AMR pilots; how many on furlough, when do you expect recalls to start?

[furloughfodder]

AA wants to implement a preferential bid process. Some think that would eliminate the need for about 500 pilot positions. This will be another test of the "pliability" of the AA pilots' union.

Recalls? My guess is at least another 18 months before a very slow recall starts.

It was my understanding that the APA was pushing for Pref Bidding. I also understand the APA has offered AA numerous "pre-emptive" concessions packages. Is this at all true?

 

[80drvr]

It was my understanding that the APA was pushing for Pref Bidding. I also understand the APA has offered AA numerous "pre-emptive" concessions packages. Is this at all true?

Yes. APA is the France of labor unions...conceding before negotiations even start.

There is a lot of grass roots dissension growing, so one can only hope that the line pilot takes this union back from the current group of management apologists.

 

[aa73]

It was my understanding that the APA was pushing for Pref Bidding. I also understand the APA has offered AA numerous "pre-emptive" concessions packages. Is this at all true?

\

No. Let's call it like it is. The APA Leadership has been pushing for PBS, amongst other pre-emptive concessions. The membership is highly against PBS and more concessions, and I can tell you right now that anything offered will most likely be voted down. Especially with the "rosy"outlook for '06 and beyond. Especially because we should be starting contract openers sometime this year. Especially because AMR has proven that they can be profitable at $60/barrel and our current contract. Hunter and his cronies are flying kites if they think this thing will pass.

 

[AA717driver]

APA has been "pushing" PB to the extent that it doesn't affect recalls. PB itself will only reduce staffing by 1% due to eliminating conflicts over the end of bid periods.

The real killer to recalls would be "demand staffing" or whatever it's called by AA. That allows reserves to pick up open time on their days off and get paid above guarantee. Lineholders can do the same but the real effeciency comes in when there is no open time to assign to reserves on their available days because the open time has been picked up already.

Reserve goes senior, reserve staffing is reduced fewer trips end up uncovered so line holders are reassigned to cover them. Overall, QOL for the pilot group is enhanced.

If you don't want to be on reserve, you don't have to (unless you're super junior). If you don't want to pick up open time, you don't have to (and often, there is none available). You end up flying your trips as published because CCS isn't jerking you off your pairing to cover their lack of reserves (even though 30% of the pilots are on reserve).

That's why this is only a good thing if you have no one on furlough.

APA's leadership is trying to be creative in gaining better QOL for the pilots and be more effecient so the company can't make a case for coming after pay and bennies. They are stuck between that and the 3000 guys on the street. I don't know if it'll work. I don't trust AMR's management to not come after pay and bennies even if the union agrees to be more effecient.

I have no dog in the fight anymore. I'll either bypass until I can retire or I'll bypass until I can hold a line as CA in STL (near age 60...). I hope recalls happen soon so those who are in crap jobs or AE can return.TC

 

[ksu_aviator]

OK Kit Darby Junior

At least he looks at things with a positive attitude.

I'm betting you voted for Kerry? Am I right?

 

[DrProc]

At least he looks at things with a positive attitude.

I'm betting you voted for Kerry? Am I right?

No, Kit Darby is selling. All he is, is a salesman. And the number one thing that Kit Darby is selling is himself, that's what all salesmen do. Sure they are selling a product, but more importantly he is selling himself selling the product. He could make a poopy flavored popsicle sound appetizing.

 

[satpak77]

At least he looks at things with a positive attitude.

I'm betting you voted for Kerry? Am I right?

ok I am sorry, let me get Mr. Trolley out, here he comes, choo choo, its a wonderful day in the neighborhood, everything is great, the birds are singing, hello Mr. Birdee, tweet tweet, about 5000 guys are furloughed majors+regional pilots combined

won't you be my neighbor

Kerry? What does he have to do with things? ?!?!?!

 

[Andy]

about 5000 guys are furloughed majors+regional pilots combined

Satpak, you're an eternal optomist. I think that the number's much higher.
If AMR's 2800+
UAL's ~1800
USAirways' ~2000
DAL not sure; I think that they're ~1000
NWAC not sure; I think that they're ~600

That's 8200 or so with just those airlines. Anyone feel free to jump in and correct the numbers above along with adding to the body count.
But don't worry; I'm sure that Kit Darby will tell us that 2006 will be the best year ever for pilot hiring.

 

[satpak77]

Satpak, you're an eternal optomist. I think that the number's much higher.
If AMR's 2800+
UAL's ~1800
USAirways' ~2000
DAL not sure; I think that they're ~1000
NWAC not sure; I think that they're ~600

That's 8200 or so with just those airlines. Anyone feel free to jump in and correct the numbers above along with adding to the body count.
But don't worry; I'm sure that Kit Darby will tell us that 2006 will be the best year ever for pilot hiring.

Holy smokes batman, thats worse than Kit Darby told me

I am sure however that the neighborhood will improve soon and the Trolley will be tooting his horn soon

Don't forget, we can always "get a job" with FedEx or UPS or if we "want", we can "go to" Southwest

yes yes thats it, more cool-aid! The hiring outlook is great!

Stay Positive!

 

[JohnDoe]

quote:
"At least he looks at things with a positive attitude."



Oh come on....wake up. He looks at things with dollar signs in his eyes, pure and simple.

You need to read Andy's post about 30 times, then maybe it will sink in. And while you are doing it, add the soon-to-be-furloughed guys from several regionals to the list of 8000-9000 furloughed. Aren't the regionals the place where all the hiring is supposed to be??

 

[satpak77]

quote:
"At least he looks at things with a positive attitude."



Oh come on....wake up. He looks at things with dollar signs in his eyes, pure and simple.

You need to read Andy's post about 30 times, then maybe it will sink in. And while you are doing it, add the soon-to-be-furloughed guys from several regionals to the list of 8000-9000 furloughed. Aren't the regionals the place where all the hiring is supposed to be??

aw come on, be positive

AA FO's are running at 18 years before Captain

be positive

 

[GogglesPisano]

I'm really tired of these types of remarks. Get over it! It was a down turn and not the end of the world! If you want to look for the negative in everything than you'll find it very difficult to get a job.

The majors and legacies may not be interviewing everyone that throws in an app, but then again, it isn't an entitlement. If you want a job with a major, go earn it. But don't come on here to cry and whine about how bad everything is and whoa is me bs. You all sound like little children. If you can't have it now, you are going to throw a fit. Well grow up.

You're lecturing guys on furlough about being pessimistic? You've got some brass ones, buddy.

Now feel free to go back to your regularly-programmed, Air Inc dream-job-is-just-around-the-corner-if-your-motivated catatonic delusion.

 

[satpak77]

KSU is counting Gulfstream's PFT program as "hiring"

BE POSITIVE!!! THINGS ARE GREAT!!!

 

[EAP]

I'm really tired of these types of remarks. Get over it! It was a down turn and not the end of the world! If you want to look for the negative in everything than you'll find it very difficult to get a job.

The majors and legacies may not be interviewing everyone that throws in an app, but then again, it isn't an entitlement. If you want a job with a major, go earn it. But don't come on here to cry and whine about how bad everything is and whoa is me bs. You all sound like little children. If you can't have it now, you are going to throw a fit. Well grow up.

This has got to be about the least "enlightened" comment I've seen on this board in a while (that's tough to do if you have a both a brain and a soul that aren't inop). Ever hear of Karma, "bro"?

 

[satpak77]

be positive !!!

go "earn" your major job! wait....8000 people who already did that are on the street...ooops

be postive!

the KSU Aviation department needs the cool-aid for its own self-sustainment

be positive!

Gulfstream is hiring! As is Focus Air! Fly a 747! Oh yeah, FedEx is hiring too!

jobs galore! stop complaining and go "get one"!!!

be positive