AS Furlough Mitigation

[Baze]

Pay no attention to them huarache sandal-wearin' surfer dudes from La La Land.

All kidding aside, next Thursday is a perfect opportunity for SEA FOs to attend the meeting for the election of the new FO rep. This is our chance to make improvements to our LEC. If you have the day off, go to the meeting and vote.

 

[Going2Baja]

Baja,

Beware of pidgeonholeing all sea pilots....or we may start doing the same to u.

I apologize...I should aim this at the SEA LEC. I know most of you are more interested in your snow blowers and lake boats than your protection of fellow employee's jobs and families. J/K...had to razz Baze a little!!

Baja.

 

[Ih8AFYesmen]

Let's not all get hasty and vote in another bandaid. Make sure ya'll read and understand the ENTIRE MOU. This MOU does NOT guarantee "no further furloughs". I don't mind dropping down to even 70 hours if it means that we will get everyone back/prevent further furloughs, but this doesn't sound good from what I've read so far.

 

[Snapshot]

With that said, as one with his head on the chopping block, I do not yet like the MOU that is going out to memrat to supposedly mitigate 30 of the 54 furloughs.

These changes are supposed to be "temporary", but they will set a precedent and the company will want to make them permanent.

Plus, this MOU is going to do NOTHING to bring back the 60 who have been cut loose already.

Baze

It says in black and white that it will save 30 guys. It also is very clear that, at the absolute longest, it dies in a little over a year. True, it does nothing to save the 60 already out there, that'll be up to us individually.
The lines will still be built to 83 hours. The only real QOL I see is that you'll have to work a little harder to find someone to trade with pilot-to-pilot instead of Second Step. Small price to pay to save 30 families, if you ask me.

Gotta say I'm a little surprised. I figured this would have a bare minimum of 30 yes votes. To think that you'd sacrifice your job so that VSA guys can still get 150% blows my mind. I applaud your thinking long term, but submit that this is a short term proposal that will help bridge the gap till the 65ers are out.

Cheers.

 

[Tatoosh65]

Looks like a small sacrifice to me. Very small.
Tatoosh

 

[Baze]

snapshot,

Thanks for the response. I appreciate your thoughts on this matter. Mind you, my post came after the first time I read the MOU. I've read over it a couple more times since then and discussed it with others.

I voted for it last night.
Only time will tell whether this MOU is going to help this pilot group, especially those on furlough. I hope the MEC has figured out their next 10 moves in this chess game.

It says in black and white that it will save 30 guys. It also is very clear that, at the absolute longest, it dies in a little over a year. True, it does nothing to save the 60 already out there, that'll be up to us individually.
The lines will still be built to 83 hours. The only real QOL I see is that you'll have to work a little harder to find someone to trade with pilot-to-pilot instead of Second Step. Small price to pay to save 30 families, if you ask me.

Gotta say I'm a little surprised. I figured this would have a bare minimum of 30 yes votes. To think that you'd sacrifice your job so that VSA guys can still get 150% blows my mind. I applaud your thinking long term, but submit that this is a short term proposal that will help bridge the gap till the 65ers are out.

Cheers.

 

[Going2Baja]

It says in black and white that it will save 30 guys. It also is very clear that, at the absolute longest, it dies in a little over a year. True, it does nothing to save the 60 already out there, that'll be up to us individually.
The lines will still be built to 83 hours. The only real QOL I see is that you'll have to work a little harder to find someone to trade with pilot-to-pilot instead of Second Step. Small price to pay to save 30 families, if you ask me.

Gotta say I'm a little surprised. I figured this would have a bare minimum of 30 yes votes. To think that you'd sacrifice your job so that VSA guys can still get 150% blows my mind. I applaud your thinking long term, but submit that this is a short term proposal that will help bridge the gap till the 65ers are out.

Cheers.

Great post! This might have had a chance until the latest negotiators notepad was sent. Why doesn't SEA MEC just say "vote NO" What a crock of $h!t!

Baja.

 

[igneousy2]

What's the problem with the Notepad?...I thought it was good. Perhaps it pushes people away from what you want but that doesn't change the fact that it's true.

I think it's important for people to know that this was not a negotiated for agreement but essentially terms laid out by the company in a take-it or leave-it fashion.

That being said, we can't let our egos decide if we should take this or not...just because it's "take it or leave it" doesn't mean we should leave-it just to make a point.

I'm not sure how I feel about this MOU mostly because as I have never been a line holder, I'm not sure what the ramifications of losing 2nd step trading is.

2nd step trading to me means one more week of waiting for my schedule.

What does the elimination of 2nd step trading mean to a line holder? Why is that superior to picking up open flying during 1st step or after the bids are closed?

As far as I can tell from the MOU there are really only two things we are giving up...max down to 80-83...and no 2nd step. Where is the "major changes to the QOL and pay sections" of our contract? Is it the training and vacation calculations? How much different does this change those calculations?

I usually don't go by what I hear on the line but some of the reactions have been over the top and I feel like I am missing something beyond what amounts to a 2-5 hour adjustment to the monthly maximum and one less trading period (a step in the right direction in my opinion but that's a whole other thread).

What am I missing? What are the major changes to QOL that I am just not reading in the MOU?

 

[Old School 737]

I don't like giving up 2nd step and I can see guys being pissed about it but I am voting for it cause I think it's the right thing to do and its not like we are giving up that much and its not forever! I hope! When are we going to find about the early outs?

 

[dashtrash]

The foot stamping and crying over the 2nd step is not what they care about at all. They love to say "I don't VSA" but take it away and the true colors fly. I don't think the company realized how well they could have broken us during a strike. They know now!

 

[Ih8AFYesmen]

After a long hard look at this thing, I voted for this MOU. It's an "effort" at keeping 30 people on the property in these bad economic times. I don't trust our company, but it's an opportunity to do the right thing IMHO.

 

[Old School 737]

I hear that we did not get the min 25 guys to take early out but that tomarrow the company and union is sitting down to discuss letting the ones that want to go,
go any way.

 

[Going2Baja]

I don't like giving up 2nd step and I can see guys being pissed about it but I am voting for it cause I think it's the right thing to do and its not like we are giving up that much and its not forever! I hope! When are we going to find about the early outs?

Word today was 21 or 22 takers. The rules stated no less than 25 and no more than 30. However, Beck said in front of 30 pilots inc. Kemp & LAX CP that he would accept down to 18 and up to 40...Let's see if he keeps his word. The LAX LEC was also there. I think this needs to be passed on to MEC and make sure that there is pressure placed on the CO if they try to back out of this.

As for 2nd step - I was a line holder for a year and I did like the 2nd step. It was one more chance to better your sched. But since it's seniority based, I rarely got any trades I asked for. If I were a line holder now this would NOT be a deal breaker for me.

Ih8afyesmen said it the best : "It's an "effort" at keeping 30 people on the property in these bad economic times. I don't trust our company, but it's an opportunity to do the right thing IMHO."

I voted proudly "YES!"

Baja.

 

[eskimopilot]

What is truly sad is that a MOU is needed at all. With our fellow pilots on the street why do we need something in writing that tells us what we all should be doing already?
Ah that's right. This is the pilot group that includes those that brought us the B-Scale, industry averaged pay and arbitrated contracts. Nice.

 

[Chief Pilot]

I voted YES and I hope at least 51% do the right thing and vote for this MOU.