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Airtran contract

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Either way the aruguement is that of what are my union dues get me? How much leverage does my union have? What are my short term and long term goals for a contract? Can NPA get you there? Be honest with yourself. Do you really think that NPA is going to grow a pair, become really powerful and somehow come up with the money to be able to fight and strike if neccessary? If I was at Airtran I would be very afraid that I would lose my major airline line job because someone in management doesnt like me. Or if I got screwed out of a few hundred dollars of pay and could not grieve it. NPA cant even reign in its own Gestapo style training dept.

We are coming up on electing some new NPA board members; hopefully we can get rid of the Jimmy Carters. I am guessing shortly after the NPA elections the issue of ALPA will come up. Many, like I feel that ALPA is long overdue and are tired of watching the company with the NPA's assistance erode our contract. No more of the NPA's "Taxation without Representation".
 
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maybe its time to try something else. alpa, teamsters whoever. dues will be less and the representation couldn't be worse.
 
MB at a lucheon at Pic-my-dilly's said he will give it another 6 months (this was a couple of months ago) so I would say sometime towards the first of the year, if things don't change WE WILL start looking for a national union. Like I said I would vote ALPA in, I just wonder if the scabs would try to shoot it down.
 
Like I said I would vote ALPA in, I just wonder if the scabs would try to shoot it down.

How many are left? 20? No matter the number, there aren't enough of them to shoot anything down. The more real problem to voting ALPA in is the large number of regional pilots here that feel they've been effed by ALPA in the past.

BTW - I'd vote to bring ALPA here in a nanosecond.
 
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I would also vote yes for ALPA simply for the better insurance. My guess is that ALPA would be voted in today if it ever came up for a vote. Just my opinion.
 
We're quickly getting to the point where even those who have been hosed by ALPA in the past (or feel like they were), are re-thinking their position, simply because of the options, or lack thereof, not to mention the protections that come with an ALPA war chest in times of strike, as more and more people realize that a strike is the ONLY way you'll EVER see a fair contract at AAI.

That being said, I wouldn't want to see anyone try a petition for ALPA or some other type of ALPA drive without the NPA BoD or a majority of BoD members in support of it. It would be ugly, nasty, divisive, and would yield the kind of bitter feud you see over at UAir/AWA right now with USAPA.

If it's something you want, make sure the people you elect this Fall are proponents of ALPA or, at least, are open to doing the will of the majority of the membership. Have ALPA come do roadshows about what they have to offer, then poll the pilot group. If the majority shows they want ALPA, put it out for vote. If not, no harm, no foul, keep the status quo.

Not rocket science...

Not trying to infer that I don't have faith in MB or the BoD, simply that I think that, given the experience level of Kolski, et al. and their focus on concessions at all costs, that we need the resources that ALPA brings to the table.

I'd prefer the personal legal protections ALPA would bring as well,,, but that's for personal reasons.
 
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NWA was THE founding council if I remember my history right (It's been a LONG time since I read "Flying the Line")...

I don't know about DAL.
 
anyone know what airlines were original members/founders of Alpa?

RV

Yes it was American, now what are you referring cause American dumped Alpa we shouldnt give them consideration?? If you look at why they dumped Alpa they felt that they werent militant enough on their view points. But does this mean that Alpa's services as well as bargaining power is any less?? Cause of one airlines decision to drop them?? Actually in fact go look at where APA is today, after AMR sued the hell out of them and they are pretty much almost bankrupt. The funny thing is, you already are starting to see an Alpa movement within in their union as well. Its amazing how many brand new shiny Alpa stickers are appearing on the flight cases of many American pilots. I dont understand TWE how in past previous post you can sit there and bash Alpa so much for things that it was the fault of the pilot group itself. Alpa isnt going to fight a contract for you, but merely provide the servies IF YOU WANT to fight for yourself. Not to mention all the other nice goodies of loss of medical, LTD, etc. You can continue to try with your smart remarks of saying why Alpa is so bad. But tell me some real true concrete things that arent hear say of what Alpa did and back it up!!! I have had this conversation with so many people that now its almost to easy to cite stuff because I have cited it so many times!! Now I am not saying that Alpa is a godsend and its going to save all our problems and everything is going to be great. But come on man, its going to be a hell of alot better then we have!!! I am sick of seeing Airtran pilots cower down cause of their management. Hearing them say oh my god I hope that I dont get a call about this and watch them fret over it like a small child!! You know what I am talking about TWE, even ex TWA guys I have flown with are talking of Alpa. This management loves NPA, why do you think they hate Alpa so much!! Why does our chief pilot openly say he hates Alpa with a passion!!! Why do think they hate Alpa so much??? Is it cause oh maybe Alpa screwed them to?? NOO its because they truely know the power of Alpa'a union. They dont want to have to sit down across a table with a legal team that is just as good as theres.
 
How many red bull's have you had today?? I was simply asking about original airline members. Thanks for your input though it was really enlightening.

RV
 
Yes it was American, now what are you referring cause American dumped Alpa we shouldnt give them consideration??
First, I think the word you're looking for is "inferring".

Second, ALPA wasn't founded by any ONE pilot group, there were several that got together, officially founded in 1931.

AA split off in 1963.
 
Yes it was American, now what are you referring cause American dumped Alpa we shouldnt give them consideration?? If you look at why they dumped Alpa they felt that they werent militant enough on their view points. But does this mean that Alpa's services as well as bargaining power is any less?? Cause of one airlines decision to drop them?? Actually in fact go look at where APA is today, after AMR sued the hell out of them and they are pretty much almost bankrupt. The funny thing is, you already are starting to see an Alpa movement within in their union as well. Its amazing how many brand new shiny Alpa stickers are appearing on the flight cases of many American pilots. I dont understand TWE how in past previous post you can sit there and bash Alpa so much for things that it was the fault of the pilot group itself. Alpa isnt going to fight a contract for you, but merely provide the servies IF YOU WANT to fight for yourself. Not to mention all the other nice goodies of loss of medical, LTD, etc. You can continue to try with your smart remarks of saying why Alpa is so bad. But tell me some real true concrete things that arent hear say of what Alpa did and back it up!!! I have had this conversation with so many people that now its almost to easy to cite stuff because I have cited it so many times!! Now I am not saying that Alpa is a godsend and its going to save all our problems and everything is going to be great. But come on man, its going to be a hell of alot better then we have!!! I am sick of seeing Airtran pilots cower down cause of their management. Hearing them say oh my god I hope that I dont get a call about this and watch them fret over it like a small child!! You know what I am talking about TWE, even ex TWA guys I have flown with are talking of Alpa. This management loves NPA, why do you think they hate Alpa so much!! Why does our chief pilot openly say he hates Alpa with a passion!!! Why do think they hate Alpa so much??? Is it cause oh maybe Alpa screwed them to?? NOO its because they truely know the power of Alpa'a union. They dont want to have to sit down across a table with a legal team that is just as good as theres.

APA is far from bankrupt. Your financial obervation on APA is about 5 years old and currently erroneous.

There was a push for ALPA almost 5-8 years ago. Once again your information is VERY dated.

AAflyer
 
Some good points and arguments. Ok, let's get ALPA in here. MB is not going to get anything done. He just does not have the resources. Why wait 6 months? Would the scabs even be allowed in ALPA?
 

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