APA: "unprecedented"; CALALPA: "ops normal"

[ualdriver]

In what way can any pilot waive the contract? It is one thing to pick up your version of overtime WITHIN THE CONTRACT but how can you just unilaterally waive contractual provisions and protections?

Lots of ways. For example, our contract limits the length of our duty day if we have a very early show. There's nothing in the FAR's that necessarily restricts our duty day, but our contract does. If the weather gets bad as the day progresses and that contractual duty day looks like its going to be exceeded even though it may be legal per FAR's, some guys will "waive" that provision of the contract with the crew desk to "help out." It's bull, but they do it.

We have a minimum rest rule on ANY layover of 9 hours "behind the hotel room door," even though the FAR's may require less rest. Some guys will waive that 9 hours behind the door to "help out" or for some sort of reward later in their trip.

There's two off the top of my head. There are more, and despite our management's behavior, we have some whores who can't help out enough. And some of these guys were flying overtime when we had guys on the street, which is just about as low as it gets.

It's funny, too, because when you confront these idiots, they get very defensive. Usually, the answer for their behavior has something to do with hating ALPA for reason x,y, and/or z. But when you say, "OK, I understand you're mad with ALPA for reason x, but what are you doing to express your displeasure with our management team's behavior?" you're met with a deafening silence.

 

[densoo]

We have a minimum rest rule on ANY layover of 9 hours "behind the hotel room door," even though the FAR's may require less rest.

Nine hours in the room?! CAL is absolute FAR, block to block, no matter how much time it takes to get hotel transport to or from airport, no matter what irregularities may occur at the hotel checkin (sorry, rooms aren't ready), no matter when the vans run (sorry, you'll have to leave early, vans only run every thirty minutes, and they're usually late to boot). All of these delays get sucked out of crew rest. Do you still get crew meals of some kind, too?

 

[ualdriver]

Nine hours in the room?! CAL is absolute FAR, block to block, no matter how much time it takes to get hotel transport to or from airport, no matter what irregularities may occur at the hotel checkin (sorry, rooms aren't ready), no matter when the vans run (sorry, you'll have to leave early, vans only run every thirty minutes, and they're usually late to boot). All of these delays get sucked out of crew rest. Do you still get crew meals of some kind, too?

Yes, we get crew meals. We can pick what type of crew meals we want too (i.e. regular, vegetarian, light choice chicken or fish, even hindu for pete's sake among several others!) What a great contract we have!

The 9 hours "behind the door" that we have is a good part of our contract. When we arrive in our room, we just call the crew desk and say I just got here, add 9 hours, and tell them we'll be in the lobby available for pick-up at that time. Since the vans at most hotels only run on the hour and half-hour and our company is too cheap to pay for other transportation, we usually get a little extra time from that, too.

That's the way I think the FAR's for minimum rest need to be written. Not a minimum "block to block" rest, but a minimum rest IN YOUR PLACE OF REST.

 

[waveflyer]

again- what happens when you refuse?

 

[ualdriver]

again- what happens when you refuse?

deleted

 

[Patriot328]

If you are a line-holder, don't answer the phone. How tough is that? Don't expose yourself to reassignments.

Not even that. Even if you do answer, just tell them you are unavailable. I'll be d*mned if I get JM'd off of a phone call....

 

[densoo]

again- what happens when you refuse?

I don't think it is a matter of "if you refuse" or if you call in fatigued because you've been used right up the FARs. Sure, you can refuse, and many do, more all the time. For the individual, this is always a choice--and a requirement not to fly fatigued.

As a management technique though, letting the pilot group know that they'll be seeing the CP for refusing a legal pairing or calling in fatigued has it's intended affect. Some folks just don't want to go through the hastle. "You are hereby requested to see the company doctor on mm/dd/yy because there obviously must be a physical and mental problem if you can't work under FAA guidelines" is a fairly effective stick that, unfortunately, is an authorized method of harassment. The CP's formal letter of request for "notes from your doctor" requiring justification for why a pilot called in sick between Thanksgiving and Christmas is an annual rite. Again, both legal and an instrument of harassment at CAL.

 

[Dewey Oxberger]

Nine hours in the room?! CAL is absolute FAR, block to block, no matter how much time it takes to get hotel transport to or from airport, no matter what irregularities may occur at the hotel checkin (sorry, rooms aren't ready), no matter when the vans run (sorry, you'll have to leave early, vans only run every thirty minutes, and they're usually late to boot). All of these delays get sucked out of crew rest. Do you still get crew meals of some kind, too?

Not true, we get 9:15 minimum block to block rest. Still inadequate but 30 minutes better than the FARs.

 

[densoo]

Not true, we get 9:15 minimum block to block rest. Still inadequate but 30 minutes better than the FARs.

Yep. Thanks.