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F9 to be pay protected at WN rates?

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BlueBlood

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Posts
79
A former classmate has told me that the F9 pilots will be pay protected at SWA rates, not their (F9) current rates. He is a SWAPA dude, so I would assume he is all over the details. BTW, I asked him what he makes and he said his first 6 months were 80K and he is a 6 year guy, I think.

What are the F9 folks hearing? It seems to me that would add up pretty quick. I don't know what the F9 pay is now w/ bankruptcy, but it is a sizable raise even on top of their pre-BK pay.

Is Republic going to honor F9's current rates or pre-BK contract rates? I know BB has said that he would honor (funny word coming from him) F9 contract for three years, but what happens after that?

I wish the best for those of you at F9. Hoopefully there is a solution with a reasonable consolation after seeing your company go through this.
 
Mohawk Allegeny will require seat protection and relative seniority to each seat. Its federal law.
 
instructordude said:
Mohawk Allegeny will require seat protection and relative seniority to each seat. Its federal law.
Click to expand...

Wrong, here is the actual language from the A/M law concerning seniority integration:

".. In addition, the Allegheny-Mohawk order required that seniority systems be integrated in a “fair and equitable manner” and provided mediation and arbitration to resolve disputes over LPPs. ..."

You should stick to instructing or something else you actually have a clue about!

If you want to read the whole thing here is a link: www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hrd/pubs/airlinemg.pdf
 
Allegheny-Mohawk nor Bond-McCaskill will come in play here. The company has built into their proposal a contigency that if LABOR doesn't come to an agreement (arbitration being not agreeing) they are out. No deal. It has been stated publicly that their labor relations are more important than this deal. A-G/B-M are not in play.

BTW, are you an attorney? I mean SWA has like a whole floor of them and they are certain they are able to do their business this way. Perhaps they should have consulted the law firm of Flight Info, Flight Info, and ******************************bag, L. L. P. before crafting their proposal.

Dude
 
Last edited:
luv2fly said:
Wrong, here is the actual language from the A/M law concerning seniority integration:

".. In addition, the Allegheny-Mohawk order required that seniority systems be integrated in a “fair and equitable manner” and provided mediation and arbitration to resolve disputes over LPPs. ..."

You should stick to instructing or something else you actually have a clue about!

If you want to read the whole thing here is a link: www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hrd/pubs/airlinemg.pdf
Click to expand...

I do have a clue tough guy. A Frontier Capt half way up the seniority list will be half way up a SWA Capt list as will an F/O. Just like the Age 65 rule it is federal law, Get use to it.
 
instructordude said:
I do have a clue tough guy. A Frontier Capt half way up the seniority list will be half way up a SWA Capt list as will an F/O. Just like the Age 65 rule it is federal law, Get use to it.
Click to expand...


Just read the language, you can read can't you?
 
canyonblue said:
Nice photo of you at "Airplane Day" at the local airport. BTW, how did you fit into the seat? :laugh:
Click to expand...


Dude said:
Alright guys, lets not beat up the fat kid. Move along.......nothing to see here.
Click to expand...

Hey Fellas, lighten up. He is a harmless self-confessed troll that chooses various avatars of cheesy cockpit photos . I actually like his dry sarcasm!:)
 
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You really don't understand

instructordude said:
I do have a clue tough guy. A Frontier Capt half way up the seniority list will be half way up a SWA Capt list as will an F/O. Just like the Age 65 rule it is federal law, Get use to it.
Click to expand...

Don't think so. SWA pilots are not going to give F9 pilots that type of seniority. Just isn't going to happen. If FAPA can not see the writing on the wall then they can go work for Replublic. If they take the staple at SWA (which they will have to vote and approve) then they will get the higher of (SWA pay rates or what they are making at F9).
 
airlinepilot said:
Don't think so. SWA pilots are not going to give F9 pilots that type of seniority. Just isn't going to happen. If FAPA can not see the writing on the wall then they can go work for Replublic. If they take the staple at SWA (which they will have to vote and approve) then they will get the higher of (SWA pay rates or what they are making at F9).
Click to expand...

Actually I think the original post was pay protected at SWA rates, not just current pay rate. That is huge for the F9 guys. Just using APC rates that is a 27% pay raise for the top CA and 34% raise for the most junior FO.
 
airlinepilot said:
Don't think so. SWA pilots are not going to give F9 pilots that type of seniority. Just isn't going to happen. If FAPA can not see the writing on the wall then they can go work for Replublic. If they take the staple at SWA (which they will have to vote and approve) then they will get the higher of (SWA pay rates or what they are making at F9).
Click to expand...

They'll take it to an arbritrator who will enforce seat protection and a blend of DOH/relative seniority. Its federal law.
 
......so any thoughts from the F9 dudes? I am curious what your thoughts are regarding pay protection at WN rates.

Bueller..............Bueller............
 
BlueBlood said:
A former classmate has told me that the F9 pilots will be pay protected at SWA rates, not their (F9) current rates. He is a SWAPA dude, so I would assume he is all over the details. BTW, I asked him what he makes and he said his first 6 months were 80K and he is a 6 year guy, I think.

What are the F9 folks hearing? It seems to me that would add up pretty quick. I don't know what the F9 pay is now w/ bankruptcy, but it is a sizable raise even on top of their pre-BK pay.

Is Republic going to honor F9's current rates or pre-BK contract rates? I know BB has said that he would honor (funny word coming from him) F9 contract for three years, but what happens after that?

I wish the best for those of you at F9. Hoopefully there is a solution with a reasonable consolation after seeing your company go through this.
Click to expand...

Thanks, this whole thing is giving me diarrhea and erectile disfunction... LoL, They aren't telling us much except that there will be some pay increases with R over the next 3 years... after that, who knows. All these rumors about WN and stapling, possible integration, maybe offering preferential interviews based on needs, to not hiring anyone... WhoTF knows any more. We just need some facts, I'm tired of the speculation... Honor, yeah that is a funny word coming out of his mouth.
 
P,

Thanks. It must suck being in your shoes right now. Maybe at the end of the day WN can make you whole........financially.

For me, it's all about the money. It has always been about the money. That's why we put up with the BS. It certainly isn't because flying a narrowbody is that much fun. I had more fun in my career when I flew smaller stuff with less.

I could really give a $hit about seat..........pay me! Time off and money.
 
"I do have a clue tough guy. A Frontier Capt half way up the seniority list will be half way up a SWA Capt list as will an F/O. Just like the Age 65 rule it is federal law, Get use to it."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I'll bet you a dollar its a little different than that.
 
I'm not sure we're reading this correctly. there are a few ways that a 'pay protection' could go down.

1 - it depends on if FAPA guys bring their current longevity to any combined list for pay/vacation purposes

2 - it depends on how the integration goes, obviously. any type of ratio/feather and they'd see higher rates from day one at SWA pay so pay protection wouldn't be necessary

3 - assume a staple for the sake of this argument. it wouldn't make sense to 'pay protect' them at 12 year SWA captain rates. it would make sense to make sure they make at least the same as they made at F9 prior to A&M. So, there would seem to be some kind of conversion of their hourly rates to our trip rates, and they would maintain that higher rater until they surpass it at normal SWA pay scales.

doesn't seem that tough to figure out. "pay protection" that paid F9 guys 1st year SWA wages wouldn't be pay protection. neither would "pay protection" that paid the well above their current rates. the idea of pay protection is so that no one takes a pay cut in the merger.

thoughts?
 

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