Any new ABX info?

[Box-Hauler]

My point is that we need to make sure we limit any "special" scheduling ability, instead of focusing on the 76 N/S lines. My original point was to prove a problem with side letters. We need a drop dead point written into any side letter that gives a variance of any contract clause.

It is great that some people like the N/S lines on the 76. What if it was the other way around and it was a bad deal to get a Non-Standard line. Would we still have guys winning about those of us questioning the N/S scheduling ability, I think not.

Lets stay focused on the big picture and not just our own deals that we have made work for us. The big picture is ANA special schedules. We need a drop dead cluase to force the company to either meet current scheduling paramaters or renegotiate at that drop dead point. The point could be whatever we want, number of crews doing ANA work, # Aircraft flying ANA stuff, or even a calandar date.

We got lucky with the Non-Standard schedules on the 76, will we be lucky on the ANA deal, and do we want to risk it all to luck and the company's warn heart to ensure a livable schedule?

 

[Clipperskip]

The Big Picture

My point is that we need to make sure we limit any "special" scheduling ability, instead of focusing on the 76 N/S lines. My original point was to prove a problem with side letters. We need a drop dead point written into any side letter that gives a variance of any contract clause.

It is great that some people like the N/S lines on the 76. What if it was the other way around and it was a bad deal to get a Non-Standard line. Would we still have guys winning about those of us questioning the N/S scheduling ability, I think not.

Lets stay focused on the big picture and not just our own deals that we have made work for us. The big picture is ANA special schedules. We need a drop dead cluase to force the company to either meet current scheduling paramaters or renegotiate at that drop dead point. The point could be whatever we want, number of crews doing ANA work, # Aircraft flying ANA stuff, or even a calandar date.

We got lucky with the Non-Standard schedules on the 76, will we be lucky on the ANA deal, and do we want to risk it all to luck and the company's warn heart to ensure a livable schedule?

Your right Box Hauler. Let's keep our eye on the ball and look well beyond our DC-9 racetracks and our 767non-standard lines. What concerns me is the fact that once the company has enough airplanes in KIX to make an Asian crew domicile feasable then all scheduling parameters revert back to 13D. How would you like to be responsible for your transportation to KIX with one block of 7 work days then days off followed by another block of 8work days. It would be practically uncommutable. If you listened to our Negotiation Chairman in the last conference call he indicated that it was a definite possibility to see 13D scheduling once the Asian operation grows large enough. Hopefully International Operations language in our next contract would save us from this kind of nightmare. Read any T/A carefully the Devil is in the details.

 

[Box-Hauler]

On a related scheduling subject. Why do we not ask for the ability to build our own lines. A computer could easily build us any line we like.

i.e. I want to fly ever tues, wed, thur. for the whole month. As long as I fly for 15 or 16 days (month dependent) why does the company care. The company gets their coveted "productivity" and the crews get control of their lives.

To counter the senior guys arguments you (senior guys) will still get to fly where and when you want. This would fix a lot of the MLB (make line better, sick calls) that fall on some schedules. It would also save the company countless man hours of schedulers making, sorting, and awarding lines. The crews productivity will go up. You will fly when you want to. This is safer, more cost effective and more productive. Why can we not negotiate for this..........

KlipperSkip makes an excellent point. What happens if the NIX (Japan) domicile opens and they revert to the 2 bocks of work a month. With a build it yourself schedule you could decide when to fly and when to commute. This would make ILN, MIA and NIX all better domiciles.

Just a thought, any reason not to want this.............

 

[MJH767]

I talked to the chairman of the scheduling committee a while back about the "preferential bidding" system. He thought the company would be the one pushing for that. I am no sceduling expert, but he said it's not all rosey. Some people can build their perfect schedule, others take what's left over.
As far as the N/S lines I'm all for puting it into the contract, but it appears to me its a matter of whose ox is getting gored. You all don't want anyone messing with your favorite lines to make mine more desirable, don't be so surprised that I feel the same way.

 

[GoABX]

Computer based scheduling/access is not the same as Preferential Bidding System.

 

[jdflyer51]

Ta

One thing is certain we need to have plenty of time to look at this agreement to decide if we want it or not. We definitely do not want an expedited vote like last time. I can see management using ANA as an excuse to hurry it through. We really need to look at the language. Mr Starkovich is a master at turning our own words against us.

 

[ABXbooger]

ANA Skeds are out. look at the company webpage under flight schedules, click on charters. Kind of hard to understand.

 

[nitefr8dog]

I talked to the chairman of the scheduling committee a while back about the "preferential bidding" system. He thought the company would be the one pushing for that. I am no sceduling expert, but he said it's not all rosey. Some people can build their perfect schedule, others take what's left over.
As far as the N/S lines I'm all for puting it into the contract, but it appears to me its a matter of whose ox is getting gored. You all don't want anyone messing with your favorite lines to make mine more desirable, don't be so surprised that I feel the same way.

MJ, as far as ours or yours goes the nine is going away so your lines become our lines and we get the leftovers.

 

[Box-Hauler]

Computer based scheduling/access is not the same as Preferential Bidding System.

I do realize that there is a difference in the two systems. The common thread is that we would use a computer and not have to wait for someone is scheduling to answer a phone. Then after they answer hope they are in a good mood to approve your request. A computer is simple (does it meet the paramaters for a trade Y/N, if yes trade approved.)

There is a lot of options that we are not even touching on to make our lives a little easier.

 

[erichartmann]

On a related scheduling subject. Why do we not ask for the ability to build our own lines. A computer could easily build us any line we like.

i.e. I want to fly ever tues, wed, thur. for the whole month. As long as I fly for 15 or 16 days (month dependent) why does the company care. The company gets their coveted "productivity" and the crews get control of their lives.

To counter the senior guys arguments you (senior guys) will still get to fly where and when you want. This would fix a lot of the MLB (make line better, sick calls) that fall on some schedules. It would also save the company countless man hours of schedulers making, sorting, and awarding lines. The crews productivity will go up. You will fly when you want to. This is safer, more cost effective and more productive. Why can we not negotiate for this..........

KlipperSkip makes an excellent point. What happens if the NIX (Japan) domicile opens and they revert to the 2 bocks of work a month. With a build it yourself schedule you could decide when to fly and when to commute. This would make ILN, MIA and NIX all better domiciles.

Just a thought, any reason not to want this.............

In the orginal 1996 T/A agreement (rejected by the e-board prior to any vote by the membership) the negotiating committee had agreeded to a system wherein the union would build the lines based on the pairings provided by the company. Unfortunately, the language allowed the company to take full control with few protections for the members if the resulting lines of time did not meet certain parameters for productivity. The negotiating committee failed to realize that the company could easily control the resulting lines of time utilizing the pairings.