Great Lakes

[mastermike28]

I received an email from Great Lakes saying call to set up an interview. Just a little background on myself. I have 1600TT 250 multi and about 50 turbine sic. I flew for Comair and was furloughed after finishing IOE. I'm about four numbers from the bottom of Comair's senority list, so I'm not too hopeful for a call back any time soon. I am back to flight instructing now, however in this economy there aren't any students to instruct. I have read all the past threads on Great Lakes on this site and other websites. One thing that concerns me about Lakes is the high washout rate. I have read in past threads that in some classes it is up to a 70% washout rate. I have also read that training is not that bad and most people have been making it through training. Can any Lakers chime in on the training, and how recent classes have been doing? I am confident in my flying abilities, but when you hear of such a high number of washouts it becomes something to think about. Another question I was hoping some Lakers could comment on was Frontier being in bankrupcy. In my research I could not find how much flying Lakes does for Frontier. How much of and impact would it be on Lakes if this flying is taken away? It seems to me that Lakes is somewhat of a gamble. For some people that went there and washout of training that could affect them the rest of their career. However, I have read many Ex-Lakers say it was the best career move they made because of the fast TPIC. Any comments on Lakes training and the best crystal ball guess on the future of Lakes would be appreciated, especially from current and former Lakers. Thanks!

 

[N813CA]

Stay AWAY

Stay Away

 

[Browntothebone]

I hear that you have to do full NDB approaches with just an RMI. That would suck without a moving map to see your position. No wonder their training is so hard and washout rate so high.

 

[Avi8tor2000]

Wow, NDB approaches with an RMI? Scary stuff...

Yeah,if you can't handle "very challenging" things like that, probably notthe place for you. Don't you have to do those on an instrument checkride though? Sad.

 

[Browntothebone]

Wow, NDB approaches with an RMI? Scary stuff...

Yeah,if you can't handle "very challenging" things like that, probably notthe place for you. Don't you have to do those on an instrument checkride though? Sad.

Not if your plane doesn't have an ADF. I didn't have to do one on my IFR checkride. We trained on GPS and all approaches were strait ins. They are easy. I'd hate to have to fly an actual NDB with just an RMI down to mins in actual and then have to circle to a runway with minimal lighting, especially at night. Give me my FMC, GPS and moving map. NDB approaches are obsolete and dangerous.

 

[BEfly]

I hear that you have to do full NDB approaches with just an RMI. That would suck without a moving map to see your position. No wonder their training is so hard and washout rate so high.

I used to do them with a fixed card ADF

 

[Browntothebone]

I used to do them with a fixed card ADF

Now that's just plain insanity.

 

[Salukipilot4590]

I couldnt imagine being an instrument pilot without the ADF.

Seriously...I've shot a couple apps in IMC...its not that hard when you really think about it.

 

[Browntothebone]

I couldnt imagine being an instrument pilot without the ADF.

Seriously...I've shot a couple apps in IMC...its not that hard when you really think about it.

See, I don't want to have to "think about it" I just want to load the approach in the FMS and have it do the thinking for me.

 

[General Lee]

Bring a thick jacket....

Monday, January 12, 2009 (on Jetphotos.net)

Great Lakes adds service to four Montana cities

Beginning Feb. 1, commercial service will return to the Montana cities of Glasgow,Glendive, Havre and Wolf Point.

Great Lakes Aviation of Cheyenne, Wyo., announced Wednesday it will resume daily between the four cities and Billings. Those cities and three others in eastern Montana were served for three decades by Big Sky Airlines, but financial problems forced the airline out of business last March. Great Lakes assumed Big Sky’s federal Essential contract to serve Montana. Essential Air Service is a program offering airlines federal subsidies to serve routes to small cities that otherwise would be unprofitable.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Homer Jay]

Stay Away

I had a hell of a lot more fun at Great Lakes than I did flying for that Northern Craptucky Airline known as Comair.

 

[Vegaspilot99]

How did you apply? Fax? Mail? E-mail? I applied online at the Lakes website about 6-8 weeks ago and never heard anything. That was back when you could still apply for CA. I tried both. I have heard they shy away from high time guys...any truth to that?

 

[mastermike28]

Thanks for the article. I applied on their website for a first officer position. Heard back within two weeks. Not sure if they shy away from high time guys.

 

[Regul8r]

I'd be more concerned about the pay. In this market, all the TPIC time in the world won't get you a job if the big boys aren't hiring. If you can hack the sub-par pay for 5-10 years, then go for it.

 

[embpic1]

I was at Lakes for many years. If you are worried about doing an NDB using only an RMI then Lakes is not the place for you. You will be flying into many non-radar environments and doing the full approach when you can't get the visual. During the winter months you will be doing it down to minimums on snow covered runways. You will become a very profficent pilot and it will show in your future job interviews.

If you rely heavily on moving maps then you will be behind the curve. The training is tough but if you have the right attitude and work hard you will succeed there.

I am greatfull for the great people I worked with there and the experience I attained. I wouldn't trade it for anything. I may have moved on, but I will always be a Laker.

 

[ePilot22]

I received an email from Great Lakes saying call to set up an interview. Just a little background on myself. I have 1600TT 250 multi and about 50 turbine sic. I flew for Comair and was furloughed after finishing IOE. I'm about four numbers from the bottom of Comair's senority list, so I'm not too hopeful for a call back any time soon. I am back to flight instructing now, however in this economy there aren't any students to instruct. I have read all the past threads on Great Lakes on this site and other websites. One thing that concerns me about Lakes is the high washout rate. I have read in past threads that in some classes it is up to a 70% washout rate. I have also read that training is not that bad and most people have been making it through training. Can any Lakers chime in on the training, and how recent classes have been doing? Worry about yourself, not how others are doing. Go in prepared to study! Lakes is very through and they don't care if you fail. If you try, you will do fine. Just focus.

I am confident in my flying abilities, but when you hear of such a high number of washouts it becomes something to think about. Another question I was hoping some Lakers could comment on was Frontier being in bankrupcy.

In my research I could not find how much flying Lakes does for Frontier. Lakes does zero flying for F9. They are strickly EAS flying.

How much of and impact would it be on Lakes if this flying is taken away? None.

It seems to me that Lakes is somewhat of a gamble. For some people that went there and washout of training that could affect them the rest of their career. These people did it to themselves. Focus on your abilities and you'll do fine.

However, I have read many Ex-Lakers say it was the best career move they made because of the fast TPIC. No so fast today, but still there.

Any comments on Lakes training and the best crystal ball guess on the future of Lakes would be appreciated, especially from current and former Lakers. Lakes will be around as long as the government can fit the bill.

Thanks!

Brownontheboner STFU! You're flamebaiting is weak! You couldn't even cut it in a Jerry Springer forum.







eP.

 

[rumrunner300]

I was at Lakes for many years. If you are worried about doing an NDB using only an RMI then Lakes is not the place for you. You will be flying into many non-radar environments and doing the full approach when you can't get the visual. During the winter months you will be doing it down to minimums on snow covered runways. You will become a very profficent pilot and it will show in your future job interviews.

If you rely heavily on moving maps then you will be behind the curve. The training is tough but if you have the right attitude and work hard you will succeed there.

I am greatfull for the great people I worked with there and the experience I attained. I wouldn't trade it for anything. I may have moved on, but I will always be a Laker.

Well said. I have always thought that the day I left Lakes was the day I began my gradual decline in pure pilot skills. To borrow a line from the Chairman, if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.

That being said, if Q asks you to go boating, beware.

 

[embpic1]

That being said, if Q asks you to go boating, beware.

LOL. I have been boating with Q a few times. He is quite the character!

 

[Salukipilot4590]

To be honest...seriously...the flying that lakes does in the 1900 looks like one hell of a fun time! I jumped on them a few times from STL - MWA and would have LOVED to strap on a Bose and have at it!

Put the ole application in there about a month ago and haven't heard back so I'm thinking they don't need my kind...

 

[deadstick]

Have things gotten any better in MKE? I heard there have been a few cx for various reasons. What's the chance of going there after training? I hear it's a TDY operation. Do you have to report to DEN/STL first and then go to MKE, or do you report directly to MKE? Just curious...

 

[Homer Jay]

Well said. I have always thought that the day I left Lakes was the day I began my gradual decline in pure pilot skills. To borrow a line from the Chairman, if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.

That being said, if Q asks you to go boating, beware.

That is so true! I have been gone from Lakes for some time now and I can honestly say I am no longer the pilot I once was. Technology makes you lazy! But again, once a Laker, always a Laker!

 

[Uncle Bunkle]

I used to do them with a fixed card ADF

I didn't know the Wright Bros. Flyer had instruments...

 

[Trogdor]

I have heard they shy away from high time guys...any truth to that?

100% true.

 

[Trogdor]

What's the chance of going there after training? I hear it's a TDY operation. Do you have to report to DEN/STL first and then go to MKE, or do you report directly to MKE? Just curious...

Chance of getting MKE: zero.

It is TDY out of STL and there is a list of people waiting to bid there already.

 

[DrunkIrishman]

If you are applying for a job flying a B-1900 doing EAS you should probably assume the flying might be a bit challenging as compared to flying into larger airports with ILS's and good airport services. Lakes does not have the ability to put guys and gals online that lack BAI skills and hence it is built into their training syllabus. Not everyone that goes there has profficient BAI skills and eventually they encounter trouble. However, I have never seen a 70% washout rate and I would suspect it is more of a rumour.

 

[BEfly]

I didn't know the Wright Bros. Flyer had instruments...

Suprisingly it was the most reliable instruments in that old lance I flew.

I couldn't do that now. I just load it up in the Pro Line and watch it happen! As a matter of fact, I can't even remember the last time I shot a NDB approach...

 

[staylow]

No weak pilots allowed!

I had a hell of a lot more fun at Great Lakes than I did flying for that Northern Craptucky Airline known as Comair.

I agree! I spent enough time at GLA to upgrade and get my turbine pic...it was a billion time better and funner. It's no place for weak pilots who can't hand fly in the mountains, in thunderstorms, high winds, windshear, snow storms, blizzards, icing conditions (where you blow the boots...no ice detection system), no flight director, no moving map, full procedure turns, into an uncontrolled airports at night and your FO has 240 hours TT and just finished IOE two nights ago. If your instrument scan is weak and you don't know how to enter a hold...you will wash out...that is just the facts. Lakers for life. Once a Laker always a Laker.

 

[earl]

As a non-laker, nor a regional pilot, I have a ton of respect for Lakers. Probably the purest form of regional flying there is.

If you're a good pilot then go there, if not then go home.

earl

 

[CX880]

If you're a good pilot then go there, if not then go home.

l

What?? This NDB partial panel, mountain flying, single engine approaches in icing macho attitude is getting a little old. It's not a matter of being a good pilot, it's a matter of wanting to do that type of flying. Lots of guys could do it they just prefer moving maps and GPS's and a decent quality of life. That doesn't make them bad pilots. Anybody can become a great lakes pilot apparently since not long ago they hired wet commercials.

 

[Vavso]

The little i know

If you fail out in training no one knows you are not an employee until after the check ride . I heard in May 4 out of 5 bombed out then last i heard this fall 14 out of 15 made it .You practice on Pcatd's in indoc to see where your weakness is prior to getting near the sim . If you cannot fly an NDB approach with an RMI and are an instructor there is a problem . Would I leave a regional I was furloughed from and sign a 15 month $7500 promissary note ?? That is a decision you have to make . Good luck with your decision .