 12th, ie 24hrs.

 

[TIS]

Simply untrue. For six people I know of at my flight school the ONLY checkride they ever busted was the ONLY time they ever took this examiner... that’s a fact. As for my initial (MEI) with the FSDO, NO ONE from our school has EVER passed an initial checkride with this man.

I think you've stumbled on to the most important thing you've missed. You've referred to your school and the bust rate of folks associated with it.

You're being sent a message both by a DPE and by the FAA proper as I understand it. How 'bout you pay attention!

And antoher thing, if you bust a private pilot checkride, okay, maybe there's some blame for the instructor. Instrument? Yeah probably there too. Commercial? Nope! You're a licensed pilot applying to become a PROFESSIONAL pilot. It's your gig to screw up not the instructor's.

CFI? CFI candidates do not fail simply because they go to the FAA for their test. They fail because they are ILL PREPARED for the test they will be given. I have signed off 17 initial CFI applicants and another 25 additional instructor endorsements. Know what? Not a SINGLE ONE ever failed - not with the FAA and not with a DPE - ever.

Look, I don't know you but I know you're in a hurry - that's why you're at a school. What's your hurry? The paycheck isn't bigger if you get there faster. On the other hand, your lack of experience can become a liability if you "live the dream" too quickly. One has only to look at a recent accident on a CRJ to know this.

I AM TAKING RESPONSIBILITY, the only thing I am saying is that I would not (as a categorical fact) have busted but maybe one checkride had I chosen different examiners. So, yes I SCREWED UP, however... that would not have cost me a bust with other examiners. Let me say that again, I SCREWED UP, I leaned from that, and I am as good an instructor as you will find today because of it with a student pass rate that is far more a reflection of my abilities than what before essentially amounted to a test of how well I trained myself since my instructor never did a dang thing but milk me for time (I pretty much taught myself from the multi-private up).

you're not listening to what you're being told by some VERY sage and wise advisors here. STOP blaming the examiner already. The checks were yours to fail, GET IT?!? Your refusal to accept this very simple reality is going to bar you from progressing to the top of this business. I've seen your kind many many times. You make mistakes you shouldn't make and always have a convenient excuse at the ready when pressed on it. Yup, been there, done that, got the tee-shirt.

Adjust your attitude and accept the things you do not do so well. Accepting one's faults is the surest way to avoid having them become liabilities when the chips are down.

TIS

 

[banned username 1]

So there you go psunder.

It couldn't be any clearer than from this cross-section of professional pilots.

In the best tradition of aviators, we've tried to help an new guy out when he asked for help. We've done our job, now it's time for you to do yours. If I were you, I'd print these responses out and refer to them weekly in order to keep yourself on track to changing your perspective on aviation, your future and how you're going to get there, and most importantly, yourself.

We used to say when we interviewed that the best predictor of future performance is your past performance because frankly, without a truly life-changing event, a person never changes. You've got to find your own life-changing event.

Now, go out there and find it.

Best of luck,

UAL78

 

[FN FAL]

Once again, incorrect. I AM TAKING RESPONSIBILITY, the only thing I am saying is that I would not (as a categorical fact) have busted but maybe one checkride had I chosen different examiners. So, yes I SCREWED UP, however... that would not have cost me a bust with other examiners. Let me say that again, I SCREWED UP, I leaned from that, and I am as good an instructor as you will find today because of it with a student pass rate that is far more a reflection of my abilities than what before essentially amounted to a test of how well I trained myself since my instructor never did a dang thing but milk me for time (I pretty much taught myself from the multi-private up).

I doubt Pinnacle is going to care so much about the busted rides when they give you an interview. But they sure are going to have a lot of fun when you come out of the sim eval looking like a bear rolled you around in the prairie looking for that jelly doughnut in your pocket.

 

[WhiteCloud]

CFI? CFI candidates do not fail simply because they go to the FAA for their test. They fail because they are ILL PREPARED for the test they will be given. I have signed off 17 initial CFI applicants and another 25 additional instructor endorsements. Know what? Not a SINGLE ONE ever failed - not with the FAA and not with a DPE - ever.

That's a pretty impressive rate especially considering that at some FSDO's only 10-20% pass their initial CFI ride on the first time. I hear over and over again from the examiners in my FSDO (that is known for being "tough" on CFI tests) that they also are also very impressed when those rare individuals come to them well prepared and ready to kick some ass and take names on their flight test. I tell initial CFI applicants they will only be signed off when they are ready to nail everything down and are solid on the PTS. It may take a little longer and cost a little more than it would with another instructor but we'll do what it takes to get them to a high level of confidence so they can pass the test and, more importantly, able to work effectively as a CFI. Good job on the pass rate! We need more instructors that approach test prep your way.

 

[TIS]

Well, to be fair the pass rate at the SJC FSDO is about 50%, so those were the “odds” that my students faced. But the thing is that it’s not about odds at all. Properly prepared individuals face virtually NO possibility of failure. When you’re ready to do the job the very instant the ink begins to dry on the temp certificate, everyone will know it.

I should mention that I didn’t take all who came to me for instruction. It’s not that I was being a snob but rather that I chose those I believed had the right attitude to do the job. Aviation is unique in the professional world because there are a very few professions where lives are at stake EVERY time one exercises the skills required for the job. These skills require deft initial installation and CONSTANT retooling throughout a career. An attitude of entitlement does not foster meeting these requirements.

I’m a tough instructor – just ask any of my former students. I demand a lot and I’m not easily pleased. Sincere back-breaking effort is all that will inspire me to believe that you mean what you say when you say that you want to be a professional pilot. Why? Because it’s a business that requires this level of effort to reach its loftiest heights of success.

Here’s some odds for ya: Only one in ten applicants will be offered a position by any particular major airline to which they apply. That is a 90% failure rate! How’re them 50% odds lookin’ now?

So, for those who think they’re entitled to a job because they meet a company’s hiring minimums think again. Those are not the qualifications that will matter in the long run. It’s not about flight time or passes and failures. It’s about maturity and the wisdom that comes with it. It’s about it being obvious that those things are in place and in play during an interview. It’s about ALWAYS understanding that there was a better way to do what you just did well.

TIS

 

[Guitar rocker]

Let me give you some perspective from the standpoint of a person who used to give pilot interviews- and that of a flight instructor too.

Even the best pilots have busted check rides. An interviewer is looking for somebody who takes the adult attitude toward that sort of thing, takes full responsibility for it, makes it right and learns from it and moves on.

Good luck.

I like what you had to say here.

Now that you mentioned interviews, I have always wanted to ask someone who did interviews at UAL (I assume you were there based on the UAL user) how some of those really good guys that we all know with heavy jet time got turned down and so many others who just graduated from college with oh so little time got hired there? I have often wondered how anyone with little time could have the experience gained in aviation to answer the "tell me about a time" questions that you asked? I mean, werent those answers supposed to be based on an individuals experience working together with another pilot in a two/three pilot cockpit environment? And if that was the case, wouldnt this individual have had perhaps at least some turbine or jet time rather than just recip time? How could someone that flew only small recips have the knowledge,skills, maturity level and experience gained to answer the questions which UAL asked, specifically those concerning a two person aircraft and questions related to CRM? Take the average 10k hour pilot with 8 type ratings, PIC and jet time..........would you ask the same questions to an applicant that had 1000TT that you would ask of the 10k hour pilot? It would only have been fair but I dont see how you could have.

I clearly respect your experience here, but was just looking for an answer which I am sure that you have to my question.

 

[frostyboy]

You failed your checkrides, that is what sticks to your resume.

Sorry, but you don't put "failed" checkrides on a resume. So how many checkrides did you fail and put on your resume???

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Well, to be fair the pass rate at the SJC FSDO is about 50%, so those were the “odds” that my students faced.

That's a lot better than it used to be. When I took my CFI practical from one of those guys the pass rate was only about 20%. I was grilled for about 6 hours on the ground and 2 hours on the air. I was kind of surprised to have survived it. That was back in the early 90's. I still remember the guy asking me to demonstrate a cross controlled stall or something like that. First and only time for one of those I think.

Lot of guys and gals have failed a checkride or two. As so many others have mentioned what the airline is looking for is that you can take responsibility and move on. Checkrides are a fact of life in this industry. You'll be doing them once or twice a year for the rest of your career. Everyone has a bad day once in a while.

As far as that E6-B thing goes I haven't even seen one of those since I got out of flight instructing. I should probably put my old one on Ebay.

 

[taloft]

That was back in the early 90's. I still remember the guy asking me to demonstrate a cross controlled stall or something like that.

I hear that works really well for entering spins too

And to the respondents:
You don't actually expect us pilots to accept responsibility for our actions, do you? Blasphemy!

 

[Dave Benjamin]

I hear that works really well for entering spins too

Yeah I remember wondering if I'd just end up in a spin. It illustrates the classic overshoot onto final stall-spin scenario. That was a long day.

 

[ratherbeflyen]

What's your hurry? The paycheck isn't bigger if you get there faster. On the other hand, your lack of experience can become a liability if you "live the dream" too quickly.
TIS

That is one of the most profound statements I think I've heard on this board.