Alaska Airlines increases hiring minimums.

[Motive Flow]

Not to start a mil vs. civ thread and I'm not a fighter guy either, but flying an ILS or any sort of an instrument approach is second nature for any military pilot (atleast the fixed wing types). Yes, fighter guys do fly approaches to minimums and often with another aircraft on the wing (formation). Flying an instrument approach in the weather after a complex mission would be a no brainer, IMO.

Flying an approach to mins is pretty much a no-brainer in the 121 world as well. Airline captains are paid for judgement and having the "big picture." Approaches to minimums just come with the job once in a while.

But I also think mil pilots are getting the shaft with the new quals.

 

[Old School 737]

They raised their mins to be more inline with SWA. They wan't to be offered employment by SWA after the buyout that has yet to be announced. Comming soon though!

What makes you think SWA is buying Alaska?

 

[Going2Baja]

They raised their mins to be more inline with SWA. They wan't to be offered employment by SWA after the buyout that has yet to be announced. Comming soon though!

God I hope this never happens - I never wanted to work for SW and I sure don't want to get backed doored into it!

Baja.

 

[Baze]

G2B,

I'm with you man. If SWA or AA was to buy ALK, I'd just rather quit and go pick up a shovel and become a ditch-digger.

 

[ExAF]

Not Necessarily

I understand what your saying, and maybe im crazy (go talk to my buddies).

I know that either guy (military of civvy) can be trained at eithers job, im sure ill get flamed for that one.

But when it comes down to it, your going to be training a civilian guy to fly a turbine engine (who has already been dealing with problems with possibly questionable equipement, stuck in the weather, limited options...

As opposed to training a fighter guy to deal with the situations tossed at the guy who is flying the 414, metro, etc....

Im sure its possible im offbased somewhere, but wouldnt it be "easier" to train the civvy guy to work with the turbine engine on a citation series. etc, and throw him into the weather, problems, situations they have already seen before, as opposed to training the fighter guy to operate in this foreign environment, in the weather they arent ever stuck in, possibly flying a turboprop they have never seen before, even though they might have already operated the engine of an F-16?

Im crazy im sure, card carrying certifiable actually, but id pick the corporate/airline/prop guy who has already seen all the crap (except for the simple operation of the turbine engine) as opposed to the fighter guy, as long as the other chap wasnt a lunatic.

Man did we get off topic here.

I don't believe I am even responding to this camouflaged mil vs civ thread...but... Just remember the F-16 guy is doing everything your "civvie" in the metro is, only he is doing it by himself. He gets the same wx and "problems" and has probably done it in foreign countries as well. He does it at faster speeds and has to stay that much farther ahead of the aircraft. He hand flies the approach since the ILS isn't coupled. He also makes all of his own radio calls and jerks his own gear. Most likely he planned and filed his own flight plan (not dispatch). There is a lot more to mil flying than you think and the 121 world is not all that foreign to the fighter world. For most fighter flyers, getting from point A to point B and shooting an approach to mins is the mundane part of the flight. Usually they have to slow down to adjust to the 121 pace of flying. JMHO. OK...flame on.

 

[Going2Baja]

G2B,

I'm with you man. If SWA or AA was to buy ALK, I'd just rather quit and go pick up a shovel and become a ditch-digger.

Ditch diggin' would be less tiring than flying for SW. Those guys work WAY too hard!

 

[AV80R]

“Health: Applicant must hold current First Class FAA Medical Certificate. Vision must be correctable to 20/20 in both eyes. Non user of nicotine products.”

The 20/20 is an oxymoron as your vision must be correctable to 20/20 in order to get a first class (I think I got that right). However the no-smoker rule is something new, didn’t know airlines could require that. I don’t smoke and I’m not trying to move on to Alaska but why the rule?

8 puffs from throttle to abortle? Sry, it doesn’t make sense and I’m seriously rime-challenged.

 

[regionaltard]

I don't believe I am even responding to this camouflaged mil vs civ thread...but... Just remember the F-16 guy is doing everything your "civvie" in the metro is, only he is doing it by himself. He gets the same wx and "problems" and has probably done it in foreign countries as well. He does it at faster speeds and has to stay that much farther ahead of the aircraft. He hand flies the approach since the ILS isn't coupled. He also makes all of his own radio calls and jerks his own gear. Most likely he planned and filed his own flight plan (not dispatch). There is a lot more to mil flying than you think and the 121 world is not all that foreign to the fighter world. For most fighter flyers, getting from point A to point B and shooting an approach to mins is the mundane part of the flight. Usually they have to slow down to adjust to the 121 pace of flying. JMHO. OK...flame on.

Count me as one civilian who agrees (with the standard "must be able to adapt to working as part of a crew" disclaimer) and who is also astonished that rotary wing time is not given more respect by the airlines. Them things is hard to fly!

 

[mach none]

“Health: Applicant must hold current First Class FAA Medical Certificate. Vision must be correctable to 20/20 in both eyes. Non user of nicotine products.”

The 20/20 is an oxymoron as your vision must be correctable to 20/20 in order to get a first class (I think I got that right). However the no-smoker rule is something new, didn’t know airlines could require that. I don’t smoke and I’m not trying to move on to Alaska but why the rule?

8 puffs from throttle to abortle? Sry, it doesn’t make sense and I’m seriously rime-challenged.

We have had this policy for years. The smokers we have on the property were grandfathered in. Given the no smoking policy in the the state of Washington, California and else where, this won't go away.

 

[US Flyer]

Not to change the subject, but when are they getting of "Atilla the Hun" in HR who does interviews?

 

[ERJFO]

Exactly. Like most of the bros in my squadron that have YEARS of experience flying high performance aircraft and all of a sudden they are out of the picture. I think it's just a shame that they're gonna miss out on a lot of experience.

I think they would rather have someone from a "crew" airplane instead of someone coming out of an F-15 anyway. Why would you want someone who's done it all by themselfs to come be your F/O for 8 years... I wouldn't - I don't know one good reason an airline would hire a military guy out of a single seat fighter.

 

[Motive Flow]

I think they would rather have someone from a "crew" airplane instead of someone coming out of an F-15 anyway. Why would you want someone who's done it all by themselfs to come be your F/O for 8 years... I wouldn't - I don't know one good reason an airline would hire a military guy out of a single seat fighter.

INCOMING!!!!

 

[Ih8AFYesmen]

I think they would rather have someone from a "crew" airplane instead of someone coming out of an F-15 anyway. Why would you want someone who's done it all by themselfs to come be your F/O for 8 years... I wouldn't - I don't know one good reason an airline would hire a military guy out of a single seat fighter.

I'm bored so I'll respond to this tool. I'm a heavy dude, no fighter experience, but have flown the T-38/37. So.... this coming from a heavy guy won't come accross as arrogance versus coming from a fighter dude.

Most military pilots leave the service for QOL issues. No matter what they flew in the military, many of them choose to make a living flying airplanes because most pilots enjoy flying; that's why we go to work even after managment's continuous abuse ;-) A military pilot, regardless of their flying background, is more than capable of flying for the airlines. In no way am I being arrogan, but that is the fact. If you don't like it, than I'd say you have a serious inferiority complex.

Airline flying is no more than point A to point B flying. There are many reasons why an airline would hire a single seater, aka fighter pilot. For one thing, MOST of these guys finished near the top of their class (not all.... trust me I know). They go through a pretty intensive and competitive training course after getting their wings. Although they do not fly as much as say a heavy guy, but their 1.2s are all hands on, not to mention the complexity of the missions. So, to fly an instrument approach in the weather after an exhauting mission is like parking a car in your garage. A military trained pilot is also a known quantity. I'm sure you've heard of this before. The airlines know exactly what kind of training these guys received from uncle Sam. I'm guessing that when you say "single seat" vs. crew aircraft, you are implying that a "single seat" guy has no CRM experience. That is where pilots who have no clue regarding military aviation should keep their cake hole shut. What do you think formation flying is? As lead of a formation of multiple aircraft, you are the "captain" of the entire flight. You have to have the SA and CRM skills to lead and complete a mission safely and effectively. CRM is easier to exercise when both of the pilots are in the same cockpit.

I flew heavies out of choice and I'm no fighter wannabe, but I don't think one can truly appreciate being a fighter pilot until you've done it yourself. That goes for everything else, so until you've done it yourself, I'd suggest you choose your words carefully.

 

[Tarquinn]

God this topic drives me up the wall... Once a pilot is trained to proficiency at any particular airline, their background really becomes a moot point... It's all about attitude in my opinion. I came in at AS with a pure civilian background, with no jet time. After we had passed our sims, one of my classmates who flew B52's and I were comparing notes and laughing at how we both made the same mistakes. Two seperate and totally different backgrounds... and yet we were both new in the airplane, trained to the same standards, and got through training in the same amount of time. Once you have a certain amount of experience under your belt it really doesn't matter what you "used to do," as long as you're trainable and have a good attitude.

 

[Caveman]

God this topic drives me up the wall... Once a pilot is trained to proficiency at any particular airline, their background really becomes a moot point... It's all about attitude in my opinion. I came in at AS with a pure civilian background, with no jet time. After we had passed our sims, one of my classmates who flew B52's and I were comparing notes and laughing at how we both made the same mistakes. Two seperate and totally different backgrounds... and yet we were both new in the airplane, trained to the same standards, and got through training in the same amount of time. Once you have a certain amount of experience under your belt it really doesn't matter what you "used to do," as long as you're trainable and have a good attitude.

Well said.