AAI Pilots Expectations for January 2015

[Roomwithaview]

My understanding is that Vacancy looks at the entire pilot groups Vacancy choices and then awards you the position your seniority can hold.

We are operating in a different environment now in the sense that there are pilots being assigned an artificial seniority as a F.O. the whole point behind the 2015 fence.

You're saying that these pilots will still be held back from exercising their Master Seniority even after 2015?

I don't think so. That's not the way our Vacancy system works.

7. All new vacancies put up for bid as well as all secondary vacancies left open by successful bidders will be available to all pilots in the system. No pilot will be involuntarily displaced from a domicile, equipment or crew position except as provided herein.
a. In the event that a reduction in crews occurs in a domicile, this reduction will be posted as an equipment and domicile bid, and the Master Bids on file at the time of closing will govern.
b. If an insufficient number of pilots have bid to leave the base, the most junior pilots will be displaced. Pilots so displaced may displace pilots in other domiciles where no vacancy exists based on their system seniority, thereby causing a secondary displacement.

 

[redflyer65]

If I was an AirTran pilot my expectations would be a job infinitely better than what I had and would gladly sit in the back with a nice warm cup of STFU.

Nice!

 

[HowardBorden]

My understanding is that Vacancy looks at the entire pilot groups Vacancy choices and then awards you the position your seniority can hold.

We are operating in a different environment now in the sense that there are pilots being assigned an artificial seniority as a F.O. the whole point behind the 2015 fence.

You're saying that these pilots will still be held back from exercising their Master Seniority even after 2015?

I don't think so. That's not the way our Vacancy system works.

7. All new vacancies put up for bid as well as all secondary vacancies left open by successful bidders will be available to all pilots in the system. No pilot will be involuntarily displaced from a domicile, equipment or crew position except as provided herein.
a. In the event that a reduction in crews occurs in a domicile, this reduction will be posted as an equipment and domicile bid, and the Master Bids on file at the time of closing will govern.
b. If an insufficient number of pilots have bid to leave the base, the most junior pilots will be displaced. Pilots so displaced may displace pilots in other domiciles where no vacancy exists based on their system seniority, thereby causing a secondary displacement.

This section refers to simply moving pilots around the system with a zero increase in total positions. Pilots will not be downgraded out of a seat unless there is an actual reduction in total Captain seats, but the displacement language can involuntarily move you around the system to a Captain seat in another domicile. If the total number of Captain seats is increased post 2015 those positions will be filled by the most senior pilots on the global seniority list. At least that is how I understand it.

 

[shagadelic]

There are lance captains and a few senior FO's right now that are senior enough to hold captain. If there is not a net gain in Captains, they can't bid in and hold captain...period. If, in January of 2015, there is a vacancy creating +20 captains, exactly 20 people, most likely former Air Tran, will be able to bid into those positions. The bottom captain can not be displaced, UNLESS there is a reduction of captains....in which case, it will be a long time before that individual will get back to the left seat, as there is no right of return.

That's how it works.

 

[HowardBorden]

There are lance captains and a few senior FO's right now that are senior enough to hold captain. If there is not a net gain in Captains, they can't bid in and hold captain...period. If, in January of 2015, there is a vacancy creating +20 captains, exactly 20 people, most likely former Air Tran, will be able to bid into those positions. The bottom captain can not be displaced, UNLESS there is a reduction of captains....in which case, it will be a long time before that individual will get back to the left seat, as there is no right of return.

That's how it works.

The Flying Spaghetti Monster speaks the truth.

 

[Ty Webb]

If I was an AirTran pilot my expectations would be a job infinitely better than what I had and would gladly sit in the back with a nice warm cup of STFU.

Reading your post, while on a 26 hour layover at a Caribbean island resort, really drives home how truly ignorant you are of what it's like over here. :laugh:

I'm going to the beach. Y'all have fun with this one.

Ty

 

[Roomwithaview]

Shag

There are lance captains and a few senior FO's right now that are senior enough to hold captain. If there is not a net gain in Captains, they can't bid in and hold captain...period. If, in January of 2015, there is a vacancy creating +20 captains, exactly 20 people, most likely former Air Tran, will be able to bid into those positions.

I got what you're saying even though I can't find anything in the contract that clearly spells that out. I guess a couple concerns I have are the secondary vacancy issue, and the fact that we've never had this many pilots that will want and have a bid in for a capt spot that on an instant date will now be able to hold it, on paper at least. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 500 is what I've been told.

Then there's the caveat about the 717 guys losing their spots. I thought I remembered some language in there regarding that issue as well and was wondering how that would play out.

I was hoping for more input from the AAI side since I don't have access to their SL only our contract and SL-10. After 2015 we'll all be in the same bidding boat and it would be nice to have information on how things are going to go down post reconstruction.

RAV

 

[HowardBorden]

I was hoping for more input from the AAI side since I don't have access to their SL only our contract and SL-10. After 2015 we'll all be in the same bidding boat and it would be nice to have information on how things are going to go down post reconstruction.

RAV

Go to SWAPA.org - News - AirTran Transition Info and you will find all the documents including the ALPA contract and side letter.

 

[Roomwithaview]

Howard

Thanks for all that. Kind of raises even more questions for me.

There's this

Until January 1, 2015, all 737 Captain will be filled by current Southwest pilots. After that date, Captain vacancies at SWA will be determined by system seniority.

and then this

A. AirTran pilots whose seat position is eliminated by reduction of the B717 fleet will bid system seniority for their new assignment. (27.F.2.)

Which brings up the question of what the definition of "system seniority" bid is.

I know what it meant in the past. Thoughts?

 

[scoreboardII]

It means what it means, system. Not domicile.