Airtran calling back more pilots!! Upgrades too!

[PCL_128]

Is it legal per the contract?

No, it's not.

 

[j41driver]

No, it's not.

Please tell me that the BOD is actually going to do something to force them to comply with the contract rather than sign another LOA.

 

[maxblast72]

Can you do a LOA on another LOA? Sarcasm off.

 

[Capt. Kramer]

If they feel like signing another LOA they should sign one for recall rights.

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

They cant just do LOA anymore. MEMRAT passed we will have to vote on it.

 

[FIREMAN]

No, it's not.

Jest read the CBA and LOA 9 did not see anything about what aircraft recalled pilots must go to. Can you post what makes it illegal? I think they will recall what ever number of pilots it takes to get the 35 717 Fos. If there are 737 Fos within that 35 they will go back to the 73. This will allow more pilots back. Do we want to fight that? To clarify, it may take 40 recalls to get 35 717 Fos.

 

[PCL_128]

From the contract: "No pilot may be awarded, assigned, or displaced to a new assignment unless he is awarded, assigned or displaced as a result of the vacancy award process or displacement process contained in this Section."

So far, there has been no vacancy for 737 pilots. I don't know what the NPA thinks about it, but it certainly doesn't appear legal to me.

 

[FIREMAN]

From the contract: "No pilot may be awarded, assigned, or displaced to a new assignment unless he is awarded, assigned or displaced as a result of the vacancy award process or displacement process contained in this Section."

So far, there has been no vacancy for 737 pilots. I don't know what the NPA thinks about it, but it certainly doesn't appear legal to me.

This is under Section 6
Filling of Vacancies and Displacements. We are talking recalls. Not trying to defend the company jest pointing out more ambiguous CBA language. Another reason pilots do not need to be writing the contract.

 

[PCL_128]

You're missing this important part:

1. A vacancy shall mean “an assignment in excess of the number of pilots already in that assignment or the creation of an assignment”. For the purposes of this Section, “assignment” means a pilot’s domicile, crew position, and equipment (such as ATL DC9 CAPT, or MCO 717 F/O, etc.).

2. All vacancies will be available for bid by all pilots in the system in accordance with this Section, and posted as a Vacancy Notice, except as expressly provided for in this Section:​

According to this language, these positions being filled by recalled pilots are "vacancies," and all vacancies are required to be eligible to bid by the entire pilot group. They can't magically create positions out of thin air and not let the rest of the group bid on them.

 

[T3700]

If management can get away with abrogating seniority on this recall, we will be letting the camel's nose under the tent. You want to bust a union? Just eliminate seniority rights. This would make it every man for himself. How would you like to see yourself a few years from now, depending on whether you are on the good boy list for upgrades and schedules?

As far as nothing being in the contract concerning recalls. The company already set the precedent with the previous recall. They issued a vacancy notice for 35 717 FO positions.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Jest read the CBA and LOA 9 did not see anything about what aircraft recalled pilots must go to. Can you post what makes it illegal? I think they will recall what ever number of pilots it takes to get the 35 717 Fos. If there are 737 Fos within that 35 they will go back to the 73. This will allow more pilots back. Do we want to fight that? To clarify, it may take 40 recalls to get 35 717 Fos.

I really doubt the company is recalling 737 pilots out of the good of their heart just to get some 717 guys. In the first 50 recalls, probably 2/3 are 737 guys. They probably saw how expensive it was going to be to retrain everyone. So at the last minute over a holiday they reveal their plan so the union will be way behind by the time they open the doors on Monday. But that does means they have flying for every airplane.

 

[relief tube]

back to 20% growth. yay.

 

[JT12345]

It costs 30,000 to train a 737 FO for the 717, and then another 30,000 if a 717 senior FO takes that 737 slot. They could be talking about a 60,000 savings. It costs about $1000 to get a furloughed pilot requal'd.

Simple math, but a violation. If they want recall language it will probably take a new contract especially with Memrat.

I think at 60,000 a pop management prefers dealing with a greivance.

 

[Frequency]

It costs 30,000 to train a 737 FO for the 717, and then another 30,000 if a 717 senior FO takes that 737 slot. They could be talking about a 60,000 savings. It costs about $1000 to get a furloughed pilot requal'd.

Simple math, but a violation. If they want recall language it will probably take a new contract especially with Memrat.

I think at 60,000 a pop management prefers dealing with a greivance.

Someone asked about training costs during my recurrent and JM said that we "virtually own" the simulators, so we pay for them whether we train or not each month (new hire or recurrent). So I dont think Simulator costs factor in too much on an individual basis. But I could be wrong.

 

[QOL_is_great:)]

Good News For Ya!!

Nice way to start 2009!!!
Hope it all works out for ya and 2009 is only better then what we all left.
Cheers!!

 

[gt1900]

Actually we do own 1 717 sim. Thats why were only calling back 2 small classes at first. That way we can use just the sim we own and not have to increase training costs by using the other 717 sims as well. At least thats what I was told.

 

[ces152]

How many are being recalled total to date?

 

[jester757]

back to 20% growth. yay.

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

If SWA is holding steady I HIGHLY doubt that you all will grow 20%. Keep in mind the world's largest airline just appeared in your backyard and that there is a good possibility SWA is not far behind them. Better hang on...this is where the ride will get a bit messy.

 

[ces152]

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

If SWA is holding steady I HIGHLY doubt that you all will grow 20%. Keep in mind the world's largest airline just appeared in your backyard and that there is a good possibility SWA is not far behind them. Better hang on...this is where the ride will get a bit messy.

You feel better about yourself now?

Back to the question at hand anyone have the numbers on how many call backs so far?

Anyone have any info on how many of the furloughees are defering the recall?

Thanks.

 

[PCL_128]

There were 35 recalls in the first batch, and now 50 new FO vacancies on the latest vacancy release that came out today.

 

[Ualexpress]

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

jester,

That post was sarcastic in nature by someone who doesn't like AirTran, not from anyone who works for AirTran.

 

[Wesb737fo]

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

If SWA is holding steady I HIGHLY doubt that you all will grow 20%. Keep in mind the world's largest airline just appeared in your backyard and that there is a good possibility SWA is not far behind them. Better hang on...this is where the ride will get a bit messy.

Hey uh..jester.....let me guess. Bitter, jaded, and yes...your company invented air travel.

Also, I agree with Ual express, the original post appears to be sarcasm.....look it up...

 

[Ty Webb]

What a freakin @sswipe!

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

Listen up, Chief . . . . if we want any advice on how to ride out a bankruptcy, we'll be sure to look your lame @ss up, but until then, why don't you have a nice warm cup of STFU and go back to fellating Uppercrust?

FWIW, based on the Ass-clowns that your airline hired from my University . . . your passengers and everyone on any hilltop near SFO should thank God that most of you talentless imbeciles are flying Airbuses.

Ty

 

[Flying-Corporal]

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

I find it amusing when pilots sitting in the flight deck have a strong opinion on ticket prices. They sound as if they have everything figured out. They know exactly how much $ to charge to make a profit.

Listen, the company is in the business to make money. There are market analysts, economists, marketing specialists, accountants, etc. that have an MBA and work FULL-TIME trying to figure the formula to make money. Just because you see $29.99 on the internet doesn't mean you know everything what's going on.

The closest comparison to the absurdity of your statement is this scenario: Imagine that you're sitting the flight deck ready to push off the gate, when one passenger comes up to you and says that you should fly over KY going to FL, because he heard over the Weather Channel that it's raining over VA.

 

[relief tube]

So you think 29.99 fares can make money? Really.

The only certain thing 29.99 fares do is support low F/O wages and not allow for pensions.

Ask those two of Airtran and what do you get?

 

[twepilot]

pensions have worked out great for the industry in the last 20 years. I'll take our 10.5% any day over a pension that may be bargained away or simply seized.

RV

 

[PCL_128]

So you think 29.99 fares can make money? Really.

The only certain thing 29.99 fares do is support low F/O wages and not allow for pensions.

Ask those two of Airtran and what do you get?

Do you really think we're filling up airplanes with $29 fares? It's a teaser fare. We offer a few seats with that fare, and everything else is much higher. I guarantee that your carrier does the same thing. Delta does it constantly.

 

[Ticker]

Listen up, Chief . . . . if we want any advice on how to ride out a bankruptcy, we'll be sure to look your lame @ss up, but until then, why don't you have a nice warm cup of STFU and go back to fellating Uppercrust?

FWIW, based on the Ass-clowns that your airline hired from my University . . . your passengers and everyone on any hilltop near SFO should thank God that most of you talentless imbeciles are flying Airbuses.

Ty

Doh! :cartman:

 

[airline#5]

20% Growth in a tanking economy... that makes as much sense as a round trip ticket for $29.99 (Oh wait, you guys do that...)

jester,

That post was sarcastic in nature by someone who doesn't like AirTran, not from anyone who works for AirTran.

HA!!!!

NEWS FLASH...MOST PEOPLE WHO WORK THERE DON'T LIKE IT.

WE TALKIN 'BOUT THE SAME AIRTRAN?

 

[Britpilot]

HA!!!!

NEWS FLASH...MOST PEOPLE WHO WORK THERE DON'T LIKE IT.

WE TALKIN 'BOUT THE SAME AIRTRAN?

Don't know, do you work there?