Does Jetblue have any SCOPE?

[coogebeachhotel]

Can the company give 190 flying away down the road once the management figures out a regional can do the same level of service for at least 10% less.

 

[flatspin7]

Well the fact that Jetblue doenst have a union (yet) means that Management can do what ever it wants.

 

[A350]

Cooge:

Were you here during the E190 integration? Management used ExpressJet to cover certain flights while the E190's were sent to BNA for mods.

Management will be the first to tell you that they (ExpressJet) did a great job, but that is not the experience that our customers have come to expect.

While management can do it, the question one would ask is why? If it were money, they would never have brought the E190 on the property to begin with. If money were so important, we wouldn't have a lot of what we have outside of our contracts.

A350

 

[waterski]

Well the fact that Jetblue doenst have a union (yet) means that Management can do what ever it wants.

Right, ALPA will be able to avoid it.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Cooge:

Were you here during the E190 integration? Management used ExpressJet to cover certain flights while the E190's were sent to BNA for mods.

Management will be the first to tell you that they (ExpressJet) did a great job, but that is not the experience that our customers have come to expect.

While management can do it, the question one would ask is why? If it were money, they would never have brought the E190 on the property to begin with. If money were so important, we wouldn't have a lot of what we have outside of our contracts.

A350

Expressjet pilots running Jetblue 190's in Jetblue colors. That is a bit different.

Back to my question. What is to stop them?

 

[michael707767]

Expressjet pilots running Jetblue 190's in Jetblue colors. That is a bit different.

Back to my question. What is to stop them?

right now.....nothing.

probably one reason the JB pilots are moving toward a union.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

Or JB management could just impose a lower payscale, again there's nothing to stop them from doing that even.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Or JB management could just impose a lower payscale, again there's nothing to stop them from doing that even.

True.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Or JB management could just impose a lower payscale, again there's nothing to stop them from doing that even.

They did that already. They lowered first year pay. It's still an upgrade from Cape Air though.

Those that got pay raises did so because JetBlue found a way to finance them and make them cost neutral.

PTS for example. Now I just fly sick rather than lose the premium pay.

Sorry, back to scope.

 

[FADEC]

Or JB management could just impose a lower payscale, again there's nothing to stop them from doing that even.

Yes they could but I bet they would see a dramatic increase in their fuel bill even at $55 a barrel.

 

[EatinRamen]

I still can't see how a regional carrier would be cheaper than doing it in house. The only real added expense is slightly higher wages for the crew.

Other than that, with an RJ partner, the fees an airline pays to the carrier are going to cover the same leases, maintenance, landing fees, handling fees, fuel, training costs, etc. Not to mention, they are also paying for the regional carrier's profit margin.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Just another form of outsourcing my friend

 

[Dizel8]

It may not be cheaper, but it is called leverage.

Lets all go cower in the corner!

 

[rattler]

More so than cost savings on crew pay, outsourcing 190 flying means JB doesn't shut down if their is a job action. Delta learned that lesson with Comair.

 

[relief tube]

Does Jetblue have any SCOPE? .

Does JB have any union?


They already got a regional doing the 190 flying. Have you seen their 190 rates? ouch

 

[coogebeachhotel]

And off-load 1.5 billion in long term debt in the process

 

[J Dawg]

Have you seen their 190 rates? ouch

Yes; about 10% higher than the union pilots at US Airways.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Yes; about 10% higher than the union pilots at US Airways.

Yeah -- I am not sure that's worth bragging about.

 

[Pilotbob3]

They did that already. They lowered first year pay. It's still an upgrade from Cape Air though.

Those that got pay raises did so because JetBlue found a way to finance them and make them cost neutral.

PTS for example. Now I just fly sick rather than lose the premium pay.

Sorry, back to scope.

False, individual contracts with the pay rates prevent them lowering pay. the first year guys on the property were grandfathered in because of the contract. new hires will get the lower rate, but no one has it now.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

False, individual contracts with the pay rates prevent them lowering pay. the first year guys on the property were grandfathered in because of the contract. new hires will get the lower rate, but no one has it now.

Semantics. Whether we have any on property is immaterial. The rate was indeed lowered in the 2008 Amendment to the PEA. Did you ever think that one of the results of the PCRB would be to lower any pay rates?

What's to keep them from lowering it further, like CAL's first year rate for example?

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Yes; about 10% higher than the union pilots at US Airways.

Any thier soft time rules?

 

[Pilotbob3]

Semantics. Whether we have any on property is immaterial. The rate was indeed lowered in the 2008 Amendment to the PEA. Did you ever think that one of the results of the PCRB would be to lower any pay rates?

What's to keep them from lowering it further, like CAL's first year rate for example?

Semantics? its a fact. It is material. Yes, it is the only pay rate that JB can lower, First year not on the property yet new hires. whats to keep them from lowering it like to CAL's first year rate? Why don't you ask ALPA how they got it there.

 

[9rj9]

scope? who cares...every major caved on scope in the last 7 years. Delta keeps moving the line in the sand, first it was 50 seaters, then 70, next is the 100 seater, flown by Comair and the likes.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

scope? who cares...every major caved on scope in the last 7 years. Delta keeps moving the line in the sand, first it was 50 seaters, then 70, next is the 100 seater, flown by Comair and the likes.

Every major?
Continental caved?
SWA caved?

You will care when mighty blue gives those brand new 190's to Expressjet. They can do it tomorrow no questions asked, no bargin, nothing.

 

[bluesideup340]

On Scope Unions make a big to do about and when the time is right the Union leadership negotiates it away.
Unions make promises, talk a big game that plays well in the Crewroom, but at the end these promises are just one negotiation or concession talk away from become meaningless.
Look at the Scope at legacy carriers, their first 5 years of pay, retirements, and merger clauses.

All useless, but at leased you get all of the nothing for the bargain price of 2% of your annual income. Just another reason Pilots should not run airlines.

 

[bluesideup340]

PTS for example. Now I just fly sick rather than lose the premium pay.

quote]

Hello Chef
Now I get it, you need a CBA so you can finally be the professional an make safe decisions. Stating that you rather fly sick, potentially put your life and that of others at risk for money, does not show sound decision making as professional aviator. So let’s hope a Union will fix that for you.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

hey blueside are you Nick?

 

[bluesideup340]

hey blueside are you Nick?

No, I am the German army in front of you.

 

[J Dawg]

Any thier soft time rules?

Like the one that puts everything over 70 credit hours at time and a half?

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Wow the whole german army?

Gar schöne Spiele spiel' ich mit dir