XJT Captain Downgrade Article in NYT

[dojetdriver]

A real good place to start would be tying FO pay to 60% of CA pay.

Who has even that these days, AWAC & ASA?

XJT is close, mostly in the 57-58% range.

You are on to something there. That would do as much as any "minimum time requirements" that congress is considering.

Especially for first year FO's. But if it was enough for the "regionals", why not make it that way at the legacies as well?

To clarify, make the the first year FO pay for ALL fleet types, 60% of the first year CA pay of the lowest paying type at the legacy.

To use an example, using the DAL pay rates, take 60% of the year 1 DC-9 CA rate, roughly $80/hr. At the "regionals", that concept really wouldn't work, especially with mixed prop/jet fleets.

 

[Dan Roman]

AGAIN, I'll repeat it. The "journalist" took so much freedom from face to face interviews, the phone interviews, and the emails to write the story as he saw fit.

The areas that BL tried to emphasize to the "journalist" got ignored, mainly the crappy pay and general decline of the profession.

Even at XJT, a 5th year CA couldn't do 100k a year as the article indicates. Unless he was a LCA, doing OE for 100 hours a month, EVERY month. The figures that BL gave the "journalist" were both best case and worst case.

You have to understand, this is an article in the N.Y. Times.

Every "news" story I've ever read that I happened to have first hand knowledge about was amazingly inaccurate. Now we have Fox News and people like Glen Beck taking inaccurate (Actually Beck is a flat out liar) to new levels.

 

[Dan Roman]

XJT is close, mostly in the 57-58% range.



Especially for first year FO's. But if it was enough for the "regionals", why not make it that way at the legacies as well?

I thought it was. Mine is about 65%

 

[dojetdriver]

I thought it was. Mine is about 65%

Read what I wrote, was your year one pay rate at where ever you are 60% of the year 1 CA pay rate?

 

[QOL_is_great:)]

Am I the only one who has a problem with this? Delay a flight to make a commute and possibly cause the paying passengers to miss their connection? Professionalism at it's finest.

I read that line and wondered why he would even mention that to a reporter. I had a problem with it too. What about the long, overnight commute he made eastcoast to westcoast. Didn't an FO recently do that and it hit the national spotlight only after a unnecessary crash? Maybe the downgrade saved his life? Maybe the coin spent on the Harley could have been spent on a place to receive proper rest and avoid those FedEx sleepovers.
But he did mentioned a few times about being a captain or in command and the power that comes with it. Geez, you want power then be a police officer. I don't remember him mentioning the word responsibility which being the captain is all about.
I don't feel sorry for him since he is an educated person, does know the difference in pay scales and buying items like a ring and Harley. Post 9-11 in an industry that's very unstable and not being ready to cut-backs when the writing is on the wall if foolish. I find it hard to believe they can't muster up a family budget on both their incomes ($70ish). He should be lucky his wife is working and in a respectable career field. I wish my wife could find a job as a teacher. She has a Master's in Education and NO jobs in our area. Teachers are not retiring due to the economy and bad timing for her. She is now looking for work in other fields and it's tough. Newflash for him; it's tough for everyone and he is crying to the wrong group.
Plus, he lets the NYT write an article about this; :bawling:. That is a crap print paper that doesn't understand responsible news gathering and coverage.

 

[samballs]

Sounds like a whiner to me. How does he think he will get any symphaty, people are reading this thinking when he was a capt he doubled their wage, and now as an FO he still doubles their wage because they and the rest of America are watching their jobs go overseas'. Nothing in this article says he has ever made a good decision, and it reads that his wife is about done with him.

 

[pipejockey]

Am I the only one who has a problem with this? Delay a flight to make a commute and possibly cause the paying passengers to miss their connection? Professionalism at it's finest.

Yeah, about as "professional" as the dirt bags in management who offer $200 or less roundtrip airfare and the pukes, errr, I mean "paying customers" who gobble them up like the greedy little w h o r e s that they are, while the guy sitting in the right seat isn't paid what a New York City receptionist is paid or even what the ramp workers and gate agents are paid.

 

[pipejockey]

Please people, get that 60% of CA pay out of your head. Do some research on airlinepilotcentral.com I just did, it took me 5 minutes to see that it is just about at 60% currently. Take a 5 year FO payrate and compare it to a 5 year CA rate. And I wouldn't want to compare anything to these pathetic regional CA payrates either.

 

[neflier]

Awwwww dude, since you put it that way, I'm sorry to come off crass to you. As far as what really happened vs. what the guy wrote in the article, they are different. Unfortunately, the guy in the article has to go on a "clarification tour" of the various message boards to clear it up. As far as BL goes, he's a selfless stand up guy that goes to great lengths to help out our pilots as an MEC volunteer. Often times, banging his head up against a wall with management. Just like all the awesome guys we had representing us in LGA, BOS, and LGA.

BL is a friend of mine. Short version, BL is commuting home, has minimal time to make the commute (NOT DEADHEAD), knows the CA flying the flight. Calls him, requests that he not push early, but DO NOT CAUSE A DELAY for him. CA, obliges, flight pushes 1 minute prior to scheduled go time, and all is good in the universe. That is, till a bunghole "journalist" gets a hold of the story and takes it upon himself to fuk it up.

If you were a CA on the 328, good chance I flew with you. On it from 7/2000 till we flew em down to Myrtle Beach in 2004. A moment of silence for the 328, please.

Number 1 in IAD for July/August 2002, number 2 in BOS from Sept. 2002 till June 2004, number 2 in CVG from July 2004 till the end. Can't remember what I was in LGA, left at the end of June 2002. If I ever jacked a line from you wanted, sorry about that. I usually tried to call the guys bidding below me since we were such a tight group on the that airplane to see if they wanted a specific line if they had something going on, spend more time with their kids, etc do that I wouldn't bid it and free it up for them. Most lines on the plane kinda sucked anyway.

TOGA2TEN, bytches!!!!! Still got a sticker on my roller bag. Viva the Dojet.

dojetdriver check your PM

 

[woog315]

Wow, love all the people nitpicking the numbers in this thread. He would be around a 5yr FO at Express which would net him around 35k at guarantee... pretty close to what the article says. He sounds like he was an idiot who didn't save any significant amount and got hit with a downgrade, sucks to be him and he could have made better choices but why all the defenders of the awful pay?

 

[nerjdriver]

I do feel for the guy, but he and his wife now earn a combined $74,000 a year, even with his pay cut. They can't live on that?

With a family that is not alot of money. I dont think he is looking for your pity.

 

[samballs]

With a family that is not alot of money. I dont think he is looking for your pity.

I disagree. He wouldn't have done the article, or had them interview his mom if he wsn't looking for pitty

 

[Dan Roman]

Well I hate to pick on anyone. as none of us are perfect, but you do have to wonder about someone with 4 kids who commutes cross-country and than comes home to do union work? Couple that with the power trip comment about the importance of being in command?......

 

[bluefin]

Wow! I went from 75,000 to 0 nobody shed a tear for my family and I.

 

[livin'thesim]

So since he used to feel "powerful and in command", and now feels like a loser, what would he have to say to the 15+ year FOs at USAir?

I'm sorry, he sounds like a TOTAL TOOL, and is just a whining b-atch.

I'll save my sympathy for the guys who have been in this industry for decades only to lose it all.

Not for newbie quick-upgrade wonderkids who think they are owed a fast track to success.

This article was a whine-fest for entitled self-esteem era children.

Grow up. People starving to death in other nations.

 

[Captain X]

“I don’t want to be a 50-year-old pilot earning $40,000 a year,” he said, adding that his wife does not want to be married to a pilot with so little earning power.

Anyone know what his old lady looks like?

I just got a raise and was kinda curious. :nuts:

 

[GINCHBLASTER]

This guy sounds like a d-bag. livin'thesim pretty much summed it up perfectly.

 

[Abernathy]

Hi!

I don't feel sorry for this guy, AT ALL!

He was talking about how his family sacrificed in the past, scrimped to get by, etc.

I understand if you want kids. BUT, you have ONE KID, and then, when you can afford it, you have more. This guy choose to have a bunch of kids, and then he's complaining? If he had two, I'll bet his financial situation would be VASTLY IMPROVED!

The big house, motorcycle, etc., etc. Surprised he wasn't bitching he had to downgrade to a smaller powerboat.

"I just made my bed, but I want to sleep in someone else's, much nicer bed!"

Hope he learned somthing worthwhile!

cliff
NBO

Finally someone said it. What ever happened to old-fashioned responsible family planning? Most of my friends who waited until they were financially and emotionally secure enough to have kids had kids in their early thirties, and have the most well-behaved, brightest kids. They also didn't pop out 4 when that time came, they had 2, and then focused all their attention on them. The world is overpopulated as it is.

 

[nerjdriver]

Sounds like a whiner to me. How does he think he will get any symphaty, people are reading this thinking when he was a capt he doubled their wage, and now as an FO he still doubles their wage because they and the rest of America are watching their jobs go overseas'. Nothing in this article says he has ever made a good decision, and it reads that his wife is about done with him.

You are retarded. You are just jealous that as a downgraded captain he make more than you.

 

[airplane wizard]

Finally someone said it. What ever happened to old-fashioned responsible family planning? Most of my friends who waited until they were financially and emotionally secure enough to have kids had kids in their early thirties, and have the most well-behaved, brightest kids. They also didn't pop out 4 when that time came, they had 2, and then focused all their attention on them. The world is overpopulated as it is.

True, people have 4 or 5 kids when they are in their 20's and then wonder how they are going to afford them.