FLOPS Phenom overrun

[208starcheck]

X rated

Answer thy question?

So you are saying you will fly an approach at ref or ref plus 10 in winds gusting to 40 knots?

Where is that in the Afm? I'd like to see that.

That's a retarded question. Winds 0 gusting to 40 or 25 G40. Let's add half the gust on 25 G40. You're still slower across the ground then winds 0. You can't keep asking a stupid question without painting a full picture. What are all the conditions.

 

[X-rated]

.....

 

[rajflyboy]

That's a retarded question. Winds 0 gusting to 40 or 25 G40. Let's add half the gust on 25 G40. You're still slower across the ground then winds 0. You can't keep asking a stupid question without painting a full picture. What are all the conditions.

I like this type of thinking. Ground speed with a headwind is slower. That's the type if answer I'm looking for.

I always add half the gust factor to my approach speed.

 

[gc3059]

Target airspeed plus or minus 10 kts, not ref and ten, at least that is what it is at my company. Then you can account for the gust factor and still fit the stabilized approach criteria.

 

[ksu_aviator]

Those are factored numbers. Unfactored wet would be around 2900 feet required. They had to have been way faster than 10 kts too fast.

I don't believe so. I got them from Opera using wet runway. I don't believe Opera gives you factored numbers.

*edit*

I just double checked my numbers and settings in Opera and the same information keeps coming up. The wet, unfactored landing distances I posted above appear to be accurate.

Now, there is a SAFO that says if you don't have wet runway numbers from the manufacturer, you can use 15% on top of the 15% you are already adding...so a 2,194 dry unfactored would become 2,904 feet. But I've fiddled with Opera trying to get 2900 for a wet runway and just can't. Opera is telling me the unfactored landing distance at 13000 lbs is 4200 feet. I'll check the Tab Data later today, maybe the Tab Data is different?

 

[X-rated]

I like this type of thinking. Ground speed with a headwind is slower. That's the type if answer I'm looking for.

I always add half the gust factor to my approach speed.

Headwind component is taken into account when you come up with your landing distance! And, most people don't count gusts as a headwind that will reduce your ground speed at touch down. You have no way of knowing if that gust will be there or not when you cross the fence. You should consider your required landing distance may be significantly increased when you add for the gusts.

Adding half the gust factor is a normal procedure, but as one of the other posters said, if the winds are 25 gusting to 40, your gust factor is 7.5 kts not 20...

 

[gunfyter]

I always fly ref and 20 whenever windshear is possible... and I consider it possible if ever the gusts are more than 5 kts.

Citation X material we had is where I got the ref and 20 for windshear ... Not sure if it was company or Cessna source

 

[X-rated]

I don't ever remember seeing that in the C-X material, but it's been a while, and I have pretty much mentally dumped all that info. I don't have a problem adding 20 to ref if you're worried about windshear so long as you have plenty of runway to work with. Would you really add 20 kts going into SMO because the ATIS is calling for 5 kt gusts? I wouldn't.

 

[rajflyboy]

Some airplanes say to add the entire gust factor not to exceed 20 knots

Also ref plus 20 is flying within ATP standards

Ref plus 10 is the target on a normal runway. You get plus or minus 10

Most sop's allow for ref to ref plus 20 for a stabilized approach. Anything more is a go around.

Also when do you apply braking? You take a huge penalty for every second you do not start braking

Many factors go into flying a stabilized approach. Skill and smarts is also a big part of it.

 

[gunfyter]

I wouldn't cross the fence at that speed. You'd have to blend short field consideration in At some point you have to transition to ref