AirTran TA2

[SkiFishFly]

AV80R it states all FO would stay at current pay....

TA 3 I say will pass....

Top out at 187 for 737..Captains will pass this one ..

TA 3 not bad at all...

Are you refering to the current TA or the next one to come???
Are you really willing to give concessions on scope and reserve rules and door close and....

 

[RadioClash]

Scarlet isn't giving up anything, he is at ASA. No need to worry about him.

 

[Lear70]

Scarlet isn't giving up anything, he is at ASA. No need to worry about him.

eggxactly right.

Av8or, you're right, it automatically formatted for the math to a percentage increase rather than decrease. Need to redo the math on the part of the pdf file, good catch, thanks.

Yes, it's a pay cut for new-hires. Anyone hired after Date Of Signing comes in ad industry average or $38.50, whichever is higher, but nothing in the T.A. says exactly *how* they will figure that.

One of the many, many loopholes.

Edit: Links edited and fixed, if anyone else catches anything, please let me know. All help is appreciated!

 

[AV80R]

eggxactly right.

Av8or, you're right, it automatically formatted for the math to a percentage increase rather than decrease. Need to redo the math on the part of the pdf file, good catch, thanks.

Yes, it's a pay cut for new-hires. Anyone hired after Date Of Signing comes in ad industry average or $38.50, whichever is higher, but nothing in the T.A. says exactly *how* they will figure that.

One of the many, many loopholes.

I see, thanks for the clarification...Good luck to y'all and great job on the links and bullet points

 

[Just thinking]

TA version

Fancy production value on the video, I think they put more effort into the video than they did the TA. Half hearted effort at best on the TA. They hammered out all of these changes to the LFO in one marathon session that started at one in the afternoon and completed 12 hours later? Imagine what they could have accomplished had they been focused, firm and fair thoughout the entire process?

Requested (via the web communications department) that they remove AP's rebuttal of DS's point paper until they allow all point papers to be posted on the website for all members to be able to read. Sent the same request to the NPA president. It is OUR website payed for by OUR dues. Let our voices and opinions be heard. Democracy can be quite liberating and maybe we can turn around this autocracy that has nosed its way into the tent.

Printed out the two page rebuttal along with the pay chart comparison and will be carrying it with me to "talk the talk."

SAP I language is weakened and nothing on SAP II... imagine that. Seniority allows you to hold a line with 15 days off only to see overflights and delays eat in to your days off to keep the airline going and get nothing for your efforts. Mediation will turn into a joke because the company will utilize a demanding schedule and once the NPA fails to respond on time, everything gets thrown out....

Leadership means you lead from the front... not one of the BOD has lead anyone. Talk about the ultimate flip-flop campaign. Shameful. YES-YES-NO

 

[ASA]

The negotiating committee and the NPA leadership certainly wasted the last few years of our lives. Thanks, guys. Now it's time to come back to the line. Gravy days are over. I know, we don't appreciate how hard you had it. If only we knew how tough it was . . . no one would want the job. Congratulations, you no longer have to do it.

The final TA is a joke. I actually understand anyone close to retirement, or even captains in the 70% percentile voting for it. It's just the way it goes. Self-interests. But if this thing gets any less than 70% No vote, something is seriously wrong.

Come on guys, you really need that signing bonus of a few thousand dollars this badly?

It's a pathetic TA. Wow, if it's under a 9 hour overnight, no van rides over 30 minutes. You tell 'em! And if it's over 22 hours, we'll be next to "tourist attractions."

Really, it's not even close. It's simply not worth discussing. It looks like a bad regional airline contract with decent pay rates for captains, low pay rates for FOs. If it passes, my God, look out competitors, your management will hold this thing up and say, "Look what we are competing against! You guys better follow suit."

 

[RadioClash]

Against my better judgement I looked at TA 3 or whatever it is being called now and yep, still voting no. And yep, pi$$ed more than before.

There is not one thing in here to make me vote yes. I don't think I can type all of the issues I have with this TA. In a nutshell the whole thing sucks.

NO!

 

[Lear70]

The rates, at Date of Signing for F/O's are below not only all the Legacies, as well as Alaska, but also under Frontier who JUST SIGNED a contract and has been having profitability problems. Their scheduling section is better than ours as well.

The only airlines that make less than our F/O's year for year are ATA, Midwest, and Spirit.

This is the best we could do?

I don't think so.

 

[JOEBOYPILOT]

I laughed my A$$ off at that video by AP.

Lets pass this New TA because its the best were gonna get and then use our FA's as an example????

WTF

If we don't pass will probably get parked for a year!

Awsome. Lets let the rest of the Industy get better pay and benefits post bankruptcy. Every time we've left the negotating table the compay has given us a better final offer. Just like the Midwest Buyouy. Lets take some time off --- I'm all for it.

I'm voting no again. If this turd passes I will follow all the other FO's out the door.

 

[XRMEFLYER]

Still voting HELL NO!

 

[Ty Webb]

I don't know of anyone stupid enough to vote for this POS, except Allen & Co., which is why they need to be replaced with pilots who represent the interests of their fellow line pilots.

This next election needs to be less of a Beauty Contest, and more of a Caged Death Match.

 

[AFcitrus]

Yep! Still voting NO!!!

People need to hold this TA2 up to our current book and make that comparison. You will easily see how pitiful it is.

I read the new TA from start to finish but I refuse to listen to Allen Philpot (in writing, video or telephone) try to sell this pig. He needs to step down now and save us controversy of a recall vote. You too MS!!

 

[Texan2IP]

Can anyone post that video on youtube or some other site for the rest of us to view?

 

[funnyman12]

I'm not saying whether I'm voting for it or not but I bet you it passes 60/40. Was flying today and the Captain had his laptop with the TA on it. We compared to the current contract. The 3 givebacks were the door closing, the PPO plan, and current reserve pay. If we lost 5 minutes every leg we would lose 5% per month. Realistically with underblock legs and 1-3 minute average of door close to movement it equates to about 2% concession. We both calculated about a 9% raise initially, so approx 7% raise. The current reserve pay everyone knew would be gone but we got long call reserve and min 12 days off. We retained most of the current book and some improvements. If the TA goes down, rumor has it the mediator is booked solid for 6 months. Is it worth 9 months delay for the door closing? It seems the company got some and we got some. The pay rates minus the Fo first year are industry standard with other equipment of the same size (airline pilot central). The opinion of the individuals on this website seem to be much more extreme and negative compared to the pilots I have talked to. Still I'm going to think long and hard before I cast my vote.

 

[easydoesit]

funnyman12 are you Mr. Philpot?