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Age 65 Stinks

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Hey guys, thanks for waiting! I just got back from beating that dead horse across the street and, well - it's still dead......

Whew! That was close!
 
Received copy of this email today,

"xxxxxx,
Last week, Capt. Brian McManus, a Delta 767ER pilot, landed at JFK, drove home to Conn. The next morning he was found dead. HE WAS 49 YEARS OLD. He missed passing away in flight by about 12 hours. Perhaps the mandatory age should be 49 ! By the way, Capt McManus was a staunch advocate of keeping the age at 60, since as he once told me, "60 is when you really start to become a health risk"
xxxx

http://www.legacy.com/HartfordCourant/DeathNotices.asp?Page=LifeStory&PersonID=128012722
 
I know............you old geezers can go ahead and fly till you keel over at the controls.....but I say that whoever is flying with you at the time has immediate rights to you seniority number. That should fix the problem.
 
FoxHunter said:
Received copy of this email today,

"xxxxxx,
Last week, Capt. Brian McManus, a Delta 767ER pilot, landed at JFK, drove home to Conn. The next morning he was found dead. HE WAS 49 YEARS OLD. He missed passing away in flight by about 12 hours. Perhaps the mandatory age should be 49 ! By the way, Capt McManus was a staunch advocate of keeping the age at 60, since as he once told me, "60 is when you really start to become a health risk"
xxxx

http://www.legacy.com/HartfordCourant/DeathNotices.asp?Page=LifeStory&PersonID=128012722
Click to expand...

That sort of death has always been a reality. The difference now is if Capt. McManus perishes in flight, the remaining pilot might be well over 60. We don't know for sure what's going to happen, but that day is getting closer. If you knew the details of CAL's B757 divert with a dead pilot a few years ago, you'd have a more cautionary attitude. We're one bad day from there being a separate govt agency established to monitor our health, and being forced to wear a defibulator wired to the standby bus while in flight. All so you can work a little longer.
 
Flopgut:

It's just all about you and anything to get what you want. As I have commented before, you and your crowd would gladly kick your own parents out of their homes and into the street so you could move in. They're just too old to enjoy what they worked so hard to have. It's your turn, right?
 
avbug said:
Same old tired song. Your sense of entitlement. You wan to live and die by seniority, but feel you're entitled to what those more senior than you have.
Click to expand...

Entitlement? What's ironic is that the pilots who retired at age 60 years ago gave those of you who pushed for 65 the opportunity to get where you are when you did. Yet you are "entitled" to a little more?

avbug said:
If this is too much for you to fathom, find another line of work.
Click to expand...

No. This is a pilot board. Pilots do three things. Eat, Fly, and Bitch. If you don't like it, find another line of work.
 
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FoxHunter said:
Received copy of this email today,

"xxxxxx,
Last week, Capt. Brian McManus, a Delta 767ER pilot, landed at JFK, drove home to Conn. The next morning he was found dead. HE WAS 49 YEARS OLD. He missed passing away in flight by about 12 hours. Perhaps the mandatory age should be 49 ! By the way, Capt McManus was a staunch advocate of keeping the age at 60, since as he once told me, "60 is when you really start to become a health risk"
xxxx

http://www.legacy.com/HartfordCourant/DeathNotices.asp?Page=LifeStory&PersonID=128012722
Click to expand...

You sir are a moron.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Brian is suspected to have die of something else than a natural death. I'll leave it at that out of respect for him.

Age 60 should never have been changed. ALPA should have fought it tooth and nail, since the majority of ALPA members did not want it changed. The fact of the matter is most of the pro 60+ pilots, at legacies, have been making >150K a year for the last 15+ years. And now all of the sudden, if they retire they are going to be bankrupt. BS, 3-4 more years is not going to change the mess you have made out of your life. This is all about greed, and about John Prater returning favors. I hope he is happy, he has pushed this profession even further down the sh** hole. I hope you or any guy over 60 still flying is very proud of the fact that some of us might be furloughed in our 30s with wife and young children and have never made over 100K yet, while you enjoy the time you all stole from us.

Please don't mention BM on this board anymore.
 
FoxHunter said:
Received copy of this email today,

"xxxxxx,
Last week, Capt. Brian McManus, a Delta 767ER pilot, landed at JFK, drove home to Conn. The next morning he was found dead. HE WAS 49 YEARS OLD. He missed passing away in flight by about 12 hours. Perhaps the mandatory age should be 49 ! By the way, Capt McManus was a staunch advocate of keeping the age at 60, since as he once told me, "60 is when you really start to become a health risk"
xxxx

http://www.legacy.com/HartfordCourant/DeathNotices.asp?Page=LifeStory&PersonID=128012722
Click to expand...

FoxHunter, are you suggesting we lower the retirement age? I mean, if people dying in-flight are all in their 50's or even 40's, can you please tell me how it makes any sense to RAISE the mandatory retirement age?
 
jetjockey#1 said:
You sir are a moron.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Brian is suspected to have die of something else than a natural death. I'll leave it at that out of respect for him.

Age 60 should never have been changed. ALPA should have fought it tooth and nail, since the majority of ALPA members did not want it changed. The fact of the matter is most of the pro 60+ pilots, at legacies, have been making >150K a year for the last 15+ years. And now all of the sudden, if they retire they are going to be bankrupt. BS, 3-4 more years is not going to change the mess you have made out of your life. This is all about greed, and about John Prater returning favors. I hope he is happy, he has pushed this profession even further down the sh** hole. I hope you or any guy over 60 still flying is very proud of the fact that some of us might be furloughed in our 30s with wife and young children and have never made over 100K yet, while you enjoy the time you all stole from us.

Please don't mention BM on this board anymore.
Click to expand...

Sorry for your unhappy state of affairs. Although there were times in the past that I thought my timing could have much better I find in hindsight I could not have been more lucky. When your furlough time starts to exceed my 8+ years you may start to make me feel guilty.
 
Freight Dog said:
FoxHunter, are you suggesting we lower the retirement age? I mean, if people dying in-flight are all in their 50's or even 40's, can you please tell me how it makes any sense to RAISE the mandatory retirement age?
Click to expand...

The medical experts say age is not an issue. You can expect to see the age raised to 70 or eliminated like they have done in Canada, Australia, and NZ.
Lucky you!
 
FoxHunter said:
Sorry for your unhappy state of affairs. Although there were times in the past that I thought my timing could have much better I find in hindsight I could not have been more lucky. When your furlough time starts to exceed my 8+ years you may start to make me feel guilty.
Click to expand...

How much time do you think you have left?

With the kind of flying you do, it surely isn't much.
 
FoxHunter said:
The medical experts say age is not an issue. You can expect to see the age raised to 70 or eliminated like they have done in Canada, Australia, and NZ.
Lucky you!
Click to expand...

How many medical experts are flying the line with you old guys?

How many have you had in the jumpseat observing your performance?

My wife is a miitary flight surgeon, and she's vehemently opposed to raising the retirement age. A number of her peers feel the same way... I guess it's only 'certain' medical experts that say it's OK.
 
Last edited:
FoxHunter said:
Sorry for your unhappy state of affairs. Although there were times in the past that I thought my timing could have much better I find in hindsight I could not have been more lucky. When your furlough time starts to exceed my 8+ years you may start to make me feel guilty.
Click to expand...

you sir on top of being a moron, you are a liar.

Please tell me when has Delta furloughed somebody for 8+ years. The other first officer on this trip was hired July01 and furloughed soon there after. He came back at the first recall on October 04. A good buddy of mine was hired in late 91 and furlough thereafter, he came back 95.....so and so on. Since you claim to know BM I assumed you are a DAL guy, so when did you exactly get furloughed 8+ years without a recall.....

...Right, anyway, increasing age 60 is wrong, it's why Prater was elected. I flew at CAL mainline for 17 months in 05 so I know. Prater was put in office for one reason, raise the age 60. That's why he got the necessary money to get to the ALPA top office. The flip side of that coin is, he will not be reelected to office, and, he will go down in history as the worst ALPA president ever.
He has screwed so many junior guys at his own airline it's not even funny. And even at his own airline, they're still trying to take it back...... I wish them well, and at least I hope they don't have to show up 30 extra minutes early at check in, without counting towards duty or per diem..... That's Prater airline.
 
jetjockey#1 said:
you sir on top of being a moron, you are a liar.

Please tell me when has Delta furloughed somebody for 8+ years. The other first officer on this trip was hired July01 and furloughed soon there after. He came back at the first recall on October 04. A good buddy of mine was hired in late 91 and furlough thereafter, he came back 95.....so and so on. Since you claim to know BM I assumed you are a DAL guy, so when did you exactly get furloughed 8+ years without a recall.....

...Right, anyway, increasing age 60 is wrong, it's why Prater was elected. I flew at CAL mainline for 17 months in 05 so I know. Prater was put in office for one reason, raise the age 60. That's why he got the necessary money to get to the ALPA top office. The flip side of that coin is, he will not be reelected to office, and, he will go down in history as the worst ALPA president ever.
He has screwed so many junior guys at his own airline it's not even funny. And even at his own airline, they're still trying to take it back...... I wish them well, and at least I hope they don't have to show up 30 extra minutes early at check in, without counting towards duty or per diem..... That's Prater airline.
Click to expand...

I never heard of BM until his name was mentioned in an email sent to me. I started with Seaboard World Airlines as a DC8 F/O, worked 6 months, furloughed the first time 5 years, recalled worked 5 months, furloughed 2 months, recalled worked three months, furloughed three months, recalled, worked three months, furloughed two years, recalled thought I had a steady job, 747 F/O, Flying Tiger Line bought Seaboard. Forced off the 747 back to the DC8, then furloughed by FTL out of seniority. Recalled 6 months later after a settlement. In 1989 FedEx bought Tigers. Pure dumb luck, the only important thing in this business. BTW while on furlough I worked for Capitol International, East African Airways, Beech Aircraft, Aerovias Quisqueyana, International Air Bahama, EFS Bahamas, Sterling Philippines, Evergreen, ONA. Hope I didnt leave any out!;):D

Never tried Delta.
 
zonker said:
Wow, that is an awful schedule...and your age doesn't bode well for you.

You have to be worried about your health.
Click to expand...

I've been worried about my health since I decided I wanted to be an airline pilot, I think age 16.

My primary care Doc says I'm one of the most healthy patients he has.:beer:
I still try to run 3-4 miles a day, play golf, ride a couple of horses a day. Worked real hard to make it to age 60, now have to shoot for 65, heck in another couple of years it may be 70 or greater!!!:D
 
FoxHunter said:
I've been worried about my health since I decided I wanted to be an airline pilot, I think age 16.

My primary care Doc says I'm one of the most healthy patients he has.:beer:
I still try to run 3-4 miles a day, play golf, ride a couple of horses a day. Worked real hard to make it to age 60, now have to shoot for 65, heck in another couple of years it may be 70 or greater!!!:D
Click to expand...


That should be your right.

We should not interfere with the free market.
 
Last edited:
FoxHunter said:
I've been worried about my health since I decided I wanted to be an airline pilot, I think age 16.

My primary care Doc says I'm one of the most healthy patients he has.:beer:
I still try to run 3-4 miles a day, play golf, ride a couple of horses a day. Worked real hard to make it to age 60, now have to shoot for 65, heck in another couple of years it may be 70 or greater!!!:D
Click to expand...

Ahhh.. Yea sure. you run 3 miles a day. sure you do.
 
FoxHunter said:
I never heard of BM until his name was mentioned in an email sent to me. I started with Seaboard World Airlines as a DC8 F/O, worked 6 months, furloughed the first time 5 years, recalled worked 5 months, furloughed 2 months, recalled worked three months, furloughed three months, recalled, worked three months, furloughed two years, recalled thought I had a steady job, 747 F/O, Flying Tiger Line bought Seaboard. Forced off the 747 back to the DC8, then furloughed by FTL out of seniority. Recalled 6 months later after a settlement. In 1989 FedEx bought Tigers. Pure dumb luck, the only important thing in this business. BTW while on furlough I worked for Capitol International, East African Airways, Beech Aircraft, Aerovias Quisqueyana, International Air Bahama, EFS Bahamas, Sterling Philippines, Evergreen, ONA. Hope I didnt leave any out!;):D

Never tried Delta.
Click to expand...

So when you were furloughed there were jobs available? Lucky you, indeed! That's not the case these days and your enthusiasm for this painful reality being visited on those junior to you is clear. The fact that you are enjoying making it worse for them is sickening!

BTW, were you jumpseating to Mexico City out of IAH about 3 years ago?
 
Last edited:
FoxHunter said:
Forced off the 747 back to the DC8, then furloughed by FTL out of seniority. Recalled 6 months later after a settlement.
Click to expand...

Tell us more about this settlement?

I'm working on an idea for a sort of settlement that might rectify the retirement age issue. I want to sue ALPA.
 

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