Air Wisconsin Vs. Pinnacle

skychicken

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I have recently received job offers from both AWAC and Pinnacle. I could use ANY info to help me make my decision! Thanks!
 

FlyinPiker

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IHaveAPension said:
Pinnacle for sure. More growth.

More growth?? Hows that. I'd say in terms of growth these two are neck to neck at close to..........NONE. More bodies to climb at PCL.....I guess you can take that into concideration.

People are always throwing up these X verses Y things and never giving any information on what's important to them in their situation.

How about you tell us what attracted you to both in the first place. The Pros and Cons as you see them....then maybe people can help you fine tune your particular situation.


Piker
 
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Rook

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Depends on several things...where would you like to be based? There's a better corporate culture at Willy. Does the United/USAir thing scare you? Do you mind a slow upgrade? Let's go to the scorecards...

I score it 115 to 113 for AW.

Contract negotiations won't be very pretty here at 9E. Especially under umbrella of the evil red empire. Good luck whatever you choose.

Rook
 

J32driver

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I work for AWAC. I've had friends that worked at 9E.

9E is pretty much done growing. AWAC is done for the moment, but that may change in the future. The company is currently participating in the 90 seat bidding with USAirways. They are trying to avoid trading 50 seaters for 90 seaters. They want to grow the fleet. Not stay the same size.

I don't know anything about attrition at 9E. At AWAC, we are starting to lose lots of people to other airlines. Captains are leaving for every large airline that is hiring. Some others have decided they don't want to commute to the east coast and are leaving the industry all together. Long story short, I would expect that AWAC would provide more upward mobility than 9E.

Corporate culture is a BIG deal in this one. AWAC is a very well run company from the standpoint of a pilot. My planes are well maintained, I have a pretty good contract, my dispatchers are top notch, and the pilot managers truly try to do right by the pilot group. I know that this company won't try to force me into doing something illegal or unsafe. As a pilot, I feel very well supported in my day to day operations. Its not all roses. We are currently displacing the entire company and the scheduling department can be difficult to deal with (managers fault, not the individual schedulers). But, all in all, its a good place to hang your hat.

I've heard that 9E is a little bit more of a day to day battle in order to go out and fly the planes.

The last piece of the puzzle, where do you want to live? Commuting sucks. It takes up a ton of your off time and induces more stress into your life than you would imagine. If you want to live in MEM, DTW, or MSP, then go work for 9E. If you want to live someplace on the east coast, then come work for Air Willy.
 

crashpad

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I have a buudy who's a very senior Capt. at Pinnacle and the best he can do now for days off is 12 a month! I checked his back for lash marks.
 

WSurf

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Just be cautious of most of the 50 seat RJ operators that don't have 70-90 seat growth in sight! Most (50 Seat Rj's) will be parked in the desert in the next 5-8 years!! I will see if I can find the article I read about all the 50 Jets..
So I would shoot for someone that has atleast a 2 year upgrade... Get your PIC time and find yourself a much better job... Good Luck!
 

FlyinPiker

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WSurf said:
Just be cautious of most of the 50 seat RJ operators that don't have 70-90 seat growth in sight! Most (50 Seat Rj's) will be parked in the desert in the next 5-8 years!!!

I'm pretty sure that's why airlines like Air Wisconsin have locked these airlines in with contracts that require these planes.....or at least a certain fleet number for what I believe is 12 years. PCL I'm sure has a pretty decent length service agreement not to mention NW owns all the airplanes. Can these carriers that are leading the way in the 70 seat arena guarantee that future airplane delieveries are growth and not replacements.

Just like Wsurf said.....50 seaters are going to the desert. If Air Wisconsin and PCL are protected.......who's do you thinks are going to go there first???? I'd say the 50 seat fleets of both PCL and Air Wis are safe.....for now.

I'm not trying to jack the thread....but all these CHQ guys riding the ride at disneyland over there need to wake the f up.

Piker
 
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Maiko

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You forgot about how great the maintenance controllers are;)

J32driver said:
Corporate culture is a BIG deal in this one. AWAC is a very well run company from the standpoint of a pilot. My planes are well maintained, I have a pretty good contract, my dispatchers are top notch, and the pilot managers truly try to do right by the pilot group. I know that this company won't try to force me into doing something illegal or unsafe. As a pilot, I feel very well supported in my day to day operations. Its not all roses. We are currently displacing the entire company and the scheduling department can be difficult to deal with (managers fault, not the individual schedulers). But, all in all, its a good place to hang your hat.
 

noonan

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Hey confused;
Good question, answer, go into construction. 9E is not even a rational choice for a sentient being. 9E is not going to grow in the next 5 years. They are done. All flying will go to companies that can keep airplanes in the air. The only thing that should be in the infield in MKE should be a shotstop, NOT SOMETHING WITH WINGLETS!
Good luck. Get out of aviation.
 

lionflyer

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As far as I know AWAC's growth is done also, but the attrition is thru the roof right now. We have lost 145 this year. You do the math. You might move up the list quicker than you think if you don't mind being based out east. I think we have more growth potential than Pinnacle. Right now we are on the brink of cancelling flights because of lack of crews, so any growth will just make matters worse.
 

J32driver

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Maiko said:
You forgot about how great the maintenance controllers are;)

Didn't forget. My momma just told me "if you can't say anything nice... don't say anything." Most of those guys are pretty good. There is only 1 that I've dealt with who obviously hates his life. I save all of my tray table write-ups for him.
 

DiverDriver

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J32driver said:
Most of those guys are pretty good. There is only 1 that I've dealt with who obviously hates his life. I save all of my tray table write-ups for him.


You too? :)
 

eastflier

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Without a doubt pinnacle. I have several freinds that are at AWCA and don;t get me wrong they love the company however they have been sitting on pins and needles the past year. There is just alot of things up in the air right now. Plus what guarantee do they have that they will grow with usair when the merger goes thru when there are companies that can easily underbid them.

They are a good company however lets face it it comes down to who has the best offer and during these financial times AWAC may just be to costly for airways to expand.
 

FlyinPiker

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eastflier said:
Without a doubt pinnacle. I have several freinds that are at AWCA and don;t get me wrong they love the company however they have been sitting on pins and needles the past year. There is just alot of things up in the air right now. Plus what guarantee do they have that they will grow with usair when the merger goes thru when there are companies that can easily underbid them.

They are a good company however lets face it it comes down to who has the best offer and during these financial times AWAC may just be to costly for airways to expand.

Those were all cons about AWAC....if you are saying "without a doubt Pinnacle" lets hear some "rosey" pros about what the future holds for Pinnacle. I still think it's a toss up....and one that sides toward AWAC. By the time you went to AWAC most of the pins and needles cr.ap will have already occured. From what I know bases have already been decided and contracts have been signed securing flying.

I think Pinnacle offers job security....but it also offers a very large seniority list that you will be at the bottom of and a sad looking contract compared to alot of the language/$$ making numbers that AWAC has. The question you have to ask yourself is where can you stand to be a F/O for the next 4 years, because that's what your possibly looking at when you go to both of these carriers.

Piker
 
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