ASA furloughs 80 pilots

[FishandFly]

In my opinion picking up open time while pilots are on furlough is no different than flying flights dropped by a pilot group on strike.

If you pick up anything in open time you are directly delaying the furloughed pilot being recalled.

 

[CFI2766]

You want pilots to donate to the pilots on the street BUT you don't want them to increase their flying to help pay for the guys on the street? Am I understanding you correctly?

Yes. That is EXACTLY what I'm advocating.

If the company can cover the open time with the amount of pilots on the active roster, why should the company recall the furloughs?

Look, I'm not throwing a barb at the company here. It's an awful situation; apparently it appears to be a situation that the company put off as long as it could. (Granted, I have only the obvious public information. As a line flying, habitually fatigued, underpaid, pilot, I probably do not have all of the facts.) The company is doing what it can in the interests of its shareholders first. Frankly, that's the way business works.

If I were one of the guys furloughed, as we all could be, I would want the guys left on the schedule thinking about me in the same way that I'm thinking about them. As pilots, no one will ever look out for us but ourselves. Bottom line, if you pick up open time at ASA, you are keeping an ASA pilot out of a job.

 

[CFI2766]

not that I disagree with the open time argument but if you feel it was handled as well as it could have been, why the problem with others picking up open time? seems a little contradictory

Honestly, I don't see the contradiction. I could be missing something here, but what did you mean here?

It's not in the financial interests of ASA/SKYW to train pilots with the intention of furloughing them. I don't think that this action had any overt malice towards the pilot group. Am I wrong here?

 

[filejw]

In my opinion picking up open time while pilots are on furlough is no different than flying flights dropped by a pilot group on strike.

If you pick up anything in open time you are directly delaying the furloughed pilot being recalled.

You know I've heard this all through my 30 years and agree but have come to the conclusion "fly the contract". If pilots wanted they would have it put in their next negotiations, but they don't.

 

[Texx]

If I were on furlough and knew someone was stabbing me in the back, I could think of a couple things.

Oh here we go.

Let me ask you and the other pilots a question.

Did you vote FOR or Against the current CBA?

 

[CFI2766]

Oh here we go.

Let me ask you and the other pilots a question.

Did you vote FOR or Against the current CBA?

Voted FOR. What's your point?

That I did not vote against so that there could be another section prohibiting picking up open time added to the CBA?

I guess I thought that common sense and decency would not require that people be contractually obliged to do the right thing.

It appears that you are proving me wrong.

I'd very much like to see a list of people who have picked up open time after the furlough was announced. Very much indeed.

 

[Texx]

Voted FOR. What's your point?

That I did not vote against so that there could be another section prohibiting picking up open time added to the CBA?

I guess I thought that common sense and decency would not require that people be contractually obliged to do the right thing.

It appears that you are proving me wrong.

I'd very much like to see a list of people who have picked up open time after the furlough was announced. Very much indeed.

I along with 186 pilots vote against the CBA. If the no furlough protection was so important to many, why didn't you guys hold out until the contract language protected any ASA pilot?

So are you part of this problem?

 

[Texx]

I guess I thought that common sense and decency would not require that people be contractually obliged to do the right thing.

Yep, like pilots that call in sick for a date.

Like pilots that show up at the airplane after drinking within 8 hrs.

Like pilots that go breaking windshield on an overnight and then get caught.

etc....

 

[McNugent]

Furloughs suck. Period. But bickering among the pilots about who's picking up open time, or who's not donating $$$ etc. isn't helping the situation. Personally, I take this as a kick in the ass to do everything I can do, to make ASA a viable option for future growth. That is the only way we are getting these guys back, and everyone needs to get on board with that. There are still a lot of crews who are apathetic to fuel conservation, D-0 and customer service. So instead of arguing, second guessing our management, and cursing Delta, do something about it. There's 1630 of us after Feb. 9th who can give the furloughed guys the biggest gift of all, and that's just by doing our jobs, and doing them in the most efficient, professional manner possible.

 

[Texx]

Furloughs suck. Period. But bickering among the pilots about who's picking up open time, or who's not donating $$$ etc. isn't helping the situation. Personally I take this as a kick in the ass to do everything I can do, to make ASA a viable option for future growth. That is the only way we are getting these guys back, and everyone needs to get on board with that. There are still a lot of crews who are apathetic to fuel conservation, D-0 and customer service. So instead of arguing, second guessing our management, and cursing Delta, do something about it. There's 1630 of us after Feb. 9th who can give the furloughed guys the biggest gift of all, and that's just by doing our jobs, and doing them in the most efficient, professional manner possible.

This had to be the most intelligent posting that you have ever made.

But your still a Bozo.

 

[filejw]

This had to be the most intelligent posting that you have ever made.

But your still a Bozo.

He may be a Bozo but he is right. Ripping things down never helped anybody.

 

[CFI2766]

I along with 186 pilots vote against the CBA. If the no furlough protection was so important to many, why didn't you guys hold out until the contract language protected any ASA pilot?

So are you part of this problem?

To quote, from Websters:

–verb (used with object) 1. to ascribe (one's acts, opinions, etc.) to causes that superficially seem reasonable and valid but that actually are unrelated to the true, possibly unconscious and often less creditable or agreeable causes. 2. to remove unreasonable elements from. 3. to make rational or conformable to reason. 4. to treat or explain in a rational or rationalistic manner.

 

[Texx]

To quote, from Websters:

–verb (used with object) 1. to ascribe (one's acts, opinions, etc.) to causes that superficially seem reasonable and valid but that actually are unrelated to the true, possibly unconscious and often less creditable or agreeable causes. 2. to remove unreasonable elements from. 3. to make rational or conformable to reason. 4. to treat or explain in a rational or rationalistic manner.

yawn..

 

[ohplease!]

Honestly, I don't see the contradiction. I could be missing something here, but what did you mean here?

It's not in the financial interests of ASA/SKYW to train pilots with the intention of furloughing them. I don't think that this action had any overt malice towards the pilot group. Am I wrong here?

well then, step back and take a deep breath...I'll wait..........ok, better?

Now, if you feel that the company did everything they could and put off furloughs as long as possible and laid off a few as possible, then by all accounts, even yours, everything has been done that could have been done.

There was always open time before (forever) and there was no problem with people picking it up.....if everything has been done to soften this blow....and even according to you it has....then why should picking up open time now be any different than before? Its not going to bring anyone back any sooner than they would have gotten back anyway.

It will just fall to RES first then JM next and if that doesn't get it, it'll get canceled which directly affects our performance/reliability and that will directly affect future flying (negatively) and they may NEVER get back. possibly even being joined on the street by more of our fellow ASAers.

BTW, if you do see a list, what will you do? vandalize their car/home/bag/mail box? punch them out? What?

 

[Tarzan]

I have always picked up time to ensure I could feed my children on put food on the table. If you want to call me on, you're more than welcome to but last time I checked, you weren't paying my bills. I'm sorry if I sound callous because I am not. I know how it goes when a job is lost and your back is against the wall wondering how you're going to feed your kids and keep a roof over their heads. Sorry but the only one out there ensuring these things are done is me.

I don't see ASA keeping guys laid off when we are struggling to make on time numbers that are crew related. I for one am going to do my part to keep this company going forward and not resort to hurting the company just to show them. It only hurts me, you and the guys getting furloughed.