Another mandatory ASA letter from Tutt

[atlcrjdriver]

ASA Master Executive Council
August 30th, 2006
NEGOTIATIONS UPDATE

…
Upon receiving management’s proposal we began to evaluate it and we are considering what our response will be. As a general overview, the proposal did show some movement from management’s last position. However, they still failed to address many of the issues that are open. The Association is working late into the evening to prepare a response.

Mgmnt has posted its latest proposal for us to evaluate. I would agree with the CNC that some movement has been made but I would also like to read what the response was from our CNC to help shed some light on why negotiations remain parked.

And no, I am not going to dig up a P2P for this information. I would simply like to read it for myself and draw my own conclusions.

 

["GO AROUND"]

GoAround, you are a P2P and your information conflicts with the ALPA update email we got. The ALPA Connection email says that we did counter with a counter offer. Could you confirm that? If so, can we see the counter offer?

It was my understanding that they are working on putting it out to counter the company's claims. They also said that at the end of the Connection email. I would assume it will be like the last Negotiators notepad in email form.

The butt of it is, the mediator wanted giant steps to close the gap and the company is taking baby steps if any steps at all. The CNC/MEC has told the company and mediator that they will respond in kind to movement made by the company. That's hard to do when the company shows this kind of movement.

There are parts of sections that the company won't address. Most importantly in Section 1.

Underblock pay is a huge paycut for those like me doing naps or those underblock for the month.

 

[atlcrjdriver]

Be it big steps or little steps as long as there is movement towards to common goal of getting it done. I would still like to read what ALPA sent to the mediator/company.

GA, Why hasn't the CNC posted the response?

 

[ohplease!]

Be it big steps or little steps as long as there is movement towards to common goal of getting it done. I would still like to read what ALPA sent to the mediator/company.

GA, Why hasn't the CNC posted the response?

its on a need to know basis and ALPA says you don't need to know. They know whats best for you...you're not smart enough to think for yourself...just keep repeating...my cnc/mec speaks for me...click your heels together three times with your eyes closed and you'll wake up somewhere in Kansas with the best contract ever and you're gonna be RICH and not even have to come to work. Just stay home, play all day and the company will mail you your check.

 

[ASADriver]

It was my understanding that they are working on putting it out to counter the company's claims. They also said that at the end of the Connection email. I would assume it will be like the last Negotiators notepad in email form.

The butt of it is, the mediator wanted giant steps to close the gap and the company is taking baby steps if any steps at all. The CNC/MEC has told the company and mediator that they will respond in kind to movement made by the company. That's hard to do when the company shows this kind of movement.

There are parts of sections that the company won't address. Most importantly in Section 1.

Underblock pay is a huge paycut for those like me doing naps or those underblock for the month.

Sounds like more conflicting information from ALPA. Was there a counter offer and if so, what was it. The membership has the right to know.

 

[ASADriver]

its on a need to know basis and ALPA says you don't need to know. They know whats best for you...you're not smart enough to think for yourself...just keep repeating...my cnc/mec speaks for me...click your heels together three times with your eyes closed and you'll wake up somewhere in Kansas with the best contract ever and you're gonna be RICH and not even have to come to work. Just stay home, play all day and the company will mail you your check.

BINGO - waiting for my decoder ring to decifer the next secret message from ALPA.

 

[atlcrjdriver]

I guess the response was tied around the secret squirrels neck. You find it and you find the CNCs response.

 

[ASADriver]

I just got the Connection email. I don't see ANY movement from ALPA, and even they admit that management moved. They just don't think management moved enough. Why isn't ALPA moving?

 

[PCL_128]

I just got the Connection email. I don't see ANY movement from ALPA, and even they admit that management moved. They just don't think management moved enough. Why isn't ALPA moving?

Here's a thought: call your status rep and ask him instead of whining on flightinfo.

 

[Bizjet]

I just got the Connection email. I don't see ANY movement from ALPA, and even they admit that management moved. They just don't think management moved enough. Why isn't ALPA moving?

Because for three years ALPA was making movement to keep the process moving. At that time the company's movement was limited to punctuation changes and sentence structure. Don't forget that Jerry Atkin said that Delta in 2002 had ordered management at ASA to drag out these negotiations as much as possible. With Bill Hiers in the room that meant to take only and give nothing in return. So get your head out of your a$$ and pay attention. If you are in management, as I suspect, getting your head out of your a$$ is not an option so just crawl back under your favorite rock and hibernate.

Our three years of movement has now gotten us this far it is the company's turn to show good faith or we will shut it down in the traveling public's best interest!

 

[Richard Gozinya]

We are done negotiating with your mec. ASA pilots are the worst I have ever worked with.

Hey Scottie,

Try throwing some coffee at me! That would just make my 4 years!

Dick

 

[COOPERVANE]

"Our three years of movement has now gotten us this far it is the company's turn to show good faith or we will shut it down"

Yes but WHEN for god's sake?

 

[atlcrjdriver]

"After we presented our counter, we broke into caucus. Shortly
thereafter, the mediator informed us that the parties were still too
far apart, and that he saw no need to schedule any further
mediated sessions. We remain in a "recessed" status as far as
the NMB is concerned."​

Again, why can't the rank and file read the counter?​

 

[ASADriver]

"After we presented our counter, we broke into caucus. Shortly
thereafter, the mediator informed us that the parties were still too
far apart, and that he saw no need to schedule any further
mediated sessions. We remain in a "recessed" status as far as
the NMB is concerned."

Again, why can't the rank and file read the counter?​

Let's see, the company isn't afraid to publish it's offer, why is ALPA afraid to publish the counter offer?

 

[ASADriver]

Here's a thought: call your status rep and ask him instead of whining on flightinfo.

Here's a thought - mind your own business and get to work on improving your contract. It is far worse than our current contract.

 

[atrdriver]

Let's see, the company isn't afraid to publish it's offer, why is ALPA afraid to publish the counter offer?

My understanding is that the company offered from 1/4 for 1/2 of 1 percent raise on the 70, so the union gave the same amount up in the counter. Why do you think that the company isn't "afraid" to publish their "proposal"? Maybe because they are trying to split the pilot group? Through polling data and conversations with the pilots the MEC and CNC know what the majority of this pilot group wants, and that is what they are trying to achieve. It's really not that hard of a concept to figure out.

And you you really believe that when our 50 seat rate is topped out we should be making 7 or 8/h less than the Skywest 50 pilots? I don't.

 

[ASARJMan]

Let's see, the company isn't afraid to publish it's offer, why is ALPA afraid to publish the counter offer?

There's a letter out from the MEC Driver explaining why we did not agree to the company's proposal. Have you read it? Or, are you even able to, being the management clown that you are, maybe you don't have that access now do you. That's ok. King Tutt will be in the crew lounge next week to explain it to you, if you're even a pilot.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[ASARJMan]

Here's a thought - mind your own business and get to work on improving your contract. It is far worse than our current contract.

I believe he works at ASA you whining management clown.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[ASADriver]

My understanding is that the company offered from 1/4 for 1/2 of 1 percent raise on the 70, so the union gave the same amount up in the counter. Why do you think that the company isn't "afraid" to publish their "proposal"? Maybe because they are trying to split the pilot group? Through polling data and conversations with the pilots the MEC and CNC know what the majority of this pilot group wants, and that is what they are trying to achieve. It's really not that hard of a concept to figure out.

And you you really believe that when our 50 seat rate is topped out we should be making 7 or 8/h less than the Skywest 50 pilots? I don't.

But the 70 seat rate is much higher than Skywests. Put the information out and let us make up our own minds. If putting out simple information splits up the pilot group, then there is a problem. That means we aren't as unified as some think we are.

 

[ASADriver]

I believe he works at ASA you whining management clown.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

PCL_128 is a Pinnacle pilot who paid to sit in the right seat at Gulfstream. He needs to mind his own business. We wouldn't have this problem if people like him didn't actually pay money to be FOs at places like Gulfstream.

 

[homerjdispatch]

The offer doesn't look bad to me. I would like to see better scope. The fact that we were parked again leads me to believe ALPA is still out in left field on their proposal.

By the way, the union says that those 90 seaters were never coming to ASA. If that is so, then why do they have EV N#s? Those of us in SLC are taxing past these EV 90 seaters everyday. I believe they were coming to ASA.

Voice...You are wrong...the 900's is SLC have SK tail numbers. First two on property were 800SK and 802SK. Get your facts right!!!

 

[ASARJMan]

But the 70 seat rate is much higher than Skywests. Put the information out and let us make up our own minds. If putting out simple information splits up the pilot group, then there is a problem. That means we aren't as unified as some think we are.

Skywest does not have a 70 rate. They fly the 70 for the same rate as the 50. Clown.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[PCL_128]

Here's a thought - mind your own business and get to work on improving your contract. It is far worse than our current contract.

Your contract does affect my contract and our negotiating leverage. What goes on at ASA is the business of every RJ driver in the country. You don't live in a vacuum. The actions that you take on this contract will affect all of us in the regional industry for years to come.

 

[ASADriver]

Skywest does not have a 70 rate. They fly the 70 for the same rate as the 50. Clown.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

Does Mesa have a 70 seat rate? How does it compare to Skywests non rate? Does UPS have a 747 rate? Does FedEx have an MD11 rate?

 

[ASADriver]

Your contract does affect my contract and our negotiating leverage. What goes on at ASA is the business of every RJ driver in the country. You don't live in a vacuum. The actions that you take on this contract will affect all of us in the regional industry for years to come.

Non of us live in a vacuum. The fact that you paid a company to be an airline pilot has affected all of us in the regional industry for years to come.

 

[ASARJMan]

Does Mesa have a 70 seat rate? How does it compare to Skywests non rate? Does UPS have a 747 rate? Does FedEx have an MD11 rate?

Don't know whiny boy. But, I do know that ASA has a 50 and a 70 rate, and we ain't giving that up. And a 1/4 of a percent pay increase ain't gonna hack it either. I want some mo money to fly the 700 damn it! Some COL is in order Driver. Take that back to BL, CT, SH, or whomever you report to you management clown.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[601Pilot]

601 you are ready for 100% paycut right! Smart ask the Northwest MX at the bar, hows life?

Okay, I guess I won't go get another job. I'll just sit around the bar drinking; come on! Most of us could/can find a job pretty quickly if needed. If ASA is your only option, then you are definitely in trouble.

 

[John Pennekamp]

90%??? 25% either voted no, or didn't vote at all. Some who voted yes, have said it was a mistake and they wish they could change their vote. 90% is a stretch there JP.

Wilson polling. Y'all are stuck on that strike vote. Charlie and Brian must be running around the GO like parrots talking about how we only got 92%.

 

[John Pennekamp]

The offer doesn't look bad to me. I would like to see better scope. The fact that we were parked again leads me to believe ALPA is still out in left field on their proposal.

By the way, the union says that those 90 seaters were never coming to ASA. If that is so, then why do they have EV N#s? Those of us in SLC are taxing past these EV 90 seaters everyday. I believe they were coming to ASA.

Well, well, it's the older girlfriend! Hi Lynn!

A concessionary offer wouldn't look bad to a self serving [female dog] like yourself! After all, you sold us out for training reimbursement on the last contract. Where's your little boy toy been... haven't heard him whining lately.

 

[John Pennekamp]

The 3.75 min day would cover that. If you have one of those 3 or 4 day trips that has a day in the hotel, you would get 3.75 hours for that day.

And that's an improvement... how? Looks like 18+ credit for a 4 day trip. Whoopee!