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How can I drink the Brown Kool-aid if I cant hold my food down

  • Thread starter Thread starter JT12345
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And making how much more for your trouble? Please, cry us a rvier.

Again with the pay raise argument. Why do you care how much they make? Is it reducing your pay?

Nope. Just a rationale to grab seniority and left seats.

Please turn down the more than fair offer from SWA, good luck with that. I wish you nothing but the best in your future endevours.

Obviously the SWAPA MEC wants this passed BAD. Why? Because they KNOW an arbitrator will NEVER lock AAI f/os out for a decade.

And, BTW, IF SWA and AS should ever merge...straight DoH. Period end of story.

Here's the arbitrator's decision (you heard it here first!):

1. No bump/no flush
2. Pre-1993 SWA hires listed.
3. Ratio the rest.

That's what's fair. Its a SENIORITY LIST INTEGRATION, not a pay list integration.
 
:cartman:
Why I'm Voting no!

This "deal" takes my seniority back from 44% to 75%. Even though I hold my capt's seat, my life becomes completely unknown for the next 10+ yrs. I will not accrue any seniority and move around "the most" junior bases and schedules since I probably won't hold ATL anymore. I guess I could downgrade (Wouldn't you like that huh?) This deal short of puts a gun in my head to do just that. The southwest pilot that takes my slot wouldn't have to deal with the 10+ years that I would have to. He/she would immediately have a descent seniority.

Pay is a perk (even though it starts in almost a year from now), but I do not think is worth the dramatic changes in commuting and scheduling for such a long time. It is really like the Devil making me rich in exchange for my soul and peace... I vote no to that. Voting yes, potentially commits 15 years of the 29 I have left to being "the junior guy". I refuse to forget that I chose AirTran because I believed my upgrade would come quickly, that we would grow at a fast pace, that we would go international and keep on expanding. I have never applied at SW. Many of you don't know AirTran, don't under-estimate it. It was a good Airline, with a good product, with customers that appreciated it. With pilots that had as much experience as ANY southwest pilot except for the shuttle commander you guys had... (Hugh Gibbs I think?)

I understand we are being acquired. But I also understand it is a necessity. If not, GK would have invested those 3.4 Bills. on internal growth. But he chose to acquire a good, profitable airline. That was the way to go. And this acquisition/merger will create the opportunities that southwest alone did not have. No matter how much money it had in the bank... So I vote no. Voting yes would mean forgetting all this things and accepting that my career has a lower value than any Southwest Captains career.

I respect and truly appreciate all the pay increases that the SW contract would afford me; but have this clear guys: Everything I gain in this merger is not taken and subtracted from a Southwest guy. Not the pay, not the seat. The gains you are expecting to have, are taken directly from an AirTran pilot: Seniority, job security, quality of life and capt seats... Not fair, not equitable.

I also fear this: If we accept this deal and live with it, who is to say that in 5 years from now GK will merge with Alaska... will those pilots forget their balls too? Or will they fight to be on top of my 75% at SW? Will swapa have a little more respect for them? Agree to take less or allow arbitration? This is my fight today! I will hold my cojones and vote no.

What do I think is fair in a nutshell: -Relative seniority (With a slight loss at the AirTran side due to SW top seniority protection (Those hired before AT existed), and a slight loss to offset a 3 year fence in ATL. Not more than 10-15% loss.
-Captains keep the seats period. (Bid per master seniority list.)
-Pay bonus for SW fo's that fly with a junior capt. (This is a great idea to reduce friction in the cockpit.)
-SW upgrade protection on sw retirements. Every time a SW guy retires, the slot is taken by the next SW guy down the list. End this rule sometime down a 5 year limit or so?
-At upgrade protection for our guys for the same amount of time...

OK, this is my yearly post. Flame away and explain me why this is not fair and equitable. Or how my thinking is of the planet.


Islanhoper


I think you left out that ninety-some per cent strike vote. :cartman:
 
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I think if this goes to arbitration the AT pilots could end up with both DOH and relative seniority. At least as long as GH is in business. After that who knows?? GK said something behind closed doors to the AT MC to make them negotiate in good faith..
 
dicko-I was typing on my damn phone so cut me some slack.



Jball.

It was a joke. Sorry, I was merely trying to amuse myself.

I could tell you were typing on your phone. My first clue was the Droid/tapatalk advertising at the bottom of every post.

I'll put more smiley faces in the future. :D
 
Thanks D- I have just worn myself out over this mess and my sense of humor has taken a crap. Thanks for injecting yours though!
 
You Trannies realize nearly all of the junior FOs at SWA could have gone to Airtran many moons ago right? The majority of us could have gone over there before the majority of you ever got there. It was a much longer road to get to SWA and we had the resume, interview skills, and flight experience to do it. The majority of you guys didn't. Therefore you are there and we are here. For us not to get a huge bump in seniority because of this would be absolutely wrong. No matter what you think in your grand delusions.

I'm sure you'll flip and call me a conceited jerk, but it is somply the truth. It doesn't mean most of you aren't great people/pilots, but the reality is this is not an apples to apples comparison. You simply got hired at AAI (on average) well before you would have been competitive at SWA. Therefore, the combined list should reflect this truth.
 
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You Trannies realize nearly all of the junior FOs at SWA could have gone to Airtran many moons ago right? The majority of us could have gone over there before the majority of you ever even got there. It was a much longer road to get to SWA and we had the resume, interview skills, and flight experience to do it. The majority of you guys didn't. Therefor you are there and we are here. For us not to get a huge bump in seniority because of this would be absolutely wrong. No matter what you think in your grand delusions.


Yet .... With all of your superior "resume, interview skills, and flight experience" you'll be swinging gear for an AirTran CA for a long time.

In your case, this pleases me. Nice post Kermit.

By the way, I banged Ms. Piggy.
 
You Trannies realize nearly all of the junior FOs at SWA could have gone to Airtran many moons ago right? The majority of us could have gone over there before the majority of you ever even got there. It was a much longer road to get to SWA and we had the resume, interview skills, and flight experience to do it. .

Oh, here we go with the arrogance again. You also had the money to buy your type rating so SWA would hire you. So, does that make SWA a PFT airline?

Is that where you want the discussion to go? Face it, you won the lottery when you got hired at SWA. Your vaunted resume, interview skills and flying skills are no better than any other part 121 airline pilot, so climb down off your ego.

Frankly, when I came into the airline business, SWA was no more than a glorified regional with pay to match. SWA was where you went when no one else would hire you.

Chew on that for awhile, Ace.
 
Frankly, when I came into the airline business, SWA was no more than a glorified regional with pay to match. SWA was where you went when no one else would hire you.

Chew on that for awhile, Ace.
How about the last 10 years... Ace? That includes all of our FOs and the VAST majority of your list. Get it?

And BTW, if I pull gear for some of you guys, so be it. But "culture" really = "dollars," so before you go pooping in your diaper, think hard about what would happen to this acquisition if you are able to get a big seniority grab in arbitration. What would it do to Gary's magic "culture" [money] if every REAL SWA pilot got F-ed. Do you really think he's going to let that happen? Good luck. I really mean that!
 
How about the last 10 years... Ace? That includes all of our FOs and the VAST majority of your list. Get it?

And BTW, if I pull gear for some of you guys, so be it. But "culture" really = "dollars," so before you go pooping in your diaper, think hard about what would happen to this acquisition if you are able to get a big seniority grab in arbitration. What would it do to Gary's magic "culture" [money] if every REAL SWA pilot got F-ed. Do you really think he's going to let that happen? Good luck. I really mean that!


Yep,

And liquidating us cant happen overnight. Do u think we will not drag SWA in the toilet in the process.

Arbitration is a nuclear option. Right now there are missiles in Cuba and Turkey.

You have 6000 missiles and we have 1800. Just means u can blow it up 3 times more than us. But the fallout can kill everyone.
 
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