Bose X Headset Caveats - FYI

[avbug]

Again, I don't understand why you feel you need ANR in a turbojet cockpit. Apparently you do, and that's fine. You indicated using earplugs with Telex Airman 750's. I can't imagine why anyone would do that...why even bother with 750's if you're going to wear ear plugs, anyway??

If one side goes out in your headset, you call telex, and they fix it for you. They're good about that. Most manufacturers are.

My guess is that you are looking for ANR due to the length of your flights. If you have a Sennheiser and like it, why not simply make the padding adjustments to make it fit? Slip an oregon aero headband, and try some cloth earcovers.

Otherwise, get the bose fixed, or sell it to me.

 

[FearlessFreep]

avbug,

Say what? I can't hear you!

Of course I want to save my hearing. Here's a little news flash, the only way that your going to experience the world and life itself is through your senses. Taste, touch, smell, kinetics, hearing and sight. Lose or have any of them diminished and you lose your ability to experience life to it's fullest extent. I go out of my way to preserve all the senses that I have to my best ability.

I have been in a number of different jet cockpits and there have been varying degrees of noise in them both from model to model and individual aircraft to aircraft. They are all different. There is a lot more noise than you might realize. From my understanding you should talk to ERJ pilots. They say that cockpit is so loud you have to use DC type headsets.

The Sennheiser problems have nothing to do with padding, it has to do with the pressure applied to the ears and the general geometry of the set. Slapping an Oregon Aero Headband will not work, it won't even fit this headset. You are obviously not familiar with the model or it's design. Cloth earcovers is not going to fix the problem and the cloth ear covers will probably negatively affect the ANR. Your suggestions are going to have to be a bit better and not so generic.

I made a post to state a problem that I thought some people may be interested in knowing before they go out an purchase a $1000.00 headset. The point of it was not to denigrate the headset or the company - it was a let the buyer be aware. I related my experiences without rancor.

My advice to you is that it sounds (can you hear that?) like you want a Bose headset. Well go buy one, because I not "giving" you mine. I suggest you get it out of Anchorage- slightly cheaper and no sales tax. Have a nut!

 

[travis]

Count me in...

One more vote for the Bose X. No problems with mine since I bought them 2 years ago.

Lopaka - I solved the battery problem for me by taking a 9.6v NiMH battery for a remote control car and making an adapter that fits into the Bose's 9v bay. That sumb!tch will now go for a good two-three weeks before needing a recharge. Total cost is about $25. Hollar if you want help making one of your own.

Avbug - I agree ANRs may seem like overkill in a turbojet, but let me tell you about my experience. I had used nothing but DCs from 152s to SA227s. Then I got a pair of 750s when I got a Lear job. I used to have dog hearing. I mean, it was bionic. I used to freak the girls out when they gave me hearing tests. After a few years in the lears, however, I noticed a very distinct loss of hearing. I decided to try the Bose X. Two years later, I'm glad I did because my hearing has returned. Perhaps I don't need ANR headsets in the lear, but if I want to preserve my hearing for as long as possible, I'm convinced they'll help.

 

[vclean]

I installed the aftermarket ANC from HeadSets Inc. (~$170) into my 12 year old DC 10-20. Results have been great The life of the 9 volt battery was less than 25 hours, so I have a 6 AA battery holder taped to the 9 volt battery box. The battery box has a battery voltage LED (green - good, yellow - low, red - dead), and an automatic inactivity power-off function. Battery life in any ANC is determined by the ambient noise level. The noisier the flightdeck, the more the ANC works to cancel it.

http://www.headsetsinc.com

 

[Hovernut]

Mine have worked great for 800 hours of flight instruction and a year of flying the CRJ. No earcup replacements, either. Get a pair of rechargeable 9v batteries here

 

[SkyWestCRJPilot]

This info has been helpful. I'm looking for a new ANR headset for the Brasilia that I've returned to flying. After flying the CRJ for 2 years I'm still not used to the noise level in the E-120. I realize that I have to turn up the audio volume very loud to hear over the ambient noise my standard Dave Clarks attenuate. I've even tried using earplugs with my big DCs. What headset works well for the E-120? I've always been thinking about a Bose X but the comments in this thread make me wonder.

Avbug, headsets are needed in the CRJ cockpit. The newer ones are quiter than older CRJ models. The noise comes from the wind, not the engines. As you go faster the decibel level rises with IAS. Above 250 knots IAS the wind noise was really uncomfortable in the older CRJs. I just flew as a passenger on the ERJ-145XR this weekend. I enjoyed the flight but was surprised at how loud the cabin was, again due to the wind noise. The CRJ wasn't so loud for passengers in the cabin.

Interestingly enough if you want to have a quiet cockpit in the CRJ you can do the fuel conservation climb, climb at 250 knots up to your highest safe altitude, FL 350 or higher. Then once up there your indicated airspeed is so low that it stays quiet even in cruise at mach. 77 and high true airspeeds. If you speed up to Vmo on descent then it will get loud again though.

 

[avbug]

Freep,

I don't want a bose headset. I made those comments because you were the one who said you wanted to sell your at fire sale prices. Keep it, fix it, enjoy it.

You folks have NO concept what a loud cockpit sounds like. A learjet is quiet. Almost all turbojet aircraft are. Big or small. I've flown in the loudest cockpits of any aircraft ever built, and have a pretty good basis for comparison...as well as flying a variety of turboprop and turbojet equipment.

Folks used to tell me the Merlin was a loud airplane. Compared to some, it's a bit noisier...but it's not loud. People told the the C-130 was loud, but I can dinstinctly remember transferring to one from a 4Y one season, and I had to remove my headset during the takeoff roll because I couldn't hear the engines. No vibration. I had to keep glancing at the engine instruments to convince myself that nothing was wrong. Wisper quiet.

Hearing loss in a learjet? Age related, perhaps. Not the airplane. It's just not that loud.

 

[DoinTime]

Avbug,

In the past you have shown an impressive depth of knowledge over a wide range of topics but in this thread you proved that you know absolutely nothing about the anatomy and resilience of the human ear. Perhaps the reason you think most aircraft cockpits are quiet is because you have already lost a good portion of your hearing.

 

[avbug]

Actually, I'm well aware of the psyiology of the ear and surrounding structures, as well as the potential for damage at many hearing levels by noise.

I'm also aware that many are posting based on their limited experience in relatively quiet cockpits to begin with, and I'm telling you, it just ain't so.

By the same token, I've sat in cockpits with very experienced pilots who screamed bloody murder when they thought they had severe turbulence, and thought it really was. It was moderate at best. But they'd never seen worse, to make the comparison, and couldn't seem to apply the proper criteria to judge it for what it was, experience notwithstanding.

Extensive hearing is more from application to ramp noise than sustained wind noise over the cockpit (or cabin). It's not that loud.

ANR doesn't protect. It works in a narrow frequency range, and gives the impression of a reduction in noise. It noise hasn't actually been reduced. We are comforted by the placebo of perceived sound, as a small portion of the total noise is "reduced" by phase application of sound waves in those frequencies.

True hearing damage doesn't even occur through the auditory canal. It's occuring through the bone structure surrounding the auditory canal. For those ANR units that do not encase the ear and serve to dampen and prevent vibration against the bone structure surrounding the ear itself, the image of noise reduction is had, but not the fact. Any potential damage is still occuring, to say nothing of the distant research that has yet to be attended with respect to hearing loss OWING to ANR useage. Look into that in 15 years, and you may be very surprised what you learn.

Have I lost my hearing? You betcha. Sit behind a radial engine long enough, and it's all but inevitable, no matter what protection you have. I had plenty, and it still occured. Between big, loud engines, maintenance expeience with lots of riveting, proximity to piston and turbine engine runs on the ground, gunfire, and truly loud cockpits, there is no question that I have hearing loss on many levels. I no longer function well with a single side headset; if I'm not hearing with both ears, I'm not hearing well. I used to listen to music with the volume turned down almost all the way. Today, I turn it up a bit. Doing it just the opposite; maybe I'm becoming a kid again, or perhaps growing old prematurely due to environment.

I have grey hair early, too. And wrinkles...it's a mileage thing (not year of manufacture). The eyesight is going; it's a little harder every time I try for that first class medical. The weight climbs just a little each time. Still well within limits, but discouraging in some small way...kind of like each birthday.

Does that mean I don't know what I'm talking about? Not hardly.

Having said that, I can still hear a whisper across the room, and I can still spot traffic at a distance, and when I spot it, I can still tell you what it is. I'm not deaf; I still pass my physical for a medical certificate, and I still hold a first class certificate. I still hear sounds in the engine and in the airframe in flight.

I've also been in loud cockpits, and I have yet to be in a turbojet with a loud one.

If you really want loud, I stood out by the threshold at FAT once, with a sound meter, while two F-16's ran up the afterburner. I measured the sound. I then got in the cockpit of the 4Y, and it was louder at idle. At takeoff power, the meter was beyond limits, and the noise level was far beyond the threshold of pain. In fairness, after an environment like that, almost anything is quiet. However, without the comparison, you'd have to try hard to convince me that any turbojet cockpit is noisy.

 

[Swass]

Older Hawker's with the flat windsheilds are dang loud when descending.