Alpa President Starting To Show Signs Of Leadership

[PCL_128]

What exactly are his selfish intrests?

Apparently age-65.

Meanwhile you got 60,000 independent contractors that pay ALPA dues wondering when Prater is going to customize his leadership to each individual whim...

It's not about individual whims. It's about "majority rules." He doesn't seem to get that.

I really wanted to support Prater and I hoped that he could be a good leader. While I personally supported Captain Woerth during the election, after that was over I was determined to put it behind me and stand with Prater. Unfortunately, he's made that impossible. With his complete disregard for the will of the majority, he gets no support from me.

Maybe if he wasn't so focused on this age-65 nonsense for the past 6 months he could have worked closely with the AAA/AWA MECs and come up with a viable solution without arbitration. Instead, we're now stuck with a situation that, at best, will turn into a generation-long dysfunctional pilot group at the "new" USAirways. At worst, this could turn into a viable decertification drive at AAA. Yep, real good leadership.

 

[luckytohaveajob]

Leadership is very important... but you cant have leadership without followership... and right now the ALPA followership suxs hind titty.... worse than the leadership.....

This lack of following you cite over and over indicates that ALPA doesn't connect with it target audience.

The leadership has lost the pilots. ALPA time has come to an end. It is just wasting our time and money and should cease to exist.

When the organization is about continuing the tradition of the organization and not about the pilots any longer it is done. ALPA should die.

Hopefully the EAST will lead the charge and end this dead horse called ALPA.

 

[Wiskey Driver]

This lack of following you cite over and over indicates that ALPA doesn't connect with it target audience.

The leadership has lost the pilots. ALPA time has come to an end. It is just wasting our time and money and should cease to exist.

When the organization is about continuing the tradition of the organization and not about the pilots any longer it is done. ALPA should die.

Hopefully the EAST will lead the charge and end this dead horse.

It can only get better without ALPA.

Incorrect!!,

ALPA is only as srong as it's members and when it's members speak thru resolution policy is formed. If you don't like the policy then you gather your support and make a change! What you don't do is agree to the policy and then scream and kick when said policy doesn't fit your current wants and desires.

The east will lead nothing simply because they incapiable of doing so. The lack the basics of fair play. Their mentaility is one built on selfishness and that foundation is shaky at best.

If you want change then build on what you have and make those changes...

WD.

 

[luckytohaveajob]

Incorrect Whiskey. If the system doesn't allow an opposition voice the system doesn't self correct. ALPA does not self correct as you claim is possible. If it did we would not be in this pit of inaction.

An example of what I am referring to is age 60. The majority opposed the issue for many years now. The leadership disregarded that opposition. When ALPA had the chance to stop age 65 cold, ALPA instead choose the path the leadership wanted to allow age 65 by suppressing the age 60 majority with the bogus information education campaign which allowed the problem to build. And ALPA got what it wanted regardless of all the "kicking a scream" you referred to in your post. ALPA in this example prevented the majority view which it has done for too long now.

ALPA does not represent the pilots anymore. ALPA represents ALPA's interest and if those conflict with the pilots the pilots lose. Again ALPA do not represent it pilots. ALPA represents itself.

It is ignorant to believe that ALPA is an organic self correcting organization. ALPA is a political mess that has failed the pilots for way to long.

Everything has a life cycle and ALPA's has come to it end.

 

[luckytohaveajob]

ALPA's leadership under Duane Worth and John Prater for the last nine years has been to serve ALPA without regard for the pilots it represents.

ALPA has failed to protect the bottom and the top of the profession. ALPA has sacrificed the middle's future forever for a few at the top during the short term during the last five years.

It is going to be very interesting where the EAST goes now and what follows. The consequences for ALPA need to be as harsh as those it has dealt its pilots.

For the last five years ALPA has been remained untouched while every pilot it has represented has taken a beating.

 

[PCL_128]

For the last five years ALPA has been remained untouched while every pilot it has represented has taken a beating.

You really don't have a clue. Untouched? ALPA's staff is drastically reduced from the pre-9/11 days. The current staff are working their asses off to get the work done. ALPA's OCF is practically broke. The EC is considering a big transfer from the MCF (the fund supposed to be used only for strikes and major events like bankruptcies) in order to keep the union running. Every MEC budget has taken a hit this year to keep things solvent. ALPA is hardly "untouched." If it hadn't been for Captain Woerth's leadership along with Captain Beebe's financial expertise, this union would have been bankrupt long ago.

Your anger is misplaced. You should be directing your anger at a man (Darth Prater), not an organization. ALPA is only as strong as the people who volunteer to keep it going. When the wrong people are elected to run the organization, then things aren't going to run smoothly. That's not an inherent problem with the Association, it's just a problem with the people. The solution isn't to commit suicide by destroying your own union; the solution is to put the right people in office when the opportunity rolls around again.

 

[PCL_128]

double post

 

[Wiskey Driver]

ALPA's leadership under Duane Worth and John Prater for the last nine years has been to serve ALPA without regard for the pilots it represents.

ALPA has failed to protect the bottom and the top of the profession. ALPA has sacrificed the middle's future forever for a few at the top during the short term during the last five years.

It is going to be very interesting where the EAST goes now and what follows. The consequences for ALPA need to be as harsh as those it has dealt its pilots.

For the last five years ALPA has been remained untouched while every pilot it has represented has taken a beating.

What I am trying to get you to understand is that change within this union our union comes from us! This union is run by policy thru resolution. If you don't take the time to effect change you are essentially accepting what is. Yes I too was not happy with age 60 and how this was handled. If you are unhappy take it to the pilots in your council and get support, lots of it. Write a resolution and present it at your LEC meeting and demand that your mec champion it to national again building support along the way. Get your EVP on board and to do that your support has to come from other MEC's as well.

It sounds tough but it's not and this is how you effect change within this union. I am telling you this as a member of the ALPA BOD. Change within this union begins with the pilots.

WD.

 

[Shrek]

Hey luckytohaveajob maybe you DO have some solutions.............run for office !!!

What? - you just want to piss and moan and destroy our Union? If you succeed - then what? How bout that medical? How bout that System Board - aww crap just burnt it down. You might as well go to Skybus and try to suck up to MGT long enough to get to the left seat at 65 a year - MAYBE?!

Vote...............Volunteer........or Shut your Hole.

 

[Flopgut]

When I see Prater on camera I expect him to say:

"Then it sounded like a freight train. The trailer next to us just up and disppeared. That's when I knew we best run fer it."

PIPE

Hilarious!

 

[luckytohaveajob]

Your anger is misplaced. You should be directing your anger at a man (Darth Prater), not an organization. ALPA is only as strong as the people who volunteer to keep it going. When the wrong people are elected to run the organization, then things aren't going to run smoothly. That's not an inherent problem with the Association, it's just a problem with the people.

We are in agreement concerning Darth Prater. But the reason I believe the organization is flawed is because it can not be changed.

Try to replace Darth Prater through a recall. It can not be done. How many National Presidents have been replaced in ALPA history? They are not just elected they are groomed for the position. Even though Prater was chosen by the pilots he was groomed upon his arrival to tow the party line.

None from the outside can change the party line. The EVP's and influential MEC's set the tone, no one else period. That's why the organization is in decline. There is no freedom of speech, freedom to change what is wrong, or any ability change the organization away from the power brokers who do not represent the pilots, other than disillusion.

Yes we need a union. We need a national union that represents the pilots interests not the organizations interests. That is not happening today in ALPA. And it will not happen in the future with ALPA.

ALPA is not an organic organization adapting to the needs of the individual pilots. ALPA exists for ALPA's sake not the pilots.

 

[luckytohaveajob]

Darth Prater has got to go. Lets see it happen because I got $100 says it won't in the next year or two.

 

[Flopgut]

What exactly are his selfish intrests?

You can control your followership... and you can only influence the leadership...

As a recent CAL upgrade, I can tell you that without a doubt, Darth Prater's own self interest is seeing to it that his contemporaries, those he will represent as a first priority, see a huge windfall! There are those senior members that he cares about, and then there is everybody else. If you're in the left seat and have 20 years seniority and are facing retirement, the only thing you care about is staying right where you. There is NO other issue really and Prater knows this. They won't fight off overseas control, cabotage, or anthing else! They'll use those things to their own benefit.

He's taking care of who he cares about, while you're falling right into his plan.

Guys: Call your union and ask whether or not financial analysis of age 65 effects is underway. I've learned that it is at CAL and that Prater's minions are working hard to try to make this look less lopsided. It's really ugly.

 

[The Victors]

Didn't you guys just elect this guy? Like 6 months ago?

 

[PCL_128]

Try to replace Darth Prater through a recall. It can not be done.

It cannot be done because everyone is lazy and cowardly. Show me a single resolution that any pilot has brought at any single meeting to remove Darth Prater. Hasn't happened. No one will stand up and take action. That's a fault with the membership, not with the Association.

They are not just elected they are groomed for the position. Even though Prater was chosen by the pilots he was groomed upon his arrival to tow the party line.

Completely incorrect. Prater has set policy in Herndon on Age-65. This wasn't an ALPA position that he was "groomed" to carry out. The EC, EB, and BOD have the ability to set policy and direct the President, but so far, they've only done as he's asked. It seems to me that Prater is the one doing the "grooming" of everyone else.

 

[PCL_128]

Didn't you guys just elect this guy? Like 6 months ago?

The BOD elects the President, not the rank-and-file. There were some very interesting politics (i.e. vote trading) going on at the BOD that resulted in a surprise victory for Prater.

 

[The Victors]

The BOD elects the President, not the rank-and-file. There were some very interesting politics (i.e. vote trading) going on at the BOD that resulted in a surprise victory for Prater.

Thanks. I wasn't sure about that.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

As a recent CAL upgrade,

Congrats !!!

 

[ualdriver]

The leadership disregarded that opposition. When ALPA had the chance to stop age 65 cold, ALPA instead choose the path...............

Could you please point to the specific time in history, along with the supporting verifiable facts, where ALPA had the chance to stop age 65 cold? I'm pretty familiar with the chain of events that will lead to the change of this rule, but I'm not aware of the time in history that you are referring to?

I think Prater is doing exactly what he should be doing concerning this US Air thing. He let the two groups try to come to a resolution on their own. They failed. They both went to binding arbitration. The arbitrator ruled. One side is mad. He listened to both side's arguments as to why/why not the arbitrator's ruling was wrong, and hopefully the Council will butt out again and ecourage both sides to negotiate, even though IMO neither side is under any obligation to do so. ALPA National should stay out of it other than encouraging negotiations between the disputing parties.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Apparently age-65.

So he is doing this purely for his own personal benefit...

How does the ALPA Prez have the power to move the enitre organization in that direction. The EC/EB are facades?

It's not about individual whims. It's about "majority rules." He doesn't seem to get that.

Man, we have gone over this... are you going to get over it...?? Move on....

I really wanted to support Prater and I hoped that he could be a good leader. While I personally supported Captain Woerth during the election, after that was over I was determined to put it behind me and stand with Prater. Unfortunately, he's made that impossible. With his complete disregard for the will of the majority, he gets no support from me.

WOTM......

How about some flight case stickers... to go with the cheese...

How about some recall.... not...

How about a special seesion of the EB? BOD? Not!

Maybe if he wasn't so focused on this age-65 nonsense for the past 6 months he could have worked closely with the AAA/AWA MECs and come up with a viable solution without arbitration. Instead, we're now stuck with a situation that, at best, will turn into a generation-long dysfunctional pilot group at the "new" USAirways. At worst, this could turn into a viable decertification drive at AAA. Yep, real good leadership.

Sounds like NWA too.



p.s. AAA has always been dysfunctional..... between the Peidmont guys, PSA and USAIR and others.. that is like jews and arabs trying to occupy the same land....oh wait never mind...