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400 or Ultra?

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BeechScrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2002
Posts
107
I was lucky enough to be offered a job with NJA the other day. Linda offered me the 400 or the Ultra, starting on the same day. Does anyone have any feedback on which might be the way to go. I'm leaning toward the 400, but for no particular reason. Can anyone provide me with details on the differences one might expect with these two fleets? Some info on overtime possibilities would be helpful. Thanks.
 
The Ultra's have been showing their age for quite some time now and they work far more then the 400's.

The 400 has very short legs by comparison and there aren't too many of them. Many feel it was a mistake for NJA to get these planes.

That pretty much sums it up. If you want to fly.....Ultra.
If you want to sit around and practically do nothing....400XP.
 
I think the 400's all have TCAS. Plus its a (little bit) taller cabin so you don't have to scrunch quite as much when you are cleaning it.
 
What is the future of the 400 at NJA? Are they still taking deliveries, other than in Europe? Are there still orders out there? How old is the fleet that they have?
 
A quote from a friend in 400 ground school,

"Every time I turn arround we learn about another system that I swear is designed to kill me! I can't fly when its hot. I can't fly when it's cold. Who the hell designed this thing?"

Now that's funny right there!
 
Spent 5yrs on the ultra and its a nice airplane. The Ultra is going to be replaced with the EncorePlus so i would go to the ultra. My two cents worth.
 
I spent 4 years in the U-boat. It's a fun airplane, and their work load is finally getting saner as the fleet ages. You'll still fly more in the Ultra than the 400 as of right now. NJA has cancelled all remaining U.S.A. Netjets 400 orders, although they seem to love them at NJE.
 
I threw my bid in the hat for upgrading on the first thing I could get, and landed the Ultra.

I've been on the fleet coming up on two years (came out of the XL - apu aircraft as an FO).

I'm very happy on the Ultra. As the others have said, the workload is very manageable. The 400 guys apparently sit around alot (not a good thing, necessarily, especially when doing Hot Spare).

The Ultra breaks enough that you can sit around plenty.

I usually get one or two days a tour sitting around with broken plane, meaning hotel time.

Compared to the XL, the lifestyle on the road is much, much nicer. Last tour, the earliest show I think we had was a 8 am on the first day. Again, there are fewer Overtime opportunities as well, but as a new hire, this is not really as large as a gain (meaning, your pay rate for OT isn't high enough to warrant the ballbu**ng schedule).

The 400's smell better inside, and have TCAS.

Come on over! I'm very happy I ended up flying the 560 "Classic" as opposed to the 400. Just one opinion.
 
"Every time I turn arround we learn about another system that I swear is designed to kill me! I can't fly when its hot. I can't fly when it's cold. Who the hell designed this thing?"
Click to expand...

The same people that designed kamikaze bombers and the MU-2...
 
One thing nice about the Encore, is if you ever want to move up to a larger Citation (such as the XLS), many of the systems are identical. Which makes it easier for a transition.
 
Ok, having been one of the first guys trained on the 400 at NJA and having also flown the Ultra this is a easy one. The Ultra, it is getting old, but you won't sit near as much HOT SPARE and besides having TCAS and better radios, (I love the Collins) the 400 is a crap pile of a jet. It was thrown together in a bad way.

You sit hot spare in the 400 because it can't really do much else. A lot of ultra owners hate it because it can't do what the ultra does as far as trips. The schedulers hate the plane also so they take it out on the flight crews. I would guess that the 400s days are numbered at NJA also.
 
Hummmmmm....a/c that is no good for pax trips but it might just be the ticket for transporting crews.

Hope that doesn't happen like it used to when EJM used to shuttle us around in the King Air.
 
Upgrade Time

Well, I just looked at crewops, started Aug, 2005, around 100 numbers ahead of me to upgrade into a 560E, around 170 into an XL.
 
If you want to learn how to glide a jet, choose the 400XP. Otherwise, I'd go for the Ultra and hope to get bumped into the Encore at a later date...
 

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