CitationShares laying off another 40 pilots

[commuterguy]

This is on top of the 20 something a few months ago. Bad time to be a pilot.

 

[highnpressurizd]

At this point the thread starter is somewhat full of it. We did receive word that if conditions did not improve in the coming weeks we would see a reduction in staff (not just pilots). No confirmation of furloughs yet, and certainly no numbers. Possible - Yes. Probable - more so than I'd like to admit. However, until it happens, please refrain from making statements as if they were factual.

 

[B19 Flyer]

At this point the thread starter is somewhat full of it. We did receive word that if conditions did not improve in the coming weeks we would see a reduction in staff (not just pilots). No confirmation of furloughs yet, and certainly no numbers. Possible - Yes. Probable - more so than I'd like to admit. However, until it happens, please refrain from making statements as if they were factual.

It's the fear mongering.

He states it's a bad time to be a pilot.

In reality, it's simply a great time if you are employed regardless of what you do for a living or the career choices you've made.

 

[hyflyin]

It's the fear mongering.

He states it's a bad time to be a pilot.

In reality, it's simply a great time if you are employed regardless of what you do for a living or the career choices you've made.

Amen to that!

 

[commuterguy]

I'll rephrase it for you Mr. Jetblue, since you're right. It is a bad time for ME to be a pilot, since I will most likely be out of a job here shortly, because of the dumb choice I made leaving a regional for a "secure" fractional job. I'm sure no Southwest captain is boohooing about it being a bad time to be a pilot. I stand corrected.


If things "imporve" in the next few weeks???? Please.......

 

[tdwnds1]

Anyone who has a job should be happy in these times.

I have no desire to see ANYMORE pilots furloughed. Alot of these guys are friends of mine and they have families to support.

I wish CS success as with all the fractionals

 

[bailout]

I'll rephrase it for you Mr. Jetblue, since you're right. It is a bad time for ME to be a pilot, since I will most likely be out of a job here shortly, because of the dumb choice I made leaving a regional for a "secure" fractional job. I'm sure no Southwest captain is boohooing about it being a bad time to be a pilot. I stand corrected.


If things "imporve" in the next few weeks???? Please.......

I feel your pain.. I think about that 'choice' i made to go to the fracs also, but it's simply a timing issue. Life is much better here, BUT, it would be better there with a job, then at a frac without one..

And he said 6-10% which would be somewhere in the 20-38 range.

 

[F/O]

If things "improve" in the next few weeks???? Please.......

Did he really say that?

 

[ominbnd]

It's the fear mongering.

He states it's a bad time to be a pilot.

In reality, it's simply a great time if you are employed regardless of what you do for a living or the career choices you've made.

It's not fear mongering you idiot. Our CEO didn't do much to quell the fear. The guy may be at the bottom of the list. How the F woud you take it if it were you.

CS guys guys don't bother with you so piss off and go back to your own thread and leave us alone.

 

[B19 Flyer]

It's not fear mongering you idiot. Our CEO didn't do much to quell the fear. The guy may be at the bottom of the list. How the F woud you take it if it were you.

CS guys guys don't bother with you so piss off and go back to your own thread and leave us alone.

Actually, I get many PMs from CS guys that support my views. It's probably because they understand the points I make because they are non-union and want no part of your turmoil.

 

[BeeDubya]

It's probably because they understand the points I make because they are non-union and want no part of your turmoil.

If I correctly understand the points above, ominbnd is at a non-Union carrier.

I will agree with you, that considering the state of our economy, anyone who is currently employed is lucky. My heart goes out to all who have been furloughed, laid off, or whose company's have failed. These are tough times.

Brian

 

[ominbnd]

Actually, I get many PMs from CS guys that support my views. It's probably because they understand the points I make because they are non-union and want no part of your turmoil.

Well, I'll go on record and say that I agree with many of your points, not all, but many. As far as handling stupid arguments, you're the master. But who cares? PM's of support you get have nothing whatever to do with this thread.

And your injection of union into it is precisely my point. With you come all the issues. YOU brought up the union. The originator of this thread didn't even hint at it. Then what happens is all your buddies from the other threads hijack it into a union/non-union "friendly" discussion.

This thread was started to open a discussion about layoffs at CS. I take that implication from the title of the thread.

You called one of our buddies a fear mongerer. OK, you didn't use the words "he is a", but clearly that was the implication. We had what I would have called a "hightened concern" about more furloughs before our CEO had the town hall conference call. Not until he SAID there would be further downsizing if things didn't improve (with no mention of what the marker of improvement was to be) was the fear instilled. Again, if one is at the bottom of the list, how are the remarks to be taken? If you're seeking "turmoil" it wasn't there until our CEO's remarks.

I think most guys understand that furloughs are a sad side-effect within our industry. That doesn't make it any easier. So how about just writing that you wish all furloughees from all companies the best, and hope that the economy turns very soon enabling recall of those furloughees.

 

[commuterguy]

Well, I'll go on record and say that I agree with many of your points, not all, but many. As far as handling stupid arguments, you're the master. But who cares? PM's of support you get have nothing whatever to do with this thread.

And your injection of union into it is precisely my point. With you come all the issues. YOU brought up the union. The originator of this thread didn't even hint at it. Then what happens is all your buddies from the other threads hijack it into a union/non-union "friendly" discussion.

This thread was started to open a discussion about layoffs at CS. I take that implication from the title of the thread.

You called one of our buddies a fear mongerer. OK, you didn't use the words "he is a", but clearly that was the implication. We had what I would have called a "hightened concern" about more furloughs before our CEO had the town hall conference call. Not until he SAID there would be further downsizing if things didn't improve (with no mention of what the marker of improvement was to be) was the fear instilled. Again, if one is at the bottom of the list, how are the remarks to be taken? If you're seeking "turmoil" it wasn't there until our CEO's remarks.

I think most guys understand that furloughs are a sad side-effect within our industry. That doesn't make it any easier. So how about just writing that you wish all furloughees from all companies the best, and hope that the economy turns very soon enabling recall of those furloughees.

What he said...

 

[ExJmbDrv]

Sometimes, smoke means fire. I'm hearing there may be some fire here. Anybody heard anything recently?

 

[tdwnds1]

I think its still "smoke" at this point. A friend of mine told me 6 to 10 percent if things dont improve.

I for one truly hope it dosent happen. Its no fun being laid off and trying to take care of your family.

On a brighter note I read recently that flying in January is starting to pick up. Though one month dosent make a trend, mabye theres light at the end of this long tunner.

Just hope its not the oncoming train

 

[tdwnds1]

Also...

I think its time that management and pilots starting working closer together to save jobs. From postings I have read NetJets Union and management have come up with many money saving ideas to save jobs and prevent furloughs.

Perhaps one idea at CitationShares (and please dont flame me for this) is for all pilots AND MANGEMENT to take a 5 percent pay cut. If you multiply that over 300 some pilots plus management staff you might be able to save more than a few jobs. Certainly buyouts are a nice idea, but its better to keep guys working earning (a little less) then have guys totally out of work. It would be the ultimate expression of teamwork in tough times.

I would rather work for a bit less than have my buddies out on the street, especially these days.

Of course this isnt the only idea, just a trail balloon to get things rolling. Obviously other ideas could be presented, but this would have an immediate effect.

Its time we all work together rather than sitting here flaming each other.

PILOTS TAKE CARE OF THEIR OWN!

 

[brokeflyer]

the problem with that is once you throw that card....you'll never be able to get that money back....ever. You will set the bar in a diffrent position and it will ALWAYS get lower.

And they will still furlough anyway.

 

[jonjuan]

the problem with that is once you throw that card....you'll never be able to get that money back....ever. You will set the bar in a diffrent position and it will ALWAYS get lower.

And they will still furlough anyway.

Why can't no furloughs in exchange for pay concessions be a contractual thing, i.e. an updated IBB? I'm sure the bottom 800 or so pilots might be interested versus trying to find a pilot job in this economy.

 

[brokeflyer]

probly because that money you give back will never been seen again. It will set in motion cut after cut after cut after cut.

And I very highly doubt the company would ever agree to such outrageous terms. Taking a pay cut has nothing to do with this. The company would not have the control over the staffing. If you have too many pilots, a pay cut won't fix anything.

Then when times are good you're having to give up more stuff to get the money back that you already had. Furloughs suck, but consessions never work either. 800 is pretty high, I would guess were about 200 pilots heavy. But were always 500+ heavy in the summer anyway.

 

[gunfyter]

Because concessions don't save jobs ... more sales and increased flying do.

If you made less money we still wouldn't need you....