ASTAR'S Race to the Bottom

[hvydriver]

Be careful what you wish for...

No Hap, I'm just tired of waiting for the other shoe to drop. Like Shooter, if I'm done, I'm out of aviation. I've got a job at the Harley shop waiting for me. It's a lot more fun than this is.

 

[shooter]

.

We all work for what is in effect the same company. This was not the case with Astar/ABX and DHL and in my view makes the cases only superficially similar.[/quote]

This is where you guys don't (or should I say just refuse to) get it. Our grievance was against DHL. Not ABF. It had everything to do with stopping DHL from buying growth instead of doing it organically, as was agreed to in our CBA with them. Hete has now put you guys in the same situation that we were in then. Except there are 3 players in your mix working for the same holding company. And just so you know, the 9th Circuit found in ALPA's favor to overturn the NLRB decision. 3-0. We dropped the grievance because it's more or less moot at this point. I'm going to go back to lurking since all this will be over soon. I'm tired of going in circles with you people. Good luck to all.[/quote]


What do you mean "you people"?

imp:

 

[shooter]

No Hap, I'm just tired of waiting for the other shoe to drop. Like Shooter, if I'm done, I'm out of aviation. I've got a job at the Harley shop waiting for me. It's a lot more fun than this is.

Sweet! A&8's?

 

[erichartmann]

This is where you guys don't (or should I say just refuse to) get it. Our grievance was against DHL. Not ABF. It had everything to do with stopping DHL from buying growth instead of doing it organically, as was agreed to in our CBA with them. Hete has now put you guys in the same situation that we were in then. Except there are 3 players in your mix working for the same holding company.

Hvy, you continued to regard DHL as your employer after the airline you work for was spun off. ABX did not continue to regard ABF, now part of DHL, as our employer. We were not part of DHL. We were and are a contractor. You wanted, in your own words, to force DHL, who was no longer your employer or parent company, to grow your seperate airline "organically" and cease doing business with ABX. Again, ABX was never part of DHL. ATI, CCI, and ABX are all part of ATSG. Astar and ABX were not part of DHL. That is the difference.

Our scope makes ATSG the successor company to ABX Holding, which in turn is the successor to ABX Air in so far as our CBA is concerned. Our scope, in turn, requires that the ATI & CCI pilots be on the same seniority list we are on. Your goal was to exclude us. Our goal is to include them. Very very different.

And just so you know, the 9th Circuit found in ALPA's favor to overturn the NLRB decision. 3-0. We dropped the grievance because it's more or less moot at this point. I'm going to go back to lurking since all this will be over soon. I'm tired of going in circles with you people. Good luck to all.

C'mon Hvy, you're being a bit disingenuous here. What the 9th circuit court did was rule in ALPA's favor on the side issue involving the NLRB & Ross Aviation raised by ABX management in an effort to stop your original (6th district if I recall correctly) federal case against DHL. Your original case, as I'm sure you recall, sought to compell DHL to appear at a grievance hearing regarding your scope. The orginal case is, I would guess, now moot since you have given up your claim under your new contract. I say again, we may never know what the outcome of that case might have been. What is clear is that you didn't "win" on your original grievance, at least not in federal court. Only time will tell if you won the organic growth fight.

 

[rotor&wing]

Our scope, in turn, requires that that the ATI & CCI pilots be on the same seniority list we are on.

Good Luck!! Let us know how that works out.

 

[erichartmann]

Good Luck!! Let us know how that works out.

Even if we lose Richard, what we are trying to accomplish is very different from what you tried.

 

[hvydriver]

Sweet! A&8's?

No Shooter, though that would be a good deal. I'll be heading back home to live on the family farm, and work the Hog dealership in town there. Big downsizing, no debt, and check out of the rat race. Actually, I'd kind of welcome it at this point. These vultures have pretty much sucked all the fun out of it.

 

[shooter]

No Shooter, though that would be a good deal. I'll be heading back home to live on the family farm, and work the Hog dealership in town there. Big downsizing, no debt, and check out of the rat race. Actually, I'd kind of welcome it at this point. These vultures have pretty much sucked all the fun out of it.

As long as they do not restrict GA too much, or start charging carrier fees :angryfire there should be enough fun left on that side for us. After seeing A&8's I have a new "level" of shops. It truly makes you feel good there and can see the lure to purchase right on the spot. Too bad it they can't do that, or else everyone would have one.
I will leave the hogs to you. I am going back to my childhood and go for the floating kind of transportation. I miss it dearly sometimes. And unless I do it seasonal up on the Great Lakes, I will be limited so I need to find something else. Or move back down south. I don't know how my wife would take that being a Northern girl.

Just hope for the best is all we can do.