Alaska management verbally announces furloughs for

[av8instyle]

guess

I'm gonna go out on a limb here:
Multiple early outs and LOA's.
Furloughs: Zero
Posturing: 100%

 

[Green Banana]

Okay, here's my idea. Instead of getting the furlough, I'm just gonna take the lump sum early retirement $100k and then go to NorthSouthCentralDeltaPublicWest and start all over.

Nice try, but you have to be "eligible for retirement" per the side letter. So unless you have 30 years with Alaska or are 60 years old, then you are out on your arse....

My guess is 20 downgrades, 40 furloughs.

I am in the 165.

"I like how Alaska is like one big family. We all take care and look out for each other." Sheesh, what a load of crap.

 

[lumax]

I'm not sure but I think you might be wrong Green Banana.
According to one of the recent ALPA e-mails, the appropritate penalties would apply if you left early. here is the text:

If you retire before the normal retirement age, which is defined as reaching 60 or accruing 30 years of service, your final retirement benefit will be actuarially reduced accordingly. In other words, under this agreement the company will not credit you with the years of service necessary to provide you with the final retirement benefit that you would realize had you waited until the normal retirement point to draw upon the benefit.

 

[Green Banana]

I'm not sure but I think you might be wrong Green Banana.
According to one of the recent ALPA e-mails, the appropritate penalties would apply if you left early. here is the text:

If you retire before the normal retirement age, which is defined as reaching 60 or accruing 30 years of service, your final retirement benefit will be actuarially reduced accordingly. In other words, under this agreement the company will not credit you with the years of service necessary to provide you with the final retirement benefit that you would realize had you waited until the normal retirement point to draw upon the benefit.

The actual LOA states

"Early outs will be awarded to pilot eligible to retire per section 28.B.6.a [Normal retirement] and 28.B.6.b [Early retirement]."

28.B.6.a states "60th birthday or 30 years of service"
28.B.6.b states "no sooner than his 45th birthday"

So i guess you could run if you are over 45, but i don't think very many of the 165, including me, can.

 

[Mookie]

Less than 50...

I'll bet a $100 song at Placers in Cabo on it...

:beer:

 

[RedRum]

Maybe if you hear it one more time it will sink in.

There is nothing greedy or self-absorbed about wanting the EXACT SAME career advancement opportunities that you have enjoyed. Nothing more, nothing less. Just the same. Equality is the opposite of greed.
Greed and self absorption lie in taking the EXACT SAME opportunities you've enjoyed from your children for your own personal gain.

Defending your own self-absorption by throwing a guilt trip on the guy that's going to lose his house so you can buy more Viagra is what is indefensible here.

I do wish you the best of luck in your apparent dream of dying at work, though.

Hamburger,

I can sense your frustration. We have the same sort of issues at NWA right now. There has been a lot of class warfare. In my honest opinion, your anger is misdirected. There have been a couple of posts elluding to the fact that this is a management ploy to get the pilots to capitulate. I think they are right.

If the senior guys want to stick around, it is their right to do so. It is federal law and your contract allows it. I just try to look at it as if I was in the senior guys' shoes. I don't want to retire to save someone elses career. If a captain has a second house he is building that is great. He is trying to live out his dream. I don't think you would expect him/her to put all those dreams on hold so you can have your job. It's just the way it works.

I wish things were different in right now, but this industry is crazy. Personally I have felt that junior NWA pilots were sold down there river and a lot of guys had to pay for that with a five year furlough. I still hold on to the fact that a senior guys should not feel bad for not retiring if it is his/her right to do so. A lot of these senior folks have never had their job in jeopardy...that is not their fault.

Just my opinion.

 

[DawgPilot]

RedRum,
I respectfully disagree. The current >60's knew the rules when they signed up (retire @ 60), but when their time came, they convinced Prater to extend it to 65. I'm not saying that they 'owe me' a career, but they shouldn't hide behind the legislation. They wanted more and Prater/Congress capitulated.

My guess is a few Early Out's, quite a few LOA's (50) and 40 furloughs. I'm in the bottom 75. ANC here I come...

 

[igneousy2]

I was told by a certain very smart ANC pilot that Alaska's planned furloughs doesn't trigger a WARN letter because it's not more than X% of the workforce.

I looked at the act, and it doesn't seem to have that loophole, so I don't know what he's talking about.

Your Captain was right...

Here's the link...

http://www.doleta.gov/programs/factsht/warn.htm

And for those with ADHD...

Mass Layoff: A covered employer must give notice if there is to be a mass layoff ... or for 50-499 employees if they make up at least 33% of the employer's active workforce...

I was speaking to someone who heard GS in LA the other day and he was spouting off about furloughing 40 (or so) a month from November through February...so let's think this through since GS clearly didn't...Most of the bottom 40...they are in Anchorage...so you train their replacements...move them and their household effects from LA or SEA to ANC in NOV...and then you train their replacements...move them and their household effects in DEC and then furlough the previous 40...train the new replacements move them and their household effects...At least we'll keep the shipping companies busy.

Anyway...in a normal business there is no way this would be happening because the numbers aren't even close to making sense....not for the short period that they are talking about anyway...

on the other hand this is the airlines and the fact that this REALLY doesn't make sense on any level makes me think it will happen.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

I see it now. This is really a chance for the cargo division to make some big numbers! Think about it, 80 some pilots swapping in and out of ANC!

I'm buying more stock!

 

[tico]

One thing is for sure........Every efin one of us better at least apply for the early out and a 2 year leave.....That would tie them up a bit and the responses would be classic.............

 

[check6]

I say 0 furloughs.

After all, you guys are getting the new "Tom-tom system" for Boeing 737s. That's a $2 million dollar investment (or 65 1st year FOs).

Oh boy the times are tough!

I do realize $2 mil is a small drop in the billion dollar bucket.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2008169749_bizbriefs10.html

 

[Fubijaakr]

...they are in Anchorage...so you train their replacements...move them and their household effects from LA or SEA to ANC in NOV...and then you train their replacements...move them and their household effects in DEC and then furlough the previous 40...train the new replacements move them and their household effects...At least we'll keep the shipping companies busy..

Historically, very VERY few pilots who are displaced OR bid ANC simply for the upgrade move there. They tend to commute...

Besides, you don't get Company paid moving expenses if you voluntarily bid the base OR are furloughed. You would only get expenses if there was a NEW base opened up or you were involuntarily displaced to ANC. The furlough would be accompanied by a reduction bid, so there would probably be plenty of SEA Capts looking at dropping back to reserve who would voluntarily bid ANC to remain a lineholder.

 

[Mamma]

It will be a free paid vacation...in the winter of course for me during my "move" up there before I go on mil leave.

 

[mach none]

The number is up to 200 with the bottom 35 to hit the streets in November, regardless.

 

[kingair1]

Where did you get 200 ? I thought it was 170.