ASA/XJT Pilots- Who's financially prepared to walk?

[Freebrd]

I've read it more than most..

you do a survey to determine that?

 

[buscap]

I've read it more than most. Most people think that block out will change because they are going off what others say or haven't even read the current contract we work under now.

No duty-rigs suck. Vacation low loss sucks. But really all the crappy changes are scheduling related, ie they want to use us more.

You are correct, but they want to use us more, for less money. The only way to objectively evaluate any TA is empirically. Even if it's a touch-feely soft issue, you have to convert it to money and make your decision that way, otherwise you risk falling for sucker baits.

The higher per-diem and higher 700/900 rates tied to getting more aircraft are easily evaluated in this way. The vacation low has to be converted to a lost time off or increased days worked either of which are easily quantified.

For me, as a 15 year 200 Captain, this contract equates to a $5200 pay cut once I work out all the dollar values of the changes. All but the loss of duty-rig that is. I really couldn't come up with a fair way to evaluate it, so I dropped it from the list, but it is most likely a minus.

 

[Nevets]

Admittedly, no dog in this fight.

Something to consider with this T/A:

Planes may go to SkyWest anyway. Forcing costs down at XJT may merely be the perfect management excuse to force a paycut on the SkyWest pilots.

Sure, there's no contract over there, but it seems more credible if management can say, "Look, times are tight, the XJT guys had to take a haircut and unfortunately we need to do the same here at SkyWest."

This is EXACTLY the scenario some of us on the XJT MEC said would happen back in 08. Sadly for the Inc pilots, this has been Skywest main business plan since then.

Hopefully they can point to this and tell management, try again:

"Q: How does this JCBA compare to the SkyWest contract? How about the rest of the regional
industry?
A: This JCBA keeps XJT pilots in the top tier of the regional industry by providing better compensation,
quality‐of‐life, and employee benefits than any agreement signed since the Pinnacle Airlines post‐
bankruptcy agreement. The new TA brings costs more in line (but slightly higher) with SkyWests
costs, adjusted for factors such as longevity, stage lengths, etc. Brad Rich, president of SkyWest, Inc.,
has stated in earnings calls that he does not expect XJT?s cost/expense structure to be the same as
that of SkyWest, but that it was necessary to make them more similar. While the pay rates at
SkyWest Airlines are slightly higher, when adjusted for all other contractual factors, an XJT pilot will
be paid more than a SkyWest pilot. "

 

[Nevets]

The only concessions are on the scheduling side of things.

No sir, this TA is concessionary in many quantifiable sections: B fund, 401k matching, premium caps, per diem, to name a few.

 

[Clutch]

No sir, this TA is concessionary in many quantifiable sections: B fund, 401k matching, premium caps, per diem, to name a few.

That's all exclusive to the L-xjt side of things. I wasn't talking to you.

 

[wms]

No-furlough and fragmentation clauses are gone. That's all it takes. Our original fragmentation policy transferred pilots with their seniority. Now it's just an opportunity for employment. The lessor clause was originally changed with the TPA, allowing a loophole to transfer airplanes without pilots.

 

[Clutch]

No-furlough and fragmentation clauses are gone. That's all it takes. Our original fragmentation policy transferred pilots with their seniority. Now it's just an opportunity for employment. The lessor clause was originally changed with the TPA, allowing a loophole to transfer airplanes without pilots.

So they spent how many millions of dollars on this merger to steal airplanes and send them to skywest just to turn around and spend $40,000 a pilot or so to retrain us. I'm a little skeptical.

Don't get me wrong, I'm voting no, but most of the arguments I hear are mind-numbingly retarded

 

[Nevets]

That's all exclusive to the L-xjt side of things. I wasn't talking to you.

To say the contract is concessionary in only the scheduling section is ignoring 2/3 of the entire pilot group which would be taking HUGE monetary concessions. There is no doubt that when the vast majority of the pilots are taking a monetary hit, this is a concessionary contract in any measurable way you want to look at it. Even the JNC admits this.

By the way, LTD, OJI bank, and sick accrual are also monetary concessions.

 

[Clutch]

To say the contract is concessionary in only the scheduling section is ignoring 2/3 of the entire pilot group which would be taking HUGE monetary concessions. There is no doubt that when the vast majority of the pilots are taking a monetary hit, this is a concessionary contract in any measurable way you want to look at it. Even the JNC admits this.

By the way, LTD, OJI bank, and sick accrual are also monetary concessions.

LTD, OJI, sick accrual are all L-xjt concessions. I couldn't care any less about your OJI, steven. I'm voting no and I realize the concessions, I'm saying most of the concessions on the ASA side are aimed at how much we work and for doing it less. No offense, but stop pretending that asa guys should vote based on you losing your precious b-fund.

 

[Nevets]

LTD, OJI, sick accrual are all L-xjt concessions. I couldn't care any less about your OJI, steven. I'm voting no and I realize the concessions, I'm saying most of the concessions on the ASA side are aimed at how much we work and for doing it less. No offense, but stop pretending that asa guys should vote based on you losing your precious b-fund.

I'm not pretending anything. I'm just saying that this TA has enormous monetary concessions for 2/3 of the pilots. This is a concessionary TA no matter what way you look at it. We should have brought you guys up to what we had in LTD, sick accrual, OJI, jury duty pay, per diem, B fund, 401k matching, premium caps, etc, and not just vacation accrual. And likewise, we should have gotten your rigs. This thing is a monetary concession for everyone because you guys are not getting what we have.