ASA Memphis base rumor?

[JettBoii]

I had one guy who still checked for an APU Fire Fail message.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

You can not be serious!!! Which of the new procedures will cause an accident?

FO flipping the generator on and ignition off?

This one was changed so the captain can focus on the operation, and the FO can do the upper-panel after start flow. There's no sense in both pilots having their hands in the same general area doing different things.

Setting the flaps before taxiing will cause an accident?

This was changed because we have had numerous people either attempt to take off with 0 flaps, or take off with the incorrect flap setting. This absolutely can lead to an accident. Setting the flaps is now part of a checklist/flow, and de-coupled from the clear left/right because there are too many distractions that can occur and cause you to forget to set them.

While it is true that they should be caught at later times, they have been missed enough to cause serious concern. Plus, there's just no excuse for them to not be in a flow such as the after start.

FO turning on the lights on the t/o check will cause an accident?

This one was changed so the captain can focus on positioning the aircraft on the runway instead of turning on the lights during such a critical phase of operation.

Accident because pilots find it hard to say XX.XX set/XX.XX cross checked?

Numerous ASAPs and near-violations for incorrect altimeter settings led to this. Plus, almost the remainder of the industry is "cross-checking." And that's for a reason.

Please do inform

Consider yourself informed.

Risk to the operation comes in more varieties than just risk of accident. Risk to your certificate should also be mediated.

 

[777forever]

This one was changed so the captain can focus on the operation, and the FO can do the upper-panel after start flow. There's no sense in both pilots having their hands in the same general area doing different things.



This was changed because we have had numerous people either attempt to take off with 0 flaps, or take off with the incorrect flap setting. This absolutely can lead to an accident. Setting the flaps is now part of a checklist/flow, and de-coupled from the clear left/right because there are too many distractions that can occur and cause you to forget to set them.

While it is true that they should be caught at later times, they have been missed enough to cause serious concern. Plus, there's just no excuse for them to not be in a flow such as the after start.



This one was changed so the captain can focus on positioning the aircraft on the runway instead of turning on the lights during such a critical phase of operation.



Numerous ASAPs and near-violations for incorrect altimeter settings led to this. Plus, almost the remainder of the industry is "cross-checking." And that's for a reason.



Consider yourself informed.

Risk to the operation comes in more varieties than just risk of accident. Risk to your certificate should also be mediated.

You're talking to the wrong person. I'm on your side of the argument. I directed my post towards ohplease! who said the new procedures will cause an accident/incident.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

You're talking to the wrong person. I'm on your side of the argument. I directed my post towards ohplease! who said the new procedures will cause an accident/incident.

My apologies.

 

[ohplease!]

You're talking to the wrong person. I'm on your side of the argument. I directed my post towards ohplease! who said the new procedures will cause an accident/incident.

2 incidents since the new procedures....and thats just the "known" incidents...

I'm just sayin'.....

 

[ohplease!]

That has to be it because I just can't see how someone can look at these new procedures and think it will cause an accident. That is beyond me. I mean nothing significant changed!

thats the point....why change the items that were changed?

and these new procedures just don't "flow" very well....Just my opinion (along with a LOT of others)....

But, most of us are professionals and will make it work....I'm just sayin' BE VERY CAREFUL (as you always have been-right?)

 

[SLUF4]

Um checklists were always meant to verify what you do after your flow. You still have to look at the item again and verify it. That's the point of a checklist. It's not just so you can recite it from memory and get it on the recorder. Complacency is why incidents happen-not because of the new checklist procedure.

 

[777forever]

Um checklists were always meant to verify what you do after your flow. You still have to look at the item again and verify it. That's the point of a checklist. It's not just so you can recite it from memory and get it on the recorder. Complacency is why incidents happen-not because of the new checklist procedure.

Thank you. I have no clue what he means by it doesn't 'flow'

 

[blesko]

Thank you. I have no clue what he means by it doesn't 'flow'

Since checklists are designed so as not for forget things, why are we receiving company e-mails about things that are not on the checklist??? F/A's notified? Forward facing lights on when cleared for takeoff?? These are two items we are supposed to "remember." I'm trained to do things by a checklist, not, partial checklist, partial memory.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Changing procedures once a year, moving things around on the checklists, different verbiage, etc., doesn't help these things, it makes them worse. What needs to happen is stricter line standards. I think the old procedures were bunk, these do seem better, actually. But new procedures are a major threat and need to be treated as such. Slow down, review, review, review. It's a major pain in the ass to keep going back and forth between the FMS and TDM, so just frigging print it, fold it, and place it prominently and not behind the speed card which you probably still were too lazy to set. Same goes for the landing data.

Be a frigging expert on these things and develop good personal habits and set standards for yourself. Anyone can sit in the seat and pretend they're a "pilot". Very few guys I fly with actually have respect for the machine, the job, and how one can wind up very embarrassed, out of a job, a license, or dead very quickly. Some seem to just friggin sit there with no charts out and complain about Captains who made them do their jobs and they felt slighted. Goodness I can spot these types as soon as I look over and see their closed Jepp book on top of the O2 mask..

 

[Freebrd]

..has anyone had Scott in recurrent lately?

nah not there, but I stayed at a HI Ex last nite and had him there, squeals like a pig too :laugh:

 

[ASABound]

Well Said Oakum Boy.....

 

[SLUF4]

I agree with the last part of Oakum's statement, but these changes are being brought about by real data we haven't had access to in the past at this company. Just give it a chance. I wouldnt be surprised if there are more tweaks within the next year.

 

[Abernathy]

That has to be it because I just can't see how someone can look at these new procedures and think it will cause an accident. That is beyond me. I mean nothing significant changed!

I don't think it's the new verification procedures they're upset about. It's things like, for instance, on the before T/O check, it's mostly the same exact items, only in a completely different order. What's the point of that?

 

[SLUF4]

Maybe it's to force the people who never look at the checklist to actually look at it for a week or two until they memorize this one?

 

[777forever]

Maybe it's to force the people who never look at the checklist to actually look at it for a week or two until they memorize this one?

Exactly! What order things are on the checklist should not matter because it should be read, not memorized.

 

[Abernathy]

Exactly! What order things are on the checklist should not matter because it should be read, not memorized.

I don't think that's really what we're arguing, though.

 

[SLUF4]

yes, but you asked why are they in a different order? Just my opinion, but maybe they reordered them to force people to actually read the darn thing for a change. at least until they memorize it again. I don't know why you would even read a checklist that way-too many chances to miss something.

 

[wms]

Look at the checklist to see what changed. Browse the expanded checklist in the OM. Then review the technical briefing. Takes less than ten minutes.

That's the problem many pilots are haveing. The biggest changes are procedural and are in the expanded and flight procedures of the OM and are not checklist items.

 

[79%N1]

So back the Memphis thing......What happened to this rumor?