More cuts at USAirways

[WSurf]

"I hope you guys can get your jobs back. But I don't think it will be at the expense of people already hired at Piedmont."
WSurf

Did our leaving benefit the same pilots? Of course it did. Don't act like we are jets-for slobs pilots or something, man! We left prior to the legally binding contract benefit (Flow up/down) had the specifics agreed upon.

Didn't you sign a letter of resignation? Thats the key. Piedmont and US Airways saved tons of cash by you folks leaving for Airways. I highly doubt they wanna bunch of Captains returning making over 10 year pay. I know that seems harsh and I hope you guy/gals can return. Its the reality of situation. I remember the MDA folks not getting there
jobs back either.
Good Luck.
WSurf

I never signed a letter of resignation. I never resigned, in fact. Inerestingly enough, I DID get a letter from PDT stating that they accept my NON-EXISTANT letter of resignation. WTF, huh!

When indoc commenced in PHX, the paper pushers asked for a copy of my letter of resignation. I told them I never sent one, so I cannot produce it. They said that the EAST side wants it, not them, so I can give it to them later. No one else asked, and I sure as hell didn't bring it up.

This is the case for all us as far as I know. So now you are able to give your total support for us to return then, WSurf?

As far as the MDT thing goes, that was an injustice and one borne out of the PDT's frustration with the AAA MEC and their own selfishness. Managment certainly was not going to bat for them when their own USELESS union PDT ALPO wouldn't even do so!

So let me get this straight, you want your old job back at Piedmont? And if you do how does it benefit anyone that is at Piedmont now?

Really, whats in it for us? Remember this is the airline industry and its all about ME.

 

[Tweaker]

So let me get this straight, you want your old job back at Piedmont? And if you do how does it benefit anyone that is at Piedmont now?

Really, whats in it for us? Remember this is the airline industry and its all about ME.

I suspected this was your attitude from your previous posts. It would have saved me some time had you simply been honest about it the first time, instead of pretending otherwise. Your logic has eaten itself, and your true colors have shown through. GO UNION BROTHAHOOD!

Let ME get THIS straight. You want your management to ignore/violate your legally binding labor agreement?
Just this specific item that you don't personally benefit from, or do you want to give them carte blanche?

Do I want my old job back? I want the contract honored. If you read the fleet plan just announced, you will see that the mainline shrinks between 2-5% while the express will GROW from 5-10%. You are a tool if you claim that we would be screwing over an express new hire by flowing down, when we have been working for this corporation since last millenium.

Clearly, you are unable to think past your own dog food bowl, so this is not meant to convince you of anything. Realize though, that we are talking about a total of 15 pilots whom you used to share a cockpit with. This makes your statements all the more pitiful.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

I agree with Tweaker and I no longer work for US Airways OR a subsidiary. It's 15 pilots for crying out loud. Thousands are about to be furloughed industry wide and you have the opportunity to rescue a lousy 15.

Seems like a no-brainer to me.

 

[hoover84]

This has already been tried before when Piedmont pilots went to MidAtlantic (USAir) and were furloughed. ALPA was unsuccessful in getting their jobs back.

 

[WSurf]

I suspected this was your attitude from your previous posts. It would have saved me some time had you simply been honest about it the first time, instead of pretending otherwise. Your logic has eaten itself, and your true colors have shown through. GO UNION BROTHAHOOD!

Let ME get THIS straight. You want your management to ignore/violate your legally binding labor agreement?
Just this specific item that you don't personally benefit from, or do you want to give them carte blanche?

Do I want my old job back? I want the contract honored. If you read the fleet plan just announced, you will see that the mainline shrinks between 2-5% while the express will GROW from 5-10%. You are a tool if you claim that we would be screwing over an express new hire by flowing down, when we have been working for this corporation since last millenium.

Clearly, you are unable to think past your own dog food bowl, so this is not meant to convince you of anything. Realize though, that we are talking about a total of 15 pilots whom you used to share a cockpit with. This makes your statements all the more pitiful.

You knew the risk didn't you? I think you all knew the risk because many of us talked to you and made sure you knew that coming back if furloughed wasn't gonna be an option until certain things were worked out.

I didn't apply because I knew the risk. Do I not want you guys back? Sure I do, but not until our own contractual rights are worked out with a true Flowthru that the mainline pilots and management have put off for many of years. Maybe having you guys over there and furloughed will speed up the process.

So to wrap it up, Yes I want you 15 back. But not unil our own flowthru is worked out. But I do have a problem with you thinking you can just dance your way right back in the Leftseat like nothing ever happened to you. Remember you took the risk of going.

 

[WSurf]

Farrow himself penned a letter that stated the pref-hiring thing was a temporary concept, and that if/when a proper flow was enacted, it would apply to these pref-hire participants.

Tweaker right from your own words. I have no problem with you folks coming back, only unil the proper flow is enacted.

Until then I hope this process can get rolling just a little faster and you folks won't be on the street long(but we all know how long this has already been dragged out).
Even though you might not believe me, I do know most that left for mainline and wish you folks the best. And if all this gets worked out before you get furloughed the better.

 

[NCFlyer]

The current situation is totally different than the original ALG/PDT flow to MDA.

In the original MDA arrangement ALL ALG/PDT pilots were eligible to BID for vacancies. Those vacancies were awarded by seniority. And yes the pilots were to be able to return to their original position if furloughed from MDA. However the language to facilitate their return was never written & PDT's management refuse to even consider their return. And yes unfortunately some in ALPA didn't want to assist their return, while others tried to help any pilot that wanted to return. This has all been argued about for many, many pages in the past.

The current opportunities at USAirways were made available through "preferential hiring", where any pilot desiring a position at USAirways had to apply, be interviewed, then be offered a position. There was no explanation of what "preferential hiring" was nor the mention of any return conduit in a future furlough.

 

[Captzaahlie]

I suspected this was your attitude from your previous posts. It would have saved me some time had you simply been honest about it the first time, instead of pretending otherwise. Your logic has eaten itself, and your true colors have shown through. GO UNION BROTHAHOOD!

Let ME get THIS straight. You want your management to ignore/violate your legally binding labor agreement?
Just this specific item that you don't personally benefit from, or do you want to give them carte blanche?

Do I want my old job back? I want the contract honored. If you read the fleet plan just announced, you will see that the mainline shrinks between 2-5% while the express will GROW from 5-10%. You are a tool if you claim that we would be screwing over an express new hire by flowing down, when we have been working for this corporation since last millenium.

Clearly, you are unable to think past your own dog food bowl, so this is not meant to convince you of anything. Realize though, that we are talking about a total of 15 pilots whom you used to share a cockpit with. This makes your statements all the more pitiful.

IT'S TRUE SURF, NOT "THAT" MANY PEOPLE LEFT PIEDMONT YOU REALLY NEED TO GET A F~ING GRIP MAN..........

 

[WSurf]

IT'S TRUE SURF, NOT "THAT" MANY PEOPLE LEFT PIEDMONT YOU REALLY NEED TO GET A F~ING GRIP MAN..........

Why the hostility towards me? 15 or it could have been 100!! Whats the differnce. I say get the flowthru agreement done and get back over here if you need too!! You guys crack me up!

 

[PCL_128]

You knew the risk didn't you? I think you all knew the risk because many of us talked to you and made sure you knew that coming back if furloughed wasn't gonna be an option until certain things were worked out.

I didn't apply because I knew the risk. Do I not want you guys back? Sure I do, but not until our own contractual rights are worked out with a true Flowthru that the mainline pilots and management have put off for many of years. Maybe having you guys over there and furloughed will speed up the process.

So to wrap it up, Yes I want you 15 back. But not unil our own flowthru is worked out. But I do have a problem with you thinking you can just dance your way right back in the Leftseat like nothing ever happened to you. Remember you took the risk of going.

Joey Merchant's long lost twin, apparently.

 

[WSurf]

Joey Merchant's long lost twin, apparently.

Ahhh, the words of a Gulfstream PFTer! I think I laugh everytime you chime in.

Its not like you did bunches to help the industry.

http://www.gulfstreamacademy.com/First_officer.php

 

[ponder]

Okay, I thought we already hashed this out.

It was the Piedmont Pilots that prevented The
Midatlantic Flow Back, not management.

I'd be real surprised if they made any move to help
the fearless 15 who took the preferential interview
at USairways. But that would be nice if they did.

 

[LowlyPropCapt]

One more pilot's perspective...

I am a Piedmont pilot who interviewed and was 'hired' by USAirways, but have not been offered a class to date.

All along, as many of you who know me are well aware, I had major misgivings about going to mainline because I saw it as a very risky move... Albeit with a potentially great payoff. I never harbored any illusions about the nature of the preferential interview scheme as it existed. I knew when I interviewed beyond a shadow of a doubt that were I to accept employment at USairways, I would not be able to come back to Piedmont in any capacity (definately not with my DOH!). From my conversations with others in the same position, I know that this fact was well known and often discussed. There was, and is, no mystery about the nature of and the implications of being employed by USAirways under this scheme.

For the 3rd time in my 10 year airline career, I am seeing that risk is always the order of the day when it comes to accepting a new job. The Piedmont pilots who accepted positions at USAirways took a risk and should realize every benefit of taking that risk. Similarly, they also need to take responsibility for their own choices and acknowledge the possible downsides of the choices they made. One of those downsides includes possible furlough.

Piedmont pilots who did NOT try for or accept a positon at mainline also took a risk. They rolled the dice that eventually another, better opportunity would eventually come their way. They too should realize both the benefits and the penalties of the decision they made. As I said, the potential result of either decision was well known.

From reading the above posts, I am not sure that anyone currently at USAirways who flew at PDT is saying that they are now entitled for their position back at PDT. If that is the intent, it is dead wrong. There was never any provision for this. While it may seem right and charitable for a psuedo flushback to be enacted, it is woefully unfair to the current Piedmont pilots who rightfully consider their patience in waiting for upgrade/better seniority justly rewarded.

Were I at USAirways, as I very nearly was, I would not consider it my right to return to Piedmont at my original seniority. To me, it would smack of hipocracy and I simply couldn't bring myself to do it lacking a comprehensive flow/flush agreement that would ensure the rights of PDT pilots currently on the property.

 

[WSurf]

One more pilot's perspective...

I am a Piedmont pilot who interviewed and was 'hired' by USAirways, but have not been offered a class to date.

All along, as many of you who know me are well aware, I had major misgivings about going to mainline because I saw it as a very risky move... Albeit with a potentially great payoff. I never harbored any illusions about the nature of the preferential interview scheme as it existed. I knew when I interviewed beyond a shadow of a doubt that were I to accept employment at USairways, I would not be able to come back to Piedmont in any capacity (definately not with my DOH!). From my conversations with others in the same position, I know that this fact was well known and often discussed. There was, and is, no mystery about the nature of and the implications of being employed by USAirways under this scheme.

For the 3rd time in my 10 year airline career, I am seeing that risk is always the order of the day when it comes to accepting a new job. The Piedmont pilots who accepted positions at USAirways took a risk and should realize every benefit of taking that risk. Similarly, they also need to take responsibility for their own choices and acknowledge the possible downsides of the choices they made. One of those downsides includes possible furlough.

Piedmont pilots who did NOT try for or accept a positon at mainline also took a risk. They rolled the dice that eventually another, better opportunity would eventually come their way. They too should realize both the benefits and the penalties of the decision they made. As I said, the potential result of either decision was well known.

From reading the above posts, I am not sure that anyone currently at USAirways who flew at PDT is saying that they are now entitled for their position back at PDT. If that is the intent, it is dead wrong. There was never any provision for this. While it may seem right and charitable for a psuedo flushback to be enacted, it is woefully unfair to the current Piedmont pilots who rightfully consider their patience in waiting for upgrade/better seniority justly rewarded.

Were I at USAirways, as I very nearly was, I would not consider it my right to return to Piedmont at my original seniority. To me, it would smack of hipocracy and I simply couldn't bring myself to do it lacking a comprehensive flow/flush agreement that would ensure the rights of PDT pilots currently on the property.

Well I guess we can just end this thread about the Flowback. Nicely said Prop, that just about sums it all up.
Wait, no it doesn't. So who do we blame? Its not the Piedmont Pilots. Is it our union, or is it mainline and Piedmont Management.

Jeeez, You gotta love this profession we have all chosen!!!!!! Grrrrrrrr

 

[Ocity]

One more pilot's perspective...

I am a Piedmont pilot who interviewed and was 'hired' by USAirways, but have not been offered a class to date.

All along, as many of you who know me are well aware, I had major misgivings about going to mainline because I saw it as a very risky move... Albeit with a potentially great payoff. I never harbored any illusions about the nature of the preferential interview scheme as it existed. I knew when I interviewed beyond a shadow of a doubt that were I to accept employment at USairways, I would not be able to come back to Piedmont in any capacity (definately not with my DOH!). From my conversations with others in the same position, I know that this fact was well known and often discussed. There was, and is, no mystery about the nature of and the implications of being employed by USAirways under this scheme.

For the 3rd time in my 10 year airline career, I am seeing that risk is always the order of the day when it comes to accepting a new job. The Piedmont pilots who accepted positions at USAirways took a risk and should realize every benefit of taking that risk. Similarly, they also need to take responsibility for their own choices and acknowledge the possible downsides of the choices they made. One of those downsides includes possible furlough.

Piedmont pilots who did NOT try for or accept a positon at mainline also took a risk. They rolled the dice that eventually another, better opportunity would eventually come their way. They too should realize both the benefits and the penalties of the decision they made. As I said, the potential result of either decision was well known.

From reading the above posts, I am not sure that anyone currently at USAirways who flew at PDT is saying that they are now entitled for their position back at PDT. If that is the intent, it is dead wrong. There was never any provision for this. While it may seem right and charitable for a psuedo flushback to be enacted, it is woefully unfair to the current Piedmont pilots who rightfully consider their patience in waiting for upgrade/better seniority justly rewarded.

Were I at USAirways, as I very nearly was, I would not consider it my right to return to Piedmont at my original seniority. To me, it would smack of hipocracy and I simply couldn't bring myself to do it lacking a comprehensive flow/flush agreement that would ensure the rights of PDT pilots currently on the property.

What in the world made you believe that there was ever going to be a "potential great payoff????!!"

Everything that name, (us air) has ever touched, has turned into shi*. Which airline have you been watching??