Jetblue supports Abu Dhabi PreClearance!!!! Horrible!!!!

[tailhookah]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/todayinthesky/2014/01/23/jetblue-agrees-to-codeshare-pact-with-abu-dhabis-etihad/4795581/

Article says it all... this is a job and career killer. Hopefully Jetblue votes in Alpa. Alpa is very against this for obvious reasons and this will be a big fight for the (hopefully) fledgling Jetblue Alpa MEC. Good luck.

In the meantime Jetblue pilots, you all need to know just how damaging this pre-clearance facility is to YOUR future.

Tail

 

[RiddleEagle18]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/today...odeshare-pact-with-abu-dhabis-etihad/4795581/



Article says it all... this is a job and career killer. Hopefully Jetblue votes in Alpa. Alpa is very against this for obvious reasons and this will be a big fight for the (hopefully) fledgling Jetblue Alpa MEC. Good luck.



In the meantime Jetblue pilots, you all need to know just how damaging this pre-clearance facility is to YOUR future.



Tail

Just one more reason we are trying to bring ALPA on again. This time all indications are we have a strong majority.

For all you inhouse hopefuls how would our little inhouse handle a situation like this?

 

[General Lee]

I can see this as a rallying call for ALPA, but this Abu Dhabi pre clearance deal is being blown way out of proportion. Look, Shannon, Ireland has one too, and British Airways uses it on their A318 service from London City airport to JFK, with a short stop there. Fact is, Abu Dhabi is way too far away to affect us, except for some traffic from India or Pakistan. US citizens won't back track all the way to Abu Dhabi from Europe or Asia to clear customs early and then go onto the USA. Nope. This deal does NOT really affect US carriers, sans some Indian or Pakistani pax.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Scoot 11]

I can see this as a rallying call for ALPA, but this Abu Dhabi pre clearance deal is being blown way out of proportion. Look, Shannon, Ireland has one too, and British Airways uses it on their A318 service from London City airport to JFK, with a short stop there. Fact is, Abu Dhabi is way too far away to affect us, except for some traffic from India or Pakistan. US citizens won't back track all the way to Abu Dhabi from Europe or Asia to clear customs early and then go onto the USA. Nope. This deal does NOT really affect US carriers, sans some Indian or Pakistani pax.


Bye Bye---General Lee

You are a complete ********************ing moron! Yes, and US carriers use the one at Shannon, at Dublin, and at Aruba!
What US carrier flies into Abu Dhabi? This does nothing for US carriers!
This is a threat to US aviation commercial jobs. Why should my tax dollars pay for some middle eastern airline to get through customs on their soil.
It's obvious you aren't a pilot, let alone an adult. Get back to your flight sim kid! I'm sure you mom would be pissed knowing your on dad's computer again.
****************************** bag!

 

[DUBLINFLYER]

Dublin also has pre-clearance (new T-2 only), it works out very well with the one stop shop in DUB and not waiting around for bags in EWR/ORDJFK to put them back on another conveyor to your final destination.

 

[General Lee]

You are a complete ********************ing moron! Yes, and US carriers use the one at Shannon, at Dublin, and at Aruba!
What US carrier flies into Abu Dhabi? This does nothing for US carriers!
This is a threat to US aviation commercial jobs. Why should my tax dollars pay for some middle eastern airline to get through customs on their soil.
It's obvious you aren't a pilot, let alone an adult. Get back to your flight sim kid! I'm sure you mom would be pissed knowing your on dad's computer again.
****************************** bag!

Whoa! You sound ticked, yet you give ZERO reasons why an Abu Dhabi facility would take any US jobs. As far as US taxes used to pay for it, that is a waste, but one of many wasteful things, like Amtrak. Why don't you bi&$h about that too while you're at it? You are still an idiot that can't debate!



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Scoot 11]

Whoa! You sound ticked, yet you give ZERO reasons why an Abu Dhabi facility would take any US jobs. As far as US taxes used to pay for it, that is a waste, but one of many wasteful things, like Amtrak. Why don't you bi&$h about that too while you're at it? You are still an idiot that can't debate!



Bye Bye---General Lee

And you're still a basement troll picking his nose and eating it. 19,000 posts, and you still offer nothing! Get back to flight sim dufus, it's almost time to do math and spelling homework!

 

[General Lee]

And you're still a basement troll picking his nose and eating it. 19,000 posts, and you still offer nothing! Get back to flight sim dufus, it's almost time to do math and spelling homework!

Ahhahahahaha! You still couldn't do it. Answer the question: how will the Abu Dhabi pre customs facility take away US jobs? It actually creates some THERE. If you don't choose to debate, it proves YOU are a loser, which everyone already knows.... Funny stuff. Do you believe in unicorns too? I bet you do fruitcake.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

GL...

Just stop. You are further isolating yourself on Clown Island and we got no birds in the air searching for you.

 

[General Lee]

GL...

Just stop. You are further isolating yourself on Clown Island and we got no birds in the air searching for you.

Bill,

Isolating myself because I bring up a good point? Riiiight. You answer the question if you can. Why does this AUH facility cost US jobs? Typical ALPA rally call......

And I don't care about idiots like Scoot. Your response is interesting, though. Oh well.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

GL,

The point is that this pre-clearance facility can't be associated with Aruba or Shannon. The airline(s) that will primarily benefit from this are hell-bent on One stop service to any point on the globe from the US and this adds to the convenience.

State sponsored world domination of routes is unfair competition. Which leads to US job losses....not a debate...a fact.

Your protests make me wonder where you are at. When you tangle with the EK crowd, you usually echo my sentiments. We will be a 717/737 flying airline and our sundae trips with meals in Paris or Rome will be over.

 

[Scoot 11]

GL,

The point is that this pre-clearance facility can't be associated with Aruba or Shannon. The airline(s) that will primarily benefit from this are hell-bent on One stop service to any point on the globe from the US and this adds to the convenience.

State sponsored world domination of routes is unfair competition. Which leads to US job losses....not a debate...a fact.

Your protests make me wonder where you are at. When you tangle with the EK crowd, you usually echo my sentiments. We will be a 717/737 flying airline and our sundae trips with meals in Paris or Rome will be over.

Bill. Well stated. But you're trying to make some teenage snot nosed handjob understand. This ****************************** bag is no way a pilot, except maybe flight sim. 19000 posts, and the only thing he offers is the same bull******************** drivel over and over! Who ever he's blowing to get his information, needs to stop, because this kid keeps getting it wrong.

 

[tailhookah]

I tell you GL... first it does have to do w/ US jobs. The BA318 stopping in Shannon is a small plane, once per day. I know there are other airlines that use that too, I don't like it one bit. But the issue w/ Abu Dhabi is the immense size of the Middle East operation. We are talking about 340's... tons of them. So Abu Dhabi gets this who do you think is next? That's right geography wizards... Dubai.

Right now Emirates has more planes on order (all big ones) than the total value of the 3 major US carriers. So picture a world in 10 or 15 years when you have state sponsored air carriers (Emirates/Etihad) flying point to point from the Middle East to many US cities and they don't need customs support! All paid for by US taxpayers to hurt US jobs/companies. All from countries that support and allow terrorist groups free range while competing against the rest of the world's airlines w/ government subsidies and cheap labor.

It is a big deal. I am surprised that you being a Delta pilot GL that you don't see this. You have to fight to keep what's good. Our own government is more of an enemy to our jobs than many overseas carriers. When this was brought up, our DOT should've said NO! But they cave to lobbyist pressure paid for by petro dollars from countries that support terrorism.

Now couple this w/ the just announced Jetblue/Etihad codeshare to at least 49 cities, it shows just how corrupt this decision is. Guess why Jetblue pressed for this and supports this? They are not being watched by unionized pilots who care about this stuff. They have a Direct Relationship where they can directly do whatever they want w/out any worry about a pilot's union calling BS. I guarantee you if the Jetblue Alpa drive is successful that this will be a HUGE issue w/ Alpa national... and it should send shivers down any US or non middle eastern pilots spine.

Now it's your turn.

Tail

 

[Blue Dude]

I think the pre-clearance facility is a crappy idea for the US government to support, though I completely understand why JB management thinks it's a good idea. (Etihad parking at JFK T5?) It's as self-serving a position as you might find. However, I don't see the connection with the ALPA drive at JetBlue. We have no CBA. We're not going to have a CBA any time soon. ALPA can pitch a fit and foam at the mouth about the US government (not JetBlue) manning a pre-clearance facility unserved by any US airline, but what exactly would they want JetBlue pilots to do about it? Demand that JetBlue management not write letters to congress? Drop the Etihad code share? So far, all JetBlue has done is express an opinion. I don't know of any contract terms that would prevent that.

 

[General Lee]

As I have stated before and pasted analyst remarks too, the US is at a Geographical Advantage. The ME Airlines affect the European and SE Asian airlines, because the UAE is in between Australia and Europe, and everything else in between. Not a big deal for US Carriers. US passengers will NOT fly to the UAE to go to Europe, Asia, Africa, or South America. Nope. The main passenger connections through the ME will be Indians and Pakistanis, because they are in a straight line and it might be a shorter route to go through the ME and connect to the USA. That's it....

Now, the UAE airlines can TRY European flights etc and then onto the US. The analyst in the article I brought up correctly stated that those airlines have stated intentions to go from places like Birmingham, England to Boston. If United can't fill a larger plane than a 757 to a large hub like Newark, how will an EK 777-300ER fill up? Doubtful.

JetBlue code sharing with Etihad at JFK or Emirates at BOS isn't surprising either. How many extra seats are there on an A320 or E190 for those connections? Can an A380 park at the JB terminal at either airport? Business pax don't want to change terminals after customs, they prefer seamless travel. The local family coming to the US to see their daughter, they might not care. They also bought cheap tickets. And as I stated, the connection in the ME will be Indian and Pakistani passengers, not people from anywhere else. JAL now flies 787s from Narita to Boston. The World is opening up, and not many will go through the ME to get to Syracuse via EK and JB. DL had 75 cities under code share with Korean Air through ATL alone, but that was recently dropped because DL and KE got into a turf spat. It doesn't always work out....

The EXIM Bank has curtailed the free loans to the UAE thanks to DL and ALPA shining a light on the situation. Now that bank has to state publicly who they offer those loans to, and Congress has gotten involved. Not as easy to do anymore. I doubt the ME airlines want to not order Boeings either (even though their CEOs threatened not to). Did you know that the A380 is built in France and Germany, and both countries restrict how many cities EK and EY can fly to in their countries? They don't get unlimited cities, even though they ordered A380s. Why? Because the ME airlines don't have a choice! They can have a tantrum and go buy Antanov A124s I guess. That would be hilarious.


Get my point? Geographic advantage. The future is in alliances. DL, AA, and UAL are also finally making bucks thanks to Consolidation and fees, and can defend turf and go on the offensive at the same time. Also, there are still majority owning rights even in Europe. Air Berlin is 49% owned by Etihad, with Alitalia next maybe. Virgin Atlantic is 49% owned by Delta, but you don't see Delta ordering them around. It helps with connections and code shares, but that's it. Alliances still rule, and even Qatari just joined the One World Alliance. It's all expected.

The ME airlines can buy all the planes they want, but the US passenger doesn't want to go there first, and then onto Europe or Asia. Nah.....




Bye Bye---General Lee


PS---also notice a guy or girl like Scoot 11 couldn't come up with any analysis like this, way over "it's" head... It's an idiot...

 

[tailhookah]

All good points GL... but let me know how you feel when you see Etihad 340s parked at the DOMESTIC jetblue gates pushing their pre cleared (by US Customs) pax on B6 codes all over the US.

It's a career problem. Fix it now or let it go... just like the 50 seaters... didn't think it was an issue in 1995 did ya... but it sure fooked things up after 9/11 didn't it?

Tail

 

[Scoot 11]

As I have stated before and pasted analyst remarks too, the US is at a Geographical Advantage. The ME Airlines affect the European and SE Asian airlines, because the UAE is in between Australia and Europe, and everything else in between. Not a big deal for US Carriers. US passengers will NOT fly to the UAE to go to Europe, Asia, Africa, or South America. Nope. The main passenger connections through the ME will be Indians and Pakistanis, because they are in a straight line and it might be a shorter route to go through the ME and connect to the USA. That's it....

Now, the UAE airlines can TRY European flights etc and then onto the US. The analyst in the article I brought up correctly stated that those airlines have stated intentions to go from places like Birmingham, England to Boston. If United can't fill a larger plane than a 757 to a large hub like Newark, how will an EK 777-300ER fill up? Doubtful.

JetBlue code sharing with Etihad at JFK or Emirates at BOS isn't surprising either. How many extra seats are there on an A320 or E190 for those connections? Can an A380 park at the JB terminal at either airport? Business pax don't want to change terminals after customs, they prefer seamless travel. The local family coming to the US to see their daughter, they might not care. They also bought cheap tickets. And as I stated, the connection in the ME will be Indian and Pakistani passengers, not people from anywhere else. JAL now flies 787s from Narita to Boston. The World is opening up, and not many will go through the ME to get to Syracuse via EK and JB. DL had 75 cities under code share with Korean Air through ATL alone, but that was recently dropped because DL and KE got into a turf spat. It doesn't always work out....

The EXIM Bank has curtailed the free loans to the UAE thanks to DL and ALPA shining a light on the situation. Now that bank has to state publicly who they offer those loans to, and Congress has gotten involved. Not as easy to do anymore. I doubt the ME airlines want to not order Boeings either (even though their CEOs threatened not to). Did you know that the A380 is built in France and Germany, and both countries restrict how many cities EK and EY can fly to in their countries? They don't get unlimited cities, even though they ordered A380s. Why? Because the ME airlines don't have a choice! They can have a tantrum and go buy Antanov A124s I guess. That would be hilarious.


Get my point? Geographic advantage. The future is in alliances. DL, AA, and UAL are also finally making bucks thanks to Consolidation and fees, and can defend turf and go on the offensive at the same time. Also, there are still majority owning rights even in Europe. Air Berlin is 49% owned by Etihad, with Alitalia next maybe. Virgin Atlantic is 49% owned by Delta, but you don't see Delta ordering them around. It helps with connections and code shares, but that's it. Alliances still rule, and even Qatari just joined the One World Alliance. It's all expected.

The ME airlines can buy all the planes they want, but the US passenger doesn't want to go there first, and then onto Europe or Asia. Nah.....




Bye Bye---General Lee


PS---also notice a guy or girl like Scoot 11 couldn't come up with any analysis like this, way over "it's" head... It's an idiot...

19000 posts, and still having to suck his way through flight school!
Mom must be real proud kid!

 

[General Lee]

All good points GL... but let me know how you feel when you see Etihad 340s parked at the DOMESTIC jetblue gates pushing their pre cleared (by US Customs) pax on B6 codes all over the US.

It's a career problem. Fix it now or let it go... just like the 50 seaters... didn't think it was an issue in 1995 did ya... but it sure fooked things up after 9/11 didn't it?

Tail

Tail,

More than half of those pax on that A340 are going to NYC anyway, and all originated in India or Pakistan. Notice very few airlines go to India from the US, and the business travelers with the big bucks go nonstop, most likely on UAL to EWR. You have to understand that the passengers who go to the US via Etihad or Emirates do not start in Europe or Asia. They start in India or Pakistan, otherwise they are just back tracking to AUH, which doesn't make sense.

The Gulf carriers do have unlimited funds, but they affect the European and SE Asian carriers a lot more than the US carriers, thanks to the Geographic advantage. For the US pilots, it's not a career ender to have a customs facility in AUH. It's financially dumb for our taxpayers, but not something so terrible that huge red flags need to be thrown. And JetBlue might gain some connections, but not high paying business travelers who want seamless travel on the same airline or same terminals. BOS customs isn't close to the JB terminal there, and the JFK JB terminal can't handle a 777-300 at this point I believe.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

19000 posts, and still having to suck his way through flight school!
Mom must be real proud kid!

You still can't add anything to a debate Scoot. Your Mom disowned you years ago because she knew you would turn out to be a real jack hole. She was right!



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Mercyful Fate]

You still can't add anything to a debate Scoot. Your Mom disowned you years ago because she knew you would turn out to be a real jack hole. She was right!



Bye Bye---General Lee

airliners.net...yay!