Southwest Airlines questions

[GuppyWN]

2008-9 is not the time to be looking for a big pay raise. If you think it is then you haven't been listening to the news. I would suggest we accept what is on the table agreed to so far, for a period of two years and then come back and negotiate the pay when we have some better feel for how many yrs this recovery is going to take. Some folks think the economy could remain in recession for many yrs. I don't object to a pay raise if you can prove that the company is going to be able to afford it and compete as a low cost leader into the future. I don't believe anything Dan Atkins has to say in the union rag. He was the guy that advised American pilots for their negotiatons and you can see where they are today.

Bake what is it you want to post? ASA thanks for the pointers. Since it has nothing constructive in it I will ignore it. I haven't called names just put out my opinions....try sticking to the subject.

Big pay raise? No problem. Just tie our raises to the federal cost of living adjustments. I'm fine with that.

Settle now and come back in two years? You do realize that we've been in active negotiations since March 2006 - right? No way I'm coming back and starting this clock over in 2 years.

Dude....... does the federal government give you a COLA on your retirement check? Why then do you not feel we deserve one?

Gup

 

[ASADFW7]

Ben I apologize if I was calling you names. It frustrates the employees of SWA when outsiders pretend to know what the company needs, pretend to know what the pilot contract should reflect. Unless you have worked for the company you do not have an accurate understanding of our issues.

Currently, SWA is the last company of size that is operating all of their flights with their own equipment and staff. Once that goes, the mighty SWA will no longer be what it once was.

As for compensation it is relative to earnings and productivity. So what we get paid more, but have to work more hours to accomplish it. Relative is not what it seems unless you work here.

So you sit on the outside looking in throwing rocks at us. Good for you. When you get here give it time, you will see how the company operates.

 

[waitin]

ASA, Ben works here (says "light twins for SWA" in his info box).
Gup, with the economy being so shaky and things in the industry changing so much yeay to year, why would we want a long contract? I usually hear 3 years max...I know negotiations are a pain, but I don't think we want to be tied to anything too long that we negotiate while the economy's so bad.

 

[Bobby Orr 4]

Read it first

What concerns me here is guys saying they will vote yes or no on a TA without reading it first.
RJ code share concerns me because history shows the long term affects. Nothing happens immediately. After a code share is reached 2 years into the future you are still an FO in the XXX domicile. Today you bid 100 out of 300. 2 years later you are now bidding 115 out of 280. A closer look at the bid lines you realize that 2 years ago there were 260 hard lines in base and now there are 225 hard lines. You ask yourself when the last time an upgrade class happened.
AMR stated 10 years ago they would use rjs to build a market up then take it over with mainline equipment. Ask any APA pilot what has happened in 10 years.
Beware rj code share guys. Age 65 has delayed our upgrades significantly. Let's not do it to ourselves.
Murf I do respectfully disagree with you. When you state you trust the company more than your union you are a part of the problem. Chuck and Gary love the fact that we have pilots who trust the company more than their union.
Chuck is doing his best to under mind the union whenever he has the opportunity. It is his job and these are negotiations.
What every pilot has to think when we do receive a TA is the bottom pilot on the seniority list. Looking forward to the end of this but willing to be patient.

 

[Bake]

Red dog...you were in and chose to leave. You did what you had to do. I stayed made less but got a guartanteed retirement. You made your bed, I made mine. Live with it! I am not part of the problem with the union. The greedy guys who say they won't sign for less than 5% they are the problem. I am happy, working less and making more than ever before.

Ben, above is what I will post. I will let the SWAPA forum understand who you think is greedy and tell all of them to "live with it".

Better yet, why don't you get on the SWAPA forum and post the above with your name attached.

Bake

 

[Captzaahlie]

Clown,

Do you feel it when you fart?

I'm sure he feels it but only if he puts his hand

down there.....:laugh:

I'm surprised if Tanker Clown has any flatulence

I'm guessing he never stops running his mouth

long enough to build up any pressure.

 

[Caveman]

I'm not a SWA pilot so this is just an outside observers opinion.

All you have to do is look at airline history to see what happens when management is allowed to outsource any flying. Look at what happened to the legacy carriers.

If you are already in the left seat be prepared to watch your relative seniority stagnate. No more looking forward to the day when you can finally hold some holidays or weekends off.

If you are ready to upgrade be prepared to wait some more. Potentially a lot more. When you do upgrade you'll be sitting reserve at a base you may not like for a lot longer than you originally thought.

If you are on the bottom half of the FO seniority list you may never see a decent line as a Captain. Ask any 18 year American Airlines FO how they like the way things have played out. Yeah, they can hold CA but on narrow body a/c out of a domicile that just doesn't work for them.

Seriously, the only people that would benefit from agreeing to any outsourcing are those senior Captains that already have choice schedules. They get the benefit of more money, more vacation and more whatever else. Everybody else will feel the pain of outsourcing to one degree or another.

Just say no. Don't do it or you'll regret it later.

 

[Whataburger]

I agree with the above post.
But can a Jet Blue guy give their opinion of how the RJs on their certificate has helped/hurt them?
I'm curious if a second type (RJ) that WE fly would be a good move. Jet Blue style.

 

[The Victors]

I agree with the above post.
But can a Jet Blue guy give their opinion of how the RJs on their certificate has helped/hurt them?
I'm curious if a second type (RJ) that WE fly would be a good move. Jet Blue style.

Good question. Anybody??

 

[murano]

Seriously, the only people that would benefit from agreeing to any outsourcing are those senior Captains that already have choice schedules. They get the benefit of more money, more vacation and more whatever else. Everybody else will feel the pain of outsourcing to one degree or another.

...and guess who's on the BOD and Negotiation Committee?
​

 

[Scope out RJ's]

We're trying to get a large contingent to text-in Dancing with the Stars to get Warren Sapp back into the swing of things. I personally want to see Brook Bourke back in Playboy.

Actually our contract is being negotiated right now, and a big hang-up is everyone's opinion on what the pilots, union, and company should allow on the section of our contract regarding Codeshare. Allegedly there is a TA on the language and that, along with the contract will be up for vote sooner than later.

Maybe when you get your furlough after the reduction in flying, you can fly for one of the rj feeders that Southwest is contracting out to.

 

[Whataburger]

Maybe when you get your furlough after the reduction in flying, you can fly for one of the rj feeders that Southwest is contracting out to.

Maybe. Which one should I apply to? You have give away Billions in revenue and countless jobs to RJ feeders, enlighten me oh wise one.

 

[Whataburger]

...and guess who's on the BOD and Negotiation Committee?​

Wierd and wacky small world huh? I bet the ATA folks are pretty happy with that.

 

[Caveman]

I agree with the above post.
But can a Jet Blue guy give their opinion of how the RJs on their certificate has helped/hurt them?
I'm curious if a second type (RJ) that WE fly would be a good move. Jet Blue style.

All the new jobs at JetBlue are on the 190. There hasn't been an Airbus pilot hired in months. The Airbus fleet has stagnated just exactly as I described above. Even so, I'd MUCH rather we add airplanes and pilots to our seniority list than to somebody elses. I don't like the pay rates on the 190, but it's still better that JetBlue pilots are flying them. IMO if SWA is determined to fly smaller aircraft you guys would be better off in the long run if you keep it in house.

 

[Whataburger]

All the new jobs at JetBlue are on the 190. There hasn't been an Airbus pilot hired in months. The Airbus fleet has stagnated just exactly as I described above. Even so, I'd MUCH rather we add airplanes and pilots to our seniority list than to somebody elses. I don't like the pay rates on the 190, but it's still better that JetBlue pilots are flying them. IMO if SWA is determined to fly smaller aircraft you guys would be better off in the long run if you keep it in house.

Agreed. All legacies farmed-out this flying. In my opinion it gave away growth. I would rather fly a RJ at less pay than give the flying to someone else.