Air Wisconsin flushes pool

[Butler]

To all out there that were waiting for a class date, they have officially flushed the pool. The letters are in the mail explaining everything. Sounds like they want to hire pilots with tons of time. Maybe someone should remind them they are a regional airline. What a bunch of B.S.!!!!!!

 

[Sppedmode]

Does Air Whiskey still have guys out on furlough? Just curious, I haven't heard much about them lately.

 

[SuperD]

Yep, just got the letter as well. I just don't see the advantage of completely draining a pool when you have a stash of qualified people in there. I think inviting the poolies to ATW for a little "follow-up" interview when hiring resumes would have been the better choice. Oh well, gotta love this business.

 

[snine3departure]

What a bunch of B.S. I wouldn't work there just because they did that. Sorry to the poolies.

 

[redsoxfan]

how long have pilots been in the pool at awac? i cant believe an airline would do that to people they have offered a position to, if awac is a good airline like they say they are, they need to honor there comitment to those pilots like the pilots did for awac when they needed them and the pilots took the time to prepare and go to the interview for them..if they want pilots with more time then they should train the pilots in the pool first then hire higher time pilots....this industry can be very rewarding but also very unforgiving!!!!!

 

[Butler]

Most of us in the pool were hired in the summer, myself being in the beginning of July. I'm still in disbelief that they would do this. It was awfully nice of them though to suggest reapplying when they start hiring again. Fat chance, I'll go elsewhere.

P.S. I'm not bitter...

 

[AWACoff]

Cry me a friggin' river! AWAC doesn't owe a darn thing to people they have tentatively offered a job too. Until you finish your first year, you can be fired without reason. Hello?!

I find the whole idea pretty idiotic considering the money they invested to interview these people so I definitely agree with the general sentiment.

AWAC still has 39 on furlough including myself. Please guys, do not be under any illusion that you owe anything to your company. They will put you out on the street if they find it financially beneficial. Those people in the pool that interviewed weren't "honoring a commitment" to AWAC. Stop being melodramatic. They were looking out for #1 (themselves).

 

[CRJ Driver]

AWAC

AWAC is a NATIONAL AIRLINE ....NOT A REGIONAL

 

[9rj9]

they pay like a regional

so I call them a regional

 

[SuperD]

They were looking out for #1 (themselves).

Just curious. Exactly how much money were we costing the company by being in the pool?

I do agree completely that there is no loyalty anywhere in this industry. We were not being "loyal" to AWAC by being in the pool (most of us were probably hired elsewhere), and they don't have any obligation to hire us right now just because we're in the pool. But why start completely from scratch?

Anyway, it's probably for the best since this is a terrible time to be starting out at the bottom of anyone's seniority list.

SuperD

 

[rightrudder]

Hey Snine,

With your background, you're hardly in a position to be given the opportunity to turn down AWAC. Good luck with your Commutair interview.

 

[SuperD]

rightrudder,

Your post seems to imply that CommutAir hires inferior pilots. Surely I must have misunderstood you. Quite a few of those poolies were from CommutAir, so AWAC must have thought that they were good enough.

SuperD

 

[AWACoff]

I'm sure he was simply pointing out that Snine only has 1300TT while AWAC mins are 1500/500. Why they would dump everybody in the poo after spending all that money to interview them I don't know. It does seem like an odd move. As for AWAC paying like a regional...I don't know of too many regionals that top out at $117.08/hr currently with $135.65/hr by 2005. 2nd year FO pay of $35.01/hr isn't too shabby either. You can live pretty comfortably on that. Let's not get into the whole regional vs national debate. We all know how ridiculous the national vs major thread was for Comair. Comair is just as much a "regional" as AWAC as far as the public is concerned.

 

[rightrudder]

Yes, I am only pointing out that Snine does not possess the experience level that Air Wisconsin requires and expects to see in an applicant (previous turbine experience, 121 preferred, as well as minimum time requirements). I am not slandering CommutAir pilots in any way, flying a 1900 around in crummy weather is no easy task.

Snine has been asking for lots of advice on this board about getting hired, and why his/her cfi experience shouldn't be as valued as someone with previous 121 experience.

Anyhow, I just found it ironic that this person would state that they wouldn't work for a carrier that they are not even qualified to apply to.

And, I am sorry that those of you in the pool are out of luck. I have a friend in the same situation.

 

[ksus]

Sorry to hear that! But it didn't cost the company a penny to have the pool going. They probably figured with so many qualified pilots in the street why keep the pool going with low time guys, when they can get more experienced pilots. You are right they are looking for #1!

 

[cheezpilot]

Getting to the bottom

Hey all you poolies. I am trying to find out what the deal is because from my perspective the pool was not a burden to keep open. Will try and get back to you all. I know for a fact that some pilots in the pool got the letter and had over 4000hrs.

 

[Hosed COEX]

You know, it's still a pretty lousy thing to do. AWAC thinks they can go out and get "more qualified pilots". Surely those in the pool were qualified to AWAC's standards before, so now suddenly they are not qualified just because of all the pilots on the street who have more flight time? Flying an RJ is not rocket science, and 1500/500 is generally more than adequate to the task.

Regionals who are going out and hiring only 3000+ hour pilots "just because they can get them" are going to be paying the price later by losing them to attrition when majors start hiring again in a couple of years.

 

[9rj9]

major hiring

majors will never hire again if scope is not enforced. Comair/ASA guys will be flying the MD-80 soon if this is allowed to continue. Delta guys need to strike !!!

 

[Capt. Over]

Why keep a pool of people when they need to make room for all the furloughed UAL guys they could hire and not make give up the seniority number that all the other furloughees would have to give up. Some other Regionals like AWAC are doing that with their major partners so the major furloughees can keep their number. I wouldn't worry about it for the guys getting dumped...there's many more regionals that are just as good and some a lot better. AWAC certainly isn't the worst Regional to work for, but it certainly isn't the best just for the fact that they are tied to that "great" place called UAL. Good luck!

 

[publisher]

When you consider that the people in the pool have been there for 3 quarters and AW probably does not see a need for awhile, I am sure they just said, let's start again when we need to and see who is available then.

a one year old pool gets a bit stale.

 

[AWACoff]

I flew at Lakes with one of the guys that was in the pool. He had 2 types and over 6000TT with over 3000 PIC turbine (part 23 and part 25). That seems to qualify him. I guess we can all sit and wait. I would like to see a list of regionals that the majority of people consider better than AWAC. I don't think anybody could claim realistically that their's is the best but I would think AWAC would be in the top 5. Best contract in the regional industry (trip rig, duty rig, pay rates, schedules) certainly is nice. Being privately owned is an oddball. Why is everything in Wisconsin a private deal, eh? Packers, AWAC, etc...hmmm...

 

[Capt. Over]

Best contract....seems every regional claims to have one of those. It seems that the regional with the best contract is always the one you happen to work for at the time. Yeah, I used to work there so my opinions, though they are just that, aren't totally unfounded.

 

[AWACoff]

From management:

Numerous background checks have expired for the people in the pool. Some were interviewed over a year ago. There is no forecast hiring for the year 2002. Only 20 of 39 furloughees are expected to be recalled prior to 2003. There is no reason to leave these people hanging with no forecast hiring in the near future.

This is paraphrased but is a reasonable representation to the best of my knowledge.

 

[Speedtree]

hiring

Just curious about awac growth. If they are still taking delivery of three rj's per month and picking up more flying it should only be a matter of time before the furloughees are back and they need more pilots. Are they still getting rid of the do328s at the same pace?

 

[CRJ Driver]

With 2 CRJ's a month delivered and 1-2 DO328's going away a month, net growth ZERO........

 

[cheezpilot]

low down

Things seem to be working this way. We are getting rid of 5 Bae146's, and 13 D328's. In the mean time we are taking delivery of two to three CRj's a month. The growth probably won't catch up to the declining fleet for a while. Management has said that it is unfair for them to keep a pool going for up to a year and a half and string along those guys in it. Also the background check deal has changed which has presented problems with keeping an old pool open. It was also mentioned that it is unfair to the customers of AWAC to not hire the best pilots around when they start hiring again. As far as hiring UAL's furloughees. I think that is pure speculation and has no foundation what so ever. Infact AWAC most certainly will refuse any major furlougee that will not give up his seniority. I just can't see that happening considering that AWAC will not hire back its former emplyees. However, resumes can be kept up to date and those previously hired will have no problem getting another interview in the future. Recommendations from a AWAC pilot have also been endorsed as being very helpful when the hiring does start up again. I am sure that mentioning you were a previously hired pilot will not hurt. AWAC changed the new hire minimums three times in the first few months I worked for them from 2500tt/1000multi/500 turbine to 2000tt/500multi, and then to 1500tt/500multi. They will demand what the market can give them. Sorry dudes.

 

[SuperD]

WHAT?

It was also mentioned that it is unfair to the customers of AWAC to not hire the best pilots around when they start hiring again.

You have GOT to be kidding!

 

[undcmsu]

Don't you think AWAC customers as well as their current pilots deserve the most qualified people up front?! I know it sucks, but deal with it, it's all part of the game.

 

[SuperD]

Of course I do. I think every airline deserves the best they can get. However, it just seems odd how a qualified group of pilots can suddenly become unqualified in the eyes of the company. AWAC boasts the highest hiring minimums of any regional and last summer (when the pool started), they were only hiring people with prior 121 experience. I don't see how all of these people suddenly are not good enough.

Anyway, I'm done griping about this now. I was mainly concerned about the poolies who are currently furloughed or otherwise unemployed. I currently have a job that I would not leave for AWAC anyway, so it's a moot point.

SuperD

 

[Marko Ramius]

Cheezpilot,

Good post, there are no plans for UAL furloughees to go to any UAX carrier at this time, and I would expect that to be the case in the future as well. I think people just like to start rumours because a few months ago, people were saying that it was a done deal that we were going to ACA. This idea hasn't even been mentioned by our union leadership, nor are there are resolutions to do so in the future. Basically it's urban legend.