ASA furloughs 80 pilots

[acpilot]

I sent an email to BH and he really liked the idea. He indicated that he would talk with a few people about getting this going. Join with me to donate 50.00 per month.

I'm not ASA...or a regional pilot for that matter...but where do I send a check?

 

[ASA_Aviator]

If you really feel that strongly about this issue, I would suggest that you should do exactly that. There are 80 people that are soon to be out of a job. Why not drop a personal message with your name in each of their mailboxes? With a month until unemployment hits, I would imagine that more than one of these affected pilots will be checking their mailboxes with the hope that the situation has changed and that they will still be employed in the near future; It's fairly certain that they would receive your declaration of priorities.

With regards to your assertion that the best way to return these folks to the line would be to pick up open time created by their absence, well, I would opine that not a single one of the 80 on the list would share your feelings on the matter.


Respectfully,


Glenn Wickline
ATR72/CRJ200 FO

I hate that we are furloughing. I want that to be out there. I would gladly give $50 or $100 a month to be distributed to those furloughed.

What we should be focusing on is getting them back as quickly as possible, and to do that we must do our jobs efficiently, on time, and with good customer service. Costing the company money by paying me or you 1.5 the normal cost of the trip is not efficient. Believe me, if we start junior manning because people aren't picking up open time, any motivation that people had to support the cause will be gone the first time they miss a day off or an early duty-out.

The company isn't going to recall anyone just because people aren't picking up open time. Not picking it up will not save anyone's job, it will just make our operation more expensive, and make line pilots (and reserves too) suffer. Reserves will come in for a day line, and go home 6 days later.

If you think that not picking up open time will help, call or email Scott Hall, and ask him what he thinks. I'm sure we would all be interested to see what the management perspective is on the subject.

The fact is that you who are against it feel the way you do based on pure emotion. You just "feel" that it is wrong, and don't understand the ramifications. (No one will be recalled, and YOU will be junior assigned more frequently.)

I don't have a dog in the fight, you know that. I'm just trying to put some reason into the argument.

 

[Texx]

The best way is get everyone on the mainline seniority list.... course with all the lifers that have taken hold at the various regionals that prospect is less and less likely every day. Even though many of those would have loved the idea 10 years ago when they were young enough but still had the black marks keeping them from going the way they should have......

hahahahah. Black marks..

 

[CFI2766]

What we should be focusing on is getting them back as quickly as possible, and to do that we must do our jobs efficiently, on time, and with good customer service.

On this, I believe that we agree completely.

More than once I've already received mini-lectures from guys that don't understand, or, are simply too lazy to fly the CI speeds. To OMA, no less. I even came across one guy who swore that that CI was not yet activated. Dumb, Dumb, DUMB.

Slightly more rational, now, I'll freely admit: you might have better data on the cost differences between flying the existing pilots occasionally at extension pay versus bringing furloughed pilots back on line. I would love to see this data, accurately and honestly (not spun to serve any agenda), made public.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Glenn,

Do you fly your legs according to the CI? What do these Capt's say to you if they aren't following them, but you are trying to?

 

[FishandFly]

My only issue for contributing money to our newly furloughed guys is that not all of them need it.

There is a big difference between offering money to a guy who has a family and student loans than offering money to a guy who's parents paid $180k for him to go to riddle and he now plans to go back to live with his parents for the next year.

My humble suggestion would be that it be a direct help rather than involving the company or anyone else.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Personally, I'm not an advocate of picking up open time, but it's an inevitability.

How about for the displaced captains- what if they pick up open time as an FO to meet the financial picture they painted when they were Captains? Some of the Captains on the ATR were in the left seat for nearly a full year before going back to being an FO. Is it wrong for them to make up the loss in pay through extra work?

As for a list of those that do, it's just not going to happen. Why would the company make that information accessible to the union in order to prevent pilots from doing the very thing they foster? Secondly, our companie's record keeping and payroll departments have sucked beyond belief for so long it's not even funny..........would you really trust them to get an accurate list, or even display the right information with the right names? How would you like to find yourself on that list knowing full well that you have never flown anything from the open time pot. Try telling people it wasn't you- yea, that's gonna be believable to your comrades that see your mistaken name on the list.

The solution is quite simple, the way I see it. The objective is to get our people back. Keep performance up, fuel burn down, and do what you can to be as cheap as possible, and the company will have a future that requires the skill of those that are on furlough. Open time may influence the staffing model, but it's going to be negligible at best........

If you want to take care of them- forget the open time issue and donate money or pay into the pot for their COBRA, etc.

OMG, picking up open time will directly affect the guys on the street, it will make the company able to do more with less! As for keeping performance up and fuel burn down. Never mind, you will never understand, the one and only power we as a group have is our ability to control efficiencies of operation. The only thing the companies understand is cash, you save it for them they will not only gladly take it, but expect more, and will even take more of yours for themselves. SKYW only recognizes one thing, money, if you don't understand that, too bad you will lose every time, and in fact already have, ask the 80.
You guys embrace Brad, good for you, watch your wallet, while you are hugging he will slip out of your pocket and in to his own. We "dealt him and ace" and regret(and are paying for it daily) it dearly!
Good luck, you are gonna need it!
PBR

 

[JumpersAway]

OMG, picking up open time will directly affect the guys on the street, it will make the company able to do more with less! As for keeping performance up and fuel burn down. Never mind, you will never understand, the one and only power we as a group have is our ability to control efficiencies of operation. The only thing the companies understand is cash, you save it for them they will not only gladly take it, but expect more, and will even take more of yours for themselves. SKYW only recognizes one thing, money, if you don't understand that, too bad you will lose every time, and in fact already have, ask the 80.
You guys embrace Brad, good for you, watch your wallet, while you are hugging he will slip out of your pocket and in to his own. We "dealt him and ace" and regret(and are paying for it daily) it dearly!
Good luck, you are gonna need it!
PBR

PBR- actually, I do understand. I understand that the company will cover the flying in open time regardless of whether it is picked up or not- they'll just get crafty in how they construct the lines or reserves....Not to mention everyones favorite- THE EXTENSION (in the rectum via ACARS)

You still didn't address those that took a 40% paycut, and continue to get bypassed with junior people on equipment they should be holding. I believe this will answer things in regard to "hugging Brad". Frankly, I'm not feeling any love here from management, so how much do you think I've got for them. Let me help you out with that....................NONE.

I'm as unhappy about the situation as everyone else, and I hurt for our furloughed guys. However, thinking that buzzing by open time is going to get 80 guys back is a joke. I still contend it's negligible at best. However, I guess the proof will be in the pudding when the lines get adjusted with their absense- how much open time will there be to pick up?

Frankly, I think that if a list is in order, it should be with the tards that can't figure out how to read a memo on cost index flying and how it works. Don't you think the quickest way to get 80 folks back is through growth, or in the least, survival? We're stuck in a telephone booth in a knife fight, and the afformentioned is the fix to guarantee we come out on top- for the long haul.

 

[777forever]

IMO, when reserve coverage starts becoming low everyday and most reserves are flying over MMG, THAT is what will bring the 80 back.

Now whether not picking up opentime will make the above happen is up for debate.

To me it depends on how much opentime there is.

 

[McNugent]

I'm thinking people are going to pick up open time no matter how much you guys want to argue about it. Everyone has their reasons. As for me, I'll leave the open time pot alone til the 80 return, which is tough since I'm usually a whore for building my lines up. Times are tough, and we'll all feel the pinch in some way, unfortunately some more than others.

 

[av8rbama]

Glenn,

Do you fly your legs according to the CI? What do these Capt's say to you if they aren't following them, but you are trying to?

My captains that don't embrace CI have told me in the initial brief, "you fly it like you want to, I'll fly it like I want to... deal?"

 

[PBRstreetgang]

PBR- actually, I do understand. I understand that the company will cover the flying in open time regardless of whether it is picked up or not- they'll just get crafty in how they construct the lines or reserves....Not to mention everyones favorite- THE EXTENSION (in the rectum via ACARS)

Ask yourself how much the 80 are hurting, then call in "Not Fit to Fly", Sick or unfit, problem solved, one pilot at a time will solve it. If you aren't man enough to hang tough, oh well.

You still didn't address those that took a 40% paycut, and continue to get bypassed with junior people on equipment they should be holding. I believe this will answer things in regard to "hugging Brad". Frankly, I'm not feeling any love here from management, so how much do you think I've got for them. Let me help you out with that....................NONE.

No answer, sorry, Brad sucks and I am glad he is your problem!

I'm as unhappy about the situation as everyone else, and I hurt for our furloughed guys. However, thinking that buzzing by open time is going to get 80 guys back is a joke. I still contend it's negligible at best. However, I guess the proof will be in the pudding when the lines get adjusted with their absense- how much open time will there be to pick up?

You gotta draw the line somewhere, if I found out you were picking up open time while I was on furlough, we would have some problems, personally.

Frankly, I think that if a list is in order, it should be with the tards that can't figure out how to read a memo on cost index flying and how it works. Don't you think the quickest way to get 80 folks back is through growth, or in the least, survival? We're stuck in a telephone booth in a knife fight, and the afformentioned is the fix to guarantee we come out on top- for the long haul.

The growth "Myth" is the past, SKYW works on the "work 'em like a rented mule" philosophy, if you don't stand up you will take it in the pooter sitting down.
PBR

 

[JumpersAway]

You gotta draw the line somewhere, if I found out you were picking up open time while I was on furlough, we would have some problems, personally.

PBR

Sorry you feel that way, but "we" wouldn't have a problem..........."you" would. If you wanted to tote that hate, it's your baggage. Personally, I'll keep to the Hawaiian shirt and flip flop mentality of WTF ever......It keeps my blood pressure down: )

Although, you and some of the others here do have a point regarding the amount of open time. I will say, I will be watching closely to judge wheather or not we're being taken advantage of at the expense of the 80. If there's an abundance of it, then forget it- should have had some more people on call. However, if it's at a level that I feel is acceptable, then I may be inclined to work my line up a trip or two, frankly. I guess we'll see what happens.

As for the myth on growth- I still feel that, unfortunately, not all the players will survive 09'. Personally, I'd rather be on the winning team.

Cut our pay in half like I did, then come to me and talk about "manning up". I'm already looking for a second job.........Does that need elaboration in regard to how that is working out. And no, I don't have five ex's with a mistress, a mansion, and a brand new vette..........

 

[Klr2land]

Don't Cut Off Nose to Spite Face

If you do not pick up open time, you save the company money because they will give it to an idle reserve who is being paid anyway. You play right into management's hands by refusing to pick up open time.

The only time this will not be true is when all of the reserves are going over guarantee. Don't pick up open time when it gets to that point!

But for now, you should help yourself.

 

[CFI2766]

My captains that don't embrace CI have told me in the initial brief, "you fly it like you want to, I'll fly it like I want to... deal?"

It hasn't happened often, but this sums it up. Not an exact quote, but pretty close. I'll then assume the role of the helpful FO sharing what I just learned in training, and the response is exactly like trying to teach my mom how to use her email: semi-polite attentiveness followed by incomprehension.