Abx?

[xspud]

Just got wind of a big meeting in the Hoot tonight in the crew lounge.

An update from the meeting would be appreciated, if you're there!

 

[HeavyjetDC8]

A meeting in the crew lounge? One of the prophets with a finger on the ABX pulse spewing forth tidbits of wisdom to his perpetually confused acolytes at a table gathering? How very special.

Actually, what I heard, from a verifiable source, was that.......

But no, best wait until the proffer comes out. Just remember that you read it here first.

 

[xspud]

A meeting in the crew lounge? One of the prophets with a finger on the ABX pulse spewing forth tidbits of wisdom to his perpetually confused acolytes at a table gathering? How very special.

I assume J-Jet is talking about a management meeting with the pilot group. If not, you're right, we don't need an update from the table gatherings. We can spread all the unverifiable rumors we like right here without the bother of going to H-ville!

 

[ABXbooger]

Well, was there a crew meeting last night? Anyone care to update, or PM.

 

[xspud]

Update on company website implies that the major hurdle is getting Japanese government approval. I would assume we have an excellent shot at receiving approval with ANA the driving force behind the application, but I assume we won't see a proffer until approval is forthcoming. I wonder how long the JCAB review typically takes, or if a foreign ACMI is unusual?

In the meantime, ABX has some time, some "breathing room" to get prepared for the "implementation phase". There is plenty of technical work which is presumably underway as we speak. And there is an opportunity to negotiate and communicate with the union/pilot group on how this would be implemented. I believe that we're prepared to do the "hard work" of getting this done, as the man said. We just have to be included in the process.

 

[abxaviator]

Pathetic, Inept, Wholly Incompetent, Total Joke, Unprofessional, Embarrassing…​

These – and other words and phrases – were used by ABX Crewmembers to describe Management’s performance at the crew meeting held Thursday night/Friday morning. Instead of a creating a win-win situation out of the ANA Charter opportunity, Management has turned it into a potential lose-lose proposition.

How did this happen? For the past several months the Management negotiating team – comprised of Bob Morgenfeld, Bob Boja, Mike Vollmer and Mark Detroit – has flip-flopped several times over whether they needed to negotiate International Operations. They recently fessed-up to being in negotiations with ANA, which is welcome news, but it requires serious discussions about international operations.

When attempting to negotiate international crew schedules, rest periods, hotels, meals, transportation and the like, the union negotiating team hit a brick wall. The Management negotiating team could not provide accurate information on block hours, number of crews needed, transportation, hotels … or anything else for that matter. Their response to the union’s questions was: we don’t know, we haven’t thought about it, and the like.

Reportedly, Joe Hete decided that ABX would simply open a domicile in Japan. The only problem is that the Company has to enter into negotiations under section 6 and negotiate the changes necessary to Article 14 (New Domiciles).

The union sent a section 6 notice to the Company, and Management responded by ordering the union to produce its proposal several work days in advance of the planned meeting date. Of course there were less than ten-days between the date of the letter and the Company’s imposed due date.

The union advised the Company that it had hired consultants to identify and advise the union on all of the issues involved in creating and staffing a foreign domicile. The union made it clear that it was not going to negotiate on this important issue from a position of ignorance. The union would need time to evaluate and determine the implications and ramifications of a Japan domicile on the Crewmembers.

The Company then resorted to their old tired tactic of creating a crisis to get its way … call a meeting with the crews, we only have 42 days to staff the Japan domicile! This ham-fisted attempt to get the crews to stampede the Executive Board into accepting an unacceptable agreement was stoked with Management’s cries of … It’s up to your Union.” (Interesting aside: Bob Morgenfeld had spoken with Dave Ross on Thursday, yet neglected to mention his plans for the crew meeting that evening.)

Of course, when pressed by the crewmembers the Management team was unable to answer any questions about how the Japan Domicile would impact pensions, 401(k) plans, taxes, health insurance (maybe United Health Care will reimburse a crewmember after he pays all the bills), housing, transportation, education of children, cost of living, etc. They also became exacerbated when asked how a crewmember could bid on this if they don’t have any of the information. Their answer was a curt: Just don’t bid on it then.

This bums rush tactic has never worked, and it never will. It only leads crewmembers to believe that their management is, well … pathetic, inept, wholly incompetent, a total joke, unprofessional and embarrassing.

 

[abxaviator]

Pathetic, Inept, Wholly Incompetent, Total Joke, Unprofessional, Embarrassing…​

These – and other words and phrases – were used by ABX Crewmembers to describe Management’s performance at the crew meeting held Thursday night/Friday morning. Instead of a creating a win-win situation out of the ANA Charter opportunity, Management has turned it into a potential lose-lose proposition.

How did this happen? For the past several months the Management negotiating team – comprised of Bob Morgenfeld, Bob Boja, Mike Vollmer and Mark Detroit – has flip-flopped several times over whether they needed to negotiate International Operations. They recently fessed-up to being in negotiations with ANA, which is welcome news, but it requires serious discussions about international operations.

When attempting to negotiate international crew schedules, rest periods, hotels, meals, transportation and the like, the union negotiating team hit a brick wall. The Management negotiating team could not provide accurate information on block hours, number of crews needed, transportation, hotels … or anything else for that matter. Their response to the union’s questions was: we don’t know, we haven’t thought about it, and the like.

Reportedly, Joe Hete decided that ABX would simply open a domicile in Japan. The only problem is that the Company has to enter into negotiations under section 6 and negotiate the changes necessary to Article 14 (New Domiciles).

The union sent a section 6 notice to the Company, and Management responded by ordering the union to produce its proposal several work days in advance of the planned meeting date. Of course there were less than ten-days between the date of the letter and the Company’s imposed due date.

The union advised the Company that it had hired consultants to identify and advise the union on all of the issues involved in creating and staffing a foreign domicile. The union made it clear that it was not going to negotiate on this important issue from a position of ignorance. The union would need time to evaluate and determine the implications and ramifications of a Japan domicile on the Crewmembers.

The Company then resorted to their old tired tactic of creating a crisis to get its way … call a meeting with the crews, we only have 42 days to staff the Japan domicile! This ham-fisted attempt to get the crews to stampede the Executive Board into accepting an unacceptable agreement was stoked with Management’s cries of … It’s up to your Union.” (Interesting aside: Bob Morgenfeld had spoken with Dave Ross on Thursday, yet neglected to mention his plans for the crew meeting that evening.)

Of course, when pressed by the crewmembers the Management team was unable to answer any questions about how the Japan Domicile would impact pensions, 401(k) plans, taxes, health insurance (maybe United Health Care will reimburse a crewmember after he pays all the bills), housing, transportation, education of children, cost of living, etc. They also became exacerbated when asked how a crewmember could bid on this if they don’t have any of the information. Their answer was a curt: Just don’t bid on it then.

This bums rush tactic has never worked, and it never will. It only leads crewmembers to believe that their management is, well … pathetic, inept, wholly incompetent, a total joke, unprofessional and embarrassing.

 

[hvydriver]

Ugh. I hope it works out for you guys. It sounds like we've got the same management teams. Don't let them paint you into a corner. It looks like your Executive Board is handling it well!

 

[penguin22]

Pathetic, Inept, Wholly Incompetent, Total Joke, Unprofessional, Embarrassing…


that pretty much sums up everything I've heard about last night too. Our Flight Dept management, when the task proves a bit daunting, is not exactly inspiring

Sounds like they put more planning into last nights menu... eggrolls, and was there sushi too?

I hear a bid is coming out shortly. Think I'll pass.

 

[scarface]

Yes, there was sushi and yes there will be a proffer for an Osaka base, according to last nights meeting, in the near future.