Airtran Union Board endorses TA w/ qulifications

[Lear70]

Flash a light at me to show the support....I'll be the AirTran crawling at 5 knots down the taxiway.

Yeah, I was kind of wondering how the flying for the rest of the week and weekend would pan out.

Not to mention APU usage, two-engine taxi, and "no faster than a brisk walk" taxis...

I'm off until next Thursday, someone's gonna have to let me know how it's going out there.

 

[cl65capt]

I start a four day tomorrow, I'll let you know. I'm not sure its the company we should be mad at here, after all it is there job to save money. I think its the NPA and the negotiating team we should be pissed off at. What the heck were they thinking even bring us this piece of crap? Looks like another couple years before we finally get a deal.

 

[Fly-By-Cable]

I start a four day tomorrow, I'll let you know. I'm not sure its the company we should be mad at here, after all it is there job to save money. I think its the NPA and the negotiating team we should be pissed off at. What the heck were they thinking even bring us this piece of crap? Looks like another couple years before we finally get a deal.

While BoD is to be held responsible, it's the company that said that pilots are nothing special to them, just like any other employee group. And it shows with this proposal. SWA worries about making money too, you don't see them insulting their pilots.

 

[LUalum]

It's ironic, last 3 recurrent ground school union lunches I've attended I was told to focus on scheduling issues in the contract and not get too hung up on the pay section Ch4. Now when they for some reason want to impress all us ignorant pilots with their hard won TA, the pay rates and lump sum figures are plastered all over the union site. I'm guessing 80/20 no on the rat vote. We are about to pay 380 million for MEH and we volunteer to start the clock at pushback! I must be missing something.

 

[newnan]

It'll be 60/40 in favor thanks to this appathetic group.

Please take advantage of KG's survey that was in your boxes.

 

[cl65capt]

While BoD is to be held responsible, it's the company that said that pilots are nothing special to them, just like any other employee group. And it shows with this proposal. SWA worries about making money too, you don't see them insulting their pilots.

I agree with you, but I do think the BOD has some explaining to do. Perhaps we need to get MB back on the negotiating team. I guess I'm just pissed because I come to expect this sort of crap from the company, what I dont expect is the union to go along with it and then try to make it seem better by saying we can start negotiating again in three and a half years. Well thats just friggin great, another six years of this bs. Sorry for the rant, I'm pissed off and tired.

 

[Beetle007]

They want to change the pay calculation to start when the aircraft moves back from the jetbridge. This is estimated by a couple guys to be a 2-3% pay cut on a monthly average,

I remember when I (we) took a 3% pay cut in a previous life my good friend started coming into work 3% late.

Last time I checked the AIM says to taxi at a Brisk walk. Have you ever tried to briskly walk from the jetway to the end of the runway =)

But in all seriousness I wish you guys the best

 

[Ty Webb]

This negotiating committee had a tremendous opportunity going for them (merger+shareholders' meeting) and still were manipulated into emerging with a concessionary contract!

I think they need to all step down, and make way for some guys with the testicular fortitude and negotiation experience they are so clearly lacking.

AP- we appreciate your efforts, but ever since the Christmas debacle, you have been on the wrong path . . . .it's time to step down and save us the effort of a recall. That is the best thing you can do for your fellow pilots.

TW

 

[Beantown]

Can someone fill me in on what "moving reserve days means"? I interviewed at AirTran recently and I figure I will be on reserve in the neighborhood of 6 to 12 months. I have never heard of this but some how it doesn't sound good. Bean

 

[Kharma Police]

I miss Mike B.....

 

[fmr727drvr]

Can someone fill me in on what "moving reserve days means"? I interviewed at AirTran recently and I figure I will be on reserve in the neighborhood of 6 to 12 months. I have never heard of this but some how it doesn't sound good. Bean

Means you and me and everybody else on reserve is fu&%ed real good. Not only are they asking us to take a pay cut....now we won't even know when our days off are gonna be. How do you make plans with a sched like that? Oh that's right....we don't give a sh*t about our reserves......what's new we have always treated reserves like second class sh$t at airtran.

 

[fmr727drvr]

And don't forget after an assignment they can put us on ready reserve.
Did I mention we were getting FU$%ed!!!!!!!!! Anybody that endorses this POS ought to be taken out to the wood shed!!

 

[RadioClash]

Can someone fill me in on what "moving reserve days means"? I interviewed at AirTran recently and I figure I will be on reserve in the neighborhood of 6 to 12 months. I have never heard of this but some how it doesn't sound good. Bean

From my understanding you will have golden days, each month, which are off days that cannot be moved, usually one block of 3-4 days off, and then you will have your regular off days which scheduling can move around the month at their will.

For example. You get a reserve line with Fri, Sat, Sun off each week. Scheduling calls you on Monday during week #2 and says your are now off on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday and you are on reserve Friday, Saturday and Sunday of that week. And you have to answer the phone, because they call you during your reserve period. Can't hind from them. Then repeat the cycle each week. It sucks. When I was at ASA that is how they did and this sounds like that. I hope I am wrong.

So in effect you will get a reserve line each month, and out of 12 days off, or how many you get, you will only be certain of your 3 or 4 golden days off on specific days, the rest, well don't plan anything for the rest of your off days because they will get moved around.

This is total BS

 

[Lear70]

Can someone fill me in on what "moving reserve days means"? I interviewed at AirTran recently and I figure I will be on reserve in the neighborhood of 6 to 12 months. I have never heard of this but some how it doesn't sound good. Bean

According to the powerpoint presentation (the full text isn't available yet and probably won't be until tomorrow evening or after the weekend), the new reserve section has several give-backs, including "moving reserve days".

Instead of 10 days off on 28-30 day months and 11 days off on 31-day months, you're going to get 12 days off, but 6 of them are "movable", meaning you get 2 sets of 3 "hard" days off (not movable), and 6 days that you get "off", but that can be moved ANYWHERE, ANYTIME at the whim of the company.

You get 75 hours of guarantee instead of 70, but I spent 8 months on reserve, dropped down to 14-15 days off every month, and NEVER, EVER credited less than 90 hours, usually closer to 100, and never worked more than 70 hours of block, usually closer to 60.

This is equivalently a 20-25% pay cut for the reserves. In exchange, you got 1 extra day but now half are movable, a 75 hour credit, and long-call reserve that was already IN the other contract, but they weren't forced to use (now they are but only in small amounts).

Now they must make at least 10% of the lines long-call (Tactical Reserve), but we don't know under what circumstances they can call you in for regular reserve, ready reserve, or even a trip.

On average 10% of our lines are reserve, this will now go up to 12%. 10% of THOSE lines will be Tactical Reserve. I believe there were about 55 reserve lines last months, so 5 of those lines will be Tactical. Not exactly helpful for most pilots.

Overall, the reserve section is concessionary, and I'm not interested in a concessionary contract.

 

[Lear70]

And don't forget after an assignment they can put us on ready reserve.
Did I mention we were getting FU$%ed!!!!!!!!! Anybody that endorses this POS ought to be taken out to the wood shed!!

Yeah, that's a show-stopper.

I am NOT going to be on reserve as a lineholder.

Ready Reserve on the couch after a flight assignment as a lineholder... that's the kind of stuff that gets people a blanket party in parking lots.

RECALL THE NC NOW!

 

[Fly-By-Cable]

This negotiating committee had a tremendous opportunity going for them (merger+shareholders' meeting) and still were manipulated into emerging with a concessionary contract!

Yep! Company knew we were planning to have informational picketing at MEH shareholder's meeting in mid June. They successfully blocked that effort since TA vote is due on June 28th and you can't picket if you have a TA on the table.
After the meeting they can negotiate for another 2 years...no pressure.
I wanna vote now, or...say by June 10th.

 

[HalinTexas]

From the outside looking in. Vote No. You deserve better.

Might be time for an unofficial slow-down. (Use your imagination.) But above all: Be Safe.

 

[gt1900]

This entire POS TA is just another example of how our company bent the NPA over and made them look like complete idiots.. AAI management played this perfectly.. After I look at this chit, how can the union actually sit there and try to sell this to us.. What a bunch of idiots... BTW.. I'm not mad at the company at all.. Thier job is to negotiate a contract that the pilots will pass by 51%. Its business to them... They are the reason AAI is where they are finacially.. And I'm gratefull for that... They just proved how much smarter than our union they are again.. They bought themselves some more time and can concentrate on the MEH merger..... Wow, I really didn't think our union was this stupid.. Today, I was proven otherwise...

 

[AFcitrus]

Being a military guy I am kind of new to this game but would someone please answer me these questions:

1) Can we demand that our union take a vote next week after we see full version, prior to wasting any money on roadshows? If so let's get the ball rollin'.

2) How do we get the NC replaced now? Can someone start a signiture sheet in the crew room and get a certain number of signitures? What is the process?

3) Will someone start the recall process for the BOD? I specifically asked MG (Dom. Rep) on Monday why they were voting on something before we had Q and A in writing. He shrugged his shoulders and played ignorant. Now I know is wasn't playing.

Recall these SOBs now. I am afraid to say it but the word collusion is starting to come to mind. I think the membership needs to hire a lawyer to take on our own people. The company has done it. They have split our pilot group. No one has any faith in our BOD or NC anymore.

Let's get the ball rolling on these issues now while we still have time to gain back all the leverage our incompetent BOD/NC has just given away.

 

[BR715]

I cannot express to everyone how much sorrow I feel right now. I think I might even withdraw myself from the union. Why even pay dues anymore. The NPA is a worthless piece of crap.

Not only did the company insult the pilot group with this TA, but the NPA or that so called union we have also insulted us with this TA.

Vote No, No, No. I will work under the current contract for as long as I need to.

You guys want a TA? Get a vote going to bring ALPA on the property and you will see all the boys in Orlando giving us what we want.