Jetblew Is MESSED up!

[8vATE]

Or is it more likely that a lot of the guys who have been here since getting furloughed or bent over by "legacy" carriers soon after 9/11 or during the USAirways debacle had some gratitude and motivation for trying to do a little "more" for fellow crewmembers and customers the first 5 years of the company or so.

Then JetBlue management slowly devolved in to the typical bean counter and wall street creep persona.

And we now face the resultant reality that almost all professional airline pilots bow down to union representation and it's abundant pitfalls, compromises and political nastiness.

 

[Vingus]

Or is it more likely that a lot of the guys who have been here since getting furloughed or bent over by "legacy" carriers soon after 9/11 or during the USAirways debacle had some gratitude and motivation for trying to do a little "more" for fellow crewmembers and customers the first 5 years of the company or so.

Then JetBlue management slowly devolved in to the typical bean counter and wall street creep persona.

And we now face the resultant reality that almost all professional airline pilots bow down to union representation and it's abundant pitfalls, compromises and political nastiness.

This!!!

 

[linepilot]

And where was the foresight?

NONE what-so-ever!

Now we have lost everything that we could have preserved.

And y'all need to get ready for a further demonstration of WEAK!

When this bunch of lambs fumbles around for 10 years trying to negotiate back what they gave away. But when they finally vote in ALPA, I'm sure they'll find a way to blame ALPA for their lack of back bone, unity, and resolve.

Just watch.

Weak and ignorant and it WILL continue.

 

[8vATE]

Instead of voting in ALPA with just 51% of the pilot group with the most recent vote....

I think it will sail past at +85% (hopefully) now that "leadership" has decidely picked their poison and shown us how it will be.

Some of you ALPA worshipers put WAY too much emotion in to this argument.

It has played out fairly and rather predictably unfortunately... But it has taken the time it has needed.

Some things do need to sit and ferment. You end up with vinegar or wine.

I would rather have a UNIFIED and thoroughly convinced pilot group than have had ALPA barely go through with a weak vote.

Live with the reality..Stop denigrating or attacking those who have different opinions or experiences. Reduce the emotion.

Seek out your fantasy land perfect airline somewhere else if you want.

The entire industry has been a minefield of frustration, delays and disappointment.

 

[linepilot]

This pilot group still has SO MANY MORE mistakes to make.

The game is just beginning and the victories are still 15 years away.

This is all playing out so much better than jetblew and their "third parties" could have ever hoped for.

The only way to make up for lost time is militancy and that's not going to happen until you all get spanked a few more times. Of course, by then, the company will have you blaming ALPA for your predicament.

 

[Skank]

And where was the foresight?

NONE what-so-ever!

Now we have lost everything that we could have preserved.

And y'all need to get ready for a further demonstration of WEAK!

When this bunch of lambs fumbles around for 10 years trying to negotiate back what they gave away. But when they finally vote in ALPA, I'm sure they'll find a way to blame ALPA for their lack of back bone, unity, and resolve.

Just watch.

Weak and ignorant and it WILL continue.

Gosh, so much to look forward to. Slug your ex-wife for me, would ya?

 

[GuppyPuppy]

Instead of voting in ALPA with just 51% of the pilot group with the most recent vote....

I think it will sail past at +85% (hopefully) now that "leadership" has decidely picked their poison and shown us how it will be.

Some of you ALPA worshipers put WAY too much emotion in to this argument.

It has played out fairly and rather predictably unfortunately... But it has taken the time it has needed.

Some things do need to sit and ferment. You end up with vinegar or wine.

I would rather have a UNIFIED and thoroughly convinced pilot group than have had ALPA barely go through with a weak vote.

Live with the reality..Stop denigrating or attacking those who have different opinions or experiences. Reduce the emotion.

Seek out your fantasy land perfect airline somewhere else if you want.

The entire industry has been a minefield of frustration, delays and disappointment.

I can see your point about wanting to be unified, but what have we lost since August of 2011?

Healthcare
Dependability policy (shoved down our throats w/8 hrs. notice)
Premium pay
3A
...just to name a few.

Now we will have to use negotiating power to get some of these things back.

I remember talking to a 'no' voter about 5 years ago. He said that he didn't think that it was the 'right time' to vote in a union. I responded, "When is the right time? When they've taken away so much that we have to negotiate for what we already had?".

If this next vote doesn't pass, I may be seeking employment elsewhere. After 10 years at a major. Wow!

GP

 

[hyperboy]

..........

I can see your point about wanting to be unified, but what have we lost since August of 2011?

Healthcare
Dependability policy (shoved down our throats w/8 hrs. notice)
Premium pay
3A
...just to name a few.

Now we will have to use negotiating power to get some of these things back.

I remember talking to a 'no' voter about 5 years ago. He said that he didn't think that it was the 'right time' to vote in a union. I responded, "When is the right time? When they've taken away so much that we have to negotiate for what we already had?".

If this next vote doesn't pass, I may be seeking employment elsewhere. After 10 years at a major. Wow!

GP

Why did you not leave after the last failed attempt?

 

[linepilot]

Why did you not leave after the last failed attempt?

You're a cringer aren't you?

Do you rub against Jenny and Rob's legs when you're cowering at their feet like a stray dog?

 

[hyperboy]

alpo

I can see your point about wanting to be unified, but what have we lost since August of 2011?

Healthcare
Dependability policy (shoved down our throats w/8 hrs. notice)
Premium pay
3A
...just to name a few.

Now we will have to use negotiating power to get some of these things back.

I remember talking to a 'no' voter about 5 years ago. He said that he didn't think that it was the 'right time' to vote in a union. I responded, "When is the right time? When they've taken away so much that we have to negotiate for what we already had?".

If this next vote doesn't pass, I may be seeking employment elsewhere. After 10 years at a major. Wow!

GP

Here is what ALPO will get you right off the bat........

Conflict of interest. (Majors vs. Regionals)
Pay cuts and concessions (see last two ALPO contracts)
1.9% paycut (union dues)
Divided pilot group
Absolute waste of monies (flight pay loss,boozing, and fine dining)
a union buried in lawsuits.....

 

[hyperboy]

?

You're a cringer aren't you?

Do you rub against Jenny and Rob's legs when you're cowering at their feet like a stray dog?

I asked a question and you attack me hiding behind your keyboard and screen. Is that classy or is that being a coward?

Is this what we can expect with what ALPA?

 

[Blue Dude]

Is this what we can expect with what ALPA?

Standard excuse #3: I don't want ALPA because some of the people who want it are mean to me.

Look, man, vote in a union or not, depending on your personal situation and understanding (or lack thereof) of your career here. If you sincerely want to keep the Direct Relationship (tm) and think it will work better than an ALPA CBA, then great. Vote that way. I think it's short-sighted and stupid, but you're welcome to it if it's sincerely held.

Just don't use the "those ALPA guys are meanies" excuse, or even worse the "I was going to vote for ALPA but now I won't because you are mean" line. That kind of stuff went out of style in 5th grade. I'd really like to credit you with more maturity than that.

 

[Andy]

Standard excuse #3: I don't want ALPA because some of the people who want it are mean to me.

Look, man, vote in a union or not, depending on your personal situation and understanding (or lack thereof) of your career here. If you sincerely want to keep the Direct Relationship (tm) and think it will work better than an ALPA CBA, then great. Vote that way. I think it's short-sighted and stupid, but you're welcome to it if it's sincerely held.

Just don't use the "those ALPA guys are meanies" excuse, or even worse the "I was going to vote for ALPA but now I won't because you are mean" line. That kind of stuff went out of style in 5th grade. I'd really like to credit you with more maturity than that.

+1. I'm not a huge fan of ALPA, but you guys NEED a union. ALPA or some other union; you absolutely need a union on property. Your management is abusing you guys.

 

[RiddleEagle18]

Hyper boy and DR apologist defend the utter failure that is the Jan schedule process. Go ahead, I will give you first shot before someone else tears it to shreds.

Most ALPA carries have entire sections dedicated to staffing requirements and managing PBS. We have a flow chart.

 

[N311HK]

Agree, don't forget the constant late DRO too. Both would never happen with a CBA