Aloha Airlines

[Freight Dog]

Fellows... the airlinepilotpay.com does not include our base pay which varies by how long you've been with the company. Also, it doesn't include ER override for the -700 crews either.

The actual B-plan is still 7% based on book (pre-concessions) rates, and that's not changing. The numbers being worked are for the other DC plan, something like super B plan which is completely separate from our "regular" B-plan. The idea behind the numbers game is to minimize the effects of losing our A-plan for everyone. We'll see how it turns out...

As for potential mainland bases... that remains wishful thinking IMO. Supposedly, they are or were looking at SNA base... maybe it'll happen when we get more planes.

As for more airplanes... keep hearing rumors of -800's, but who knows... Mesa showing up and giving away interisland travel for $29 per segment really threw the wrench into expansion plans. Now, it costs more to catch a cab from HNL airport to Waikiki than it does to fly to Maui.

Personally, I think we're gonna have another attempt at a merger, or Yucaipa going to buy out someone. My guess is Hawaiian. I just don't see any other reason why someone of Gordon Bethune's caliber and reputation would be associated with Aloha, especially as a chairman of the Board if there weren't some big plans in the making. Of course everything is very hush-hush, and we're entering the holiday season which usually means the hammer is about to fall somewhere...

 

[fellows]

Frieght dog,

I believe it mentions that, (base pay is not included).
Anyway thanks for the imput.

As for where this company is going, I have no clue. There is a lot of wishful thinking around here, lot's of rumors. I think it would be a good idea to step back and look at our situation as it is now. We both know it is not that pretty.
How long can we continue on this track? How much will it cost our new investors to expand us? Are they willing? Where do we expand to? It seems they may have a plan but it always changes into something else to counter another competitor. We come up with another plan, then something else happens and our plans are dashed. We are always one step behind our competitors.

Your thoughts-

 

[Freight Dog]

There's plenty of places to expand using our existing markets... we don't fly any ETOPS flights out of LIH. Why the hell not? We flew OAK-LIH a few years ago, and it was packed! We could do OAK/SNA redeyes. Apparently slots in SNA aren't an issue.

Right there, you're looking at adding at least 4-5 airplanes without even opening any other new destinations.

 

[fellows]

Frieght Dog,

We did LIH, we did SNA red eyes, this is exactly my point. Why are we not doing them now? Look at how quickly ATA got ramped up out here. They are adding 21 weekly flights to the islands next year, you can bet they are going to LIH. Heck they are going to ITO from OAK. Once again we are a day late and a dollar short. Heck, their investors are the same exact one's that were going to invest in us. You want to compete with these guys you are gonna have to do a lot more than add a couple flights (that we have already done, and stopped for some reason).

We need MAJOR change.

Just healthy debate.
We are on the same team.

 

[Freight Dog]

Remember when we went into bankruptcy, ETOPS was losing money, but interisland was making money. I think Banmiller sold Yucaipa on interisland with ETOPS feeding it. Now that Mesa is here, it's one of those "oh f*ck! now what?"

Now, ETOPS is making money, interisland is flat on its ass thanks to Mesa, and we're not expanding ETOPS.

That's why I think a merger/buyout is in the works.

 

[fellows]

Exactly correct! I have always thought that ETOPS is where the focus should be. I have no clue where all this focus on the interisland is coming from or why. I think it is wrong. Look at what Hawaiian did when they restructered, they added 767s! They further diversified! I agree with you, it seems that they really were taken by surprise with what is happening interisland. That being said, where do we go from here. Does Yucaipa dump further resources into this operation? Do they withdraw? Or do they just buy/merge an existing operation so they don't have to figure out how to do it themselves.

I agree, a merger/buyout is seeming more likely now. If not, I just don't see substantial growth on our own.

 

[HalinTexas]

Merger/Buyout by whom?

 

[fellows]

Don't know.

It may not be, "by whom". It may be "with whom". Or, we may "be the buyer".

Our primary investors, ( Yucaipa Co.) have deep pockets.

IMO Hawaiian makes the most sense. However, I have no facts to support that will ever happen.

Other airlines have been rumored, but I hate bringing that up because there is nothing to back it up either.

it just does'nt make sense that Gordon Bethune was hired as Chrm. of the BOD of our little airline.

 

[DTNflyer]

Hey freight dog I read in the island air thread that you were on a commute to the mainland. How easy is it to commute to the mainland working for Aloha on reserve with there work rules. I know i'm settting myself up with this next question but I take messages on here for what it is a forum. I'm a captain at Expressjet thinking of working at Aloha because i'm from Hawaii all my family is there, i'm interviewing at Aloha on Dec 7. First year pay hurts there just like everywhere else but Aloha or Hawaiian is the only way to work and live in Hawaii for me so if I got hired I would have to commute for at least a year to play it safe. I know the history and the risk working for Aloha but I think the worst that could happen there is furlough or liquidation just like any airline, if it happens at least I tried and can live with that decision but if not its going to be a great carreer. Does the employee group feel optimistic there? With yucaipa's money and Bethune's name on the books there might be brighter times ahead but i'm still going back and forth whether I should or should not take the job if offered. I have a family so its a big decision just getting all the opinions I can good or bad.

Thanks

 

[Freight Dog]

Check your PM.

 

[HalinTexas]

Don't know.

It may not be, "by whom". It may be "with whom". Or, we may "be the buyer".

Our primary investors, ( Yucaipa Co.) have deep pockets.

IMO Hawaiian makes the most sense. However, I have no facts to support that will ever happen.

Other airlines have been rumored, but I hate bringing that up because there is nothing to back it up either.

it just does'nt make sense that Gordon Bethune was hired as Chrm. of the BOD of our little airline.

You might have some anti-trust issues with that one. I don't think the DOJ will sign off on that, nor will local politicians or consumer groups for fear of raising inter-island fares. It all depends on how much effect this highspeed ferry has.

 

[Freight Dog]

What anti-trust issues? There are 4 interisland airlines flying around:

Aloha, Hawaiian, Island Air and go!

Why would there be any issues? Isn't go! out there to kindly provide the local public the ultra low fares a'la Ryanair? I mean, Ornstein couldn't be lying to us all, could he? The man says they are there to stay.

For the longest time, there were only 2 carriers in Hawaii - Aloha and Hawaiian. Island Air was Aloha's little puppet that could only fly to MKK, LNY and JHM and it didn't compete. Now, it's way different... they are flying everywhere we are. Go! is also flying on all of our routes. It's a 4-way competition. If Aloha/Hawaiian merge, you'd have 3 choices instead of 4.

Whatever happens will be rather interesting... hey HalinTexas, for all you know, you could wind up being an Aloha pilot. Yucaipa could go after ATA.

Bottom line, whatever happens, we won't know about it until we read about it in the morning paper.

 

[jmt]

Hey Dog,
any word on when the next class start at AQ?

 

[Freight Dog]

Early January from what I heard...

 

[fellows]

Now that Mesa is here, it is a great time to merge Aloha and Hawaiian. Definetly no monoply there. Lot's of airlines to choose from intrerisland.

Right Dog?