How can I drink the Brown Kool-aid if I cant hold my food down

[GoodTimes]

No. Actually, it's not a joke. Don't mistake the BOD vote with line pilot sentiment right now.

 

[redflyer65]

Ahhhhhhh Okay. I think if they don't send this deal to the membership, you guys will burn the house down, but we'll see.

I see it being a done deal on the AAI side. I could be wrong, but I don't think so.

 

[Lear70]

I don't believe there's enough votes to "burn the house down" if the MEC decides not to send it out for vote.

The vast majority of the people who actually ATTEND LEC/MEC meetings are the people on our forum who don't like this proposal. If the MEC kills it and someone calls an LEC meeting for the purpose of recalling one or more reps, I doubt it will make it out of session to a line pilot vote, and the recall will die (which is the only way to change the MEC voting demographics and would take a month or so to complete anyway).

In that scenario, let's say the MC brings back final language end of this week / 1st of next week. The MEC takes 2-3 days to analyze it and hear from legal, we have an open MEC meeting, then they vote at the end of next week, that's Aug 12th. Just for argument's sake, let's say they kill it.

By the time someone could call a special meeting for the purpose of recall, the LEC Chair gives enough advance notice for people to bid around it so they can show up and get proxies, have the meeting, then if it's successful at the LOCAL level, the LEC Chair requests ALPA National send it out for vote, get a 15-day voting period (bare minimum), and get a result, you're looking at 30-40 days out from August 12th; that's the end of September.

Then (assuming I'm wrong and a recall is successful) you have to nominate and vote replacement reps, and who says you get a replacement that will vote any differently? In an interim election, it's done by local council meeting, not by system-wide voting, so it's just the voting members of the pilots present at that special meeting. Get enough people present at that meeting to vote one way and you put your candidate in office.

In the meantime, we'll have blown through the last of the negotiation/mediation timelines and we'll be starting arbitration anyway. There's just not enough time to do anything meaningful by "burning down the house".

 

[texman]

If you don't like the deal, vote NO. Will guys like TY vote no if he is a Captain and can keep his seat? Good question. But, if you don't like it, vote NO.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Hell no he isn't going to no! Nor is any of thier capts. It will pass.

 

[DonVerita]

Hell no he isn't going to no! Nor is any of thier capts. It will pass.

Really?

Talked to any of our junior or mid-level Captains lately?

 

[shootr]

Ummmmm..... our MEC has not voted yet.

One can always hope.

 

[jonjuan]

Hell no he isn't going to no! Nor is any of thier capts. It will pass.

Or "their capts." noggana pass.

 

[JT12345]

Captains low to mid lvl r giving up sooooooo much relative senority that the fences are not worth it. Capt reserve for 10 years... reserve credit.... disgusting senority,

or relative, choice of base, senior FO credit.

And there are no guarantees with these fences and protections, but i have to go to meetings to get briefed on it. Displacements... furloughs.... Heck you know that the fences could be seen as helping the SWA FOs too. No reserve. A nice bump in relative seniority verse what the arbitrator historically does. And how many mergers have had senior FOs take junior captain seats from the smaller company?

Junior Captains (and heck alot of the rest of us) Instead of being 75% from the top they could be 40% from the top and have more control over their life style with all the changes... pilot shuffling... etc that r coming.

The difference between SWA junior CA paycheck and SWA senior FO payck does not justify this.

I know what the SWA guys were worried about and this deal is sooo far from it.

And I know what is at stake for the AAI guys here too. This is not easy.

 

[Elwood Blues]

JT,
You are right and hope you get the word out as to how bad this deal is for the AT guys. They deserve better than this. No control over their quality of life, their base, never ending reserve, and the list goes on and on. That just sux and what they have now is better. Tell your reps that you don't like the deal and can do better.

Reach for better, you are worth it.

Elwood

 

[Kharma Police]

The funny thing is that the pissed of people on each side hate this deal for ultimately competing reasons. If this goes to arbitration, one already pissed off side will ultimately be even more pissed.

 

[N1atEcon]

I hope it goes to arbitration for a long long time. Then I pray some AT guys file a lawsuit and it gets held up in court for years and then to GH for the end. I'm just saying!

 

[Flying the Line]

I am curious to see how many Americans will vote no to a $60,000 pay raise in this economy.

 

[Lear70]

I am curious to see how many Americans will vote no to a $60,000 pay raise in this economy.

If they were already making $100k and had the possibility of voting no, getting a better deal and STILL getting the 60k pay raise?

More than you might think...

It's all academic at this point. We haven't seen the language that allegedly will protect the important parts of the Agreement-In-Principle. That language will be in the 4-party agreement (it's not in SL9, that's for certain). Once we see if that language is good and will truly do what it was intended to do in the AIP, we'll go from there.

Until then, there's not enough for anyone to vote on one way or another.

 

[madjack]

True dat, but don't expect any tricks or smoke and mirrors from the language...it is pretty simple...AAI gets 851 (vs 815) retention slots basically forever (after 2020 our CBA will protect those seats)...in exchange we get seniority on a sliding scale...we get all future upgrades until the 2007 hire SWA FOs reach the 50% line...bottom 650 AAI FOs are stapled, post snapshot hires follow...

Remember the 717s are seat locked for 3 years...AAI pilots on the 717 will not be sitting much more reserve than they do now...

 

[texman]

Really?

Talked to any of our junior or mid-level Captains lately?

No, but come on. Is greed setting in over at AT now. Thats great! If I here one AT capt bytch about the deal I will be more and glad to call them out. AT is gone and a thing of the past. They are doing it out of support for the FO's, but will vote yes behind closed doors. They want their seat and SWA capt pay and benefits. Its just business for them. So is this acquisition. What else do they want? Have you notice TY has not been on here much? He likes it so he is not saying much.