Twa pilots vs alpa

[GIZMONC]

It is my understanding that since the TWA Pilots got a judgement against ALPA for the way they failed on the merger with AA, this is moving to the MONETARY decision at this time. Since TWA Pilots obtained that judgement and now AA is in bankrupcy. Will this fall back on APA. It is also my understanding that APA fenced the TWA pilots in STL and with the bankrupcy STL may no longer be an AA Pilot base. Could this backfire against APA? Anyone have any idea on what is next ?

 

[shon7]

say what

 

[Raoul Duke]

ALPA is the defendant, not AA and not APA. The BK filing has no affect on the case.

 

[Neubyfly]

ZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[outerlimits]

ALPA is the defendant, not AA and not APA. The BK filing has no affect on the case.

True. If ALPA increases dues to 3% they could pay any amount awarded .

The TWA pilots deserve it, I would be willing to give another one percent for them.

 

[AceOnTheRiver]

True. If ALPA increases dues to 3% they could pay any amount awarded .

The TWA pilots deserve it, I would be willing to give another one percent for them.

I doubt you will find too many ALPA members agreeing with you on that one. Personally ALPA should settle or file for bankruptcy and move on.

 

[Raoul Duke]

They have insurance, time to pony up (again)

 

[outerlimits]

I doubt you will find too many ALPA members agreeing with you on that one. Personally ALPA should settle or file for bankruptcy and move on.

Only the ones that are very self centered and could care less about right vs. wrong.

 

[Kugelblitz]

Only the ones that are very self centered and could care less about right vs. wrong.

How very true, and this is why ALPA fails. I am one of those TWA types, I am at CAL/UAL now. Lately, every once in awhile, someone approaches me and tells me, "Did you hear DAL is decertifying ALPA? They are getting out before the lawsuit settles." The couple that have brought this to my attention (assuming it is even true) can't help the smirk they have on their face, like "you think your getting your money don't you? But your not". As though I am getting some sort of handout.

I won't go into the vicissitudes of the 8 years I was out before I was recalled. I have many friends who have suffered as well. I don't have an issue with APA, they did their dirty job in a dirty business. ALPA, that is another story. The issue here however is the resentment I sense from those about this lawsuit and this POTENTIAL award. I will believe it when I see it.

I wonder, how everyone would feel in our shoes? How would one like to hear how everyone is bailing to avoid a fine associated with a lawsuit -assuming this would even be assessed on the membership anyways? Then some of these folks want unity in their contract talks? They want to be supported from a common strike fund? They want other air carrier pilot support? Really?

ALPA national seems like a bunch of narcissistic jerks because they represent a bunch of narcissistic jerks. If it is true that DAL is leaving over this, and not something truly concerning like controlling scope, how sad for them. Again I don't know this to be true. But it underscores why ALPA or any other national union representing airline pilots is doomed to fail. If one's perspective is the ever present mantra in our society that 'I have to get the best deal for me and the heck with anyone else', please look in the mirror to see why this career is going down the toilet and no one can make any headway on scope, work rules, compensation, etc.

 

[Whine Lover]

"...going down the toilet.."

Going?

GOing?

GONE.

 

[Lake Alice]

True. If ALPA increases dues to 3% they could pay any amount awarded .

The TWA pilots deserve it, I would be willing to give another one percent for them.

Outer you realize your own mec agreed to code share, right?

 

[doh]

How very true, and this is why ALPA fails. I am one of those TWA types, I am at CAL/UAL now. Lately, every once in awhile, someone approaches me and tells me, "Did you hear DAL is decertifying ALPA? They are getting out before the lawsuit settles." The couple that have brought this to my attention (assuming it is even true) can't help the smirk they have on their face, like "you think your getting your money don't you? But your not". As though I am getting some sort of handout.

I won't go into the vicissitudes of the 8 years I was out before I was recalled. I have many friends who have suffered as well. I don't have an issue with APA, they did their dirty job in a dirty business. ALPA, that is another story. The issue here however is the resentment I sense from those about this lawsuit and this POTENTIAL award. I will believe it when I see it.

I wonder, how everyone would feel in our shoes? How would one like to hear how everyone is bailing to avoid a fine associated with a lawsuit -assuming this would even be assessed on the membership anyways? Then some of these folks want unity in their contract talks? They want to be supported from a common strike fund? They want other air carrier pilot support? Really?

ALPA national seems like a bunch of narcissistic jerks because they represent a bunch of narcissistic jerks. If it is true that DAL is leaving over this, and not something truly concerning like controlling scope, how sad for them. Again I don't know this to be true. But it underscores why ALPA or any other national union representing airline pilots is doomed to fail. If one's perspective is the ever present mantra in our society that 'I have to get the best deal for me and the heck with anyone else', please look in the mirror to see why this career is going down the toilet and no one can make any headway on scope, work rules, compensation, etc.

Best £@¢King post in a long, long time!

 

[dicko]

How very true, and this is why ALPA fails. I am one of those TWA types, I am at CAL/UAL now. Lately, every once in awhile, someone approaches me and tells me, "Did you hear DAL is decertifying ALPA? They are getting out before the lawsuit settles." The couple that have brought this to my attention (assuming it is even true) can't help the smirk they have on their face, like "you think your getting your money don't you? But your not". As though I am getting some sort of handout.

I won't go into the vicissitudes of the 8 years I was out before I was recalled. I have many friends who have suffered as well. I don't have an issue with APA, they did their dirty job in a dirty business. ALPA, that is another story. The issue here however is the resentment I sense from those about this lawsuit and this POTENTIAL award. I will believe it when I see it.

I wonder, how everyone would feel in our shoes? How would one like to hear how everyone is bailing to avoid a fine associated with a lawsuit -assuming this would even be assessed on the membership anyways? Then some of these folks want unity in their contract talks? They want to be supported from a common strike fund? They want other air carrier pilot support? Really?

ALPA national seems like a bunch of narcissistic jerks because they represent a bunch of narcissistic jerks. If it is true that DAL is leaving over this, and not something truly concerning like controlling scope, how sad for them. Again I don't know this to be true. But it underscores why ALPA or any other national union representing airline pilots is doomed to fail. If one's perspective is the ever present mantra in our society that 'I have to get the best deal for me and the heck with anyone else', please look in the mirror to see why this career is going down the toilet and no one can make any headway on scope, work rules, compensation, etc.

Well written and very true.

I hope that you get what you deserve. I have the same hope for ALPA. The irony is that they wouldn't decertify ALPA over it's crimes, Scope or an assessment. You can add spineless to the list.

 

[Kalifornia]

How very true, and this is why ALPA fails. I am one of those TWA types, I am at CAL/UAL now. Lately, every once in awhile, someone approaches me and tells me, "Did you hear DAL is decertifying ALPA? They are getting out before the lawsuit settles." The couple that have brought this to my attention (assuming it is even true) can't help the smirk they have on their face, like "you think your getting your money don't you? But your not". As though I am getting some sort of handout.

I won't go into the vicissitudes of the 8 years I was out before I was recalled. I have many friends who have suffered as well. I don't have an issue with APA, they did their dirty job in a dirty business. ALPA, that is another story. The issue here however is the resentment I sense from those about this lawsuit and this POTENTIAL award. I will believe it when I see it.

I wonder, how everyone would feel in our shoes? How would one like to hear how everyone is bailing to avoid a fine associated with a lawsuit -assuming this would even be assessed on the membership anyways? Then some of these folks want unity in their contract talks? They want to be supported from a common strike fund? They want other air carrier pilot support? Really?

ALPA national seems like a bunch of narcissistic jerks because they represent a bunch of narcissistic jerks. If it is true that DAL is leaving over this, and not something truly concerning like controlling scope, how sad for them. Again I don't know this to be true. But it underscores why ALPA or any other national union representing airline pilots is doomed to fail. If one's perspective is the ever present mantra in our society that 'I have to get the best deal for me and the heck with anyone else', please look in the mirror to see why this career is going down the toilet and no one can make any headway on scope, work rules, compensation, etc.

That doesn't quite cover all the ethics involved there. I can sympathize that this was a bad situation for you guys and unfair to a degree*key word degree. However, you are so upset with ALPA that you chose to go another ALPA carrier?? You don't put blame on APA, claiming they were just being "dirty", yet are looking for a payment at the expense of every ALPA member if the claims are indeed true for being, you guessed it, "dirty". And just who set in motion this ALPA organization, how about TWA pilots being as part of the organization, also responsible for creating it? What percentage of present day ALPA members had any input in this situation? TWA was on a downward spiral long before this situation came up, and since the manufacturing downturn of the 80s, St. Louis has not been an attractive city to concentrate ones' airline operations and TWA 800 was also a factor. Most importantly, given the current American dire situation especially, most TWA pilots who went elsewhere are to some degree in a better spot than even had they been spliced in better at American given how "dirty" the APA played, I doubt if any negotiator on the planet could have represented much improvement in your seniority list dispute.

 

[doh]

Kali, ALPA is the organization that had a legal obligation to represent the best interests of TWA pilots. Instead, ALPA chose to throw TWA pilots to the wolves in the hopes of enticing APA to rejoin ALPA. Hence, ALPA is the entity rightly being sued by TWA pilots. No one else had any duty to represent TWA pilots. Clear now?