Frontier files chapter 11

[propsarebest]

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/080411/laf017.html?.v=101

 

[WateryGrave]

Not a good day. Good luck guys, I hope it works out.

 

[Guitar Guy]

My thoughts and prayers go out to the Frontier employees and their families. While SM says that they've filed bankruptcy for a different set of reasons than other recent cases, it's not the best news to hear on a Friday morning. I do hope that F9 will weather the storm.

 

[WalterSobchak]

Just want to wish you all good luck over there at F9...

You guys always go out of your way to welcome me on your jumpseats on my rides home and I can't say there's a pilot group I enjoy riding with more (my own pilot group included).

Next time I ride out of DEN, I will be buying a ticket in support.

 

[Shrek]

To all my friends over at F9 my family's prayers are with you today.........

 

[Yuppyguppy]

Sorry to hear that guys...I know what it's like...good luck

 

[SEVEN]

Good Luck to ALL the Frontier guys and gals. Sorry to hear the news.

 

[Princedietrich]

Hang in there, Frontier folks. I'll be raising a cold one in your honor tonight.

 

[Wesb737fo]

TC, LC and Steve C (and all the Frontier folks)

I am hoping the best for you guys ( and pretty much everybody in this industry)......I need a beer

 

[climb2slow]

Thanks for all the kind words. Mood here it obviously somewhat subdued over yesterday. That being said, I don't think anyone is throwing in the towel quite yet. Its still a great place to be employed, and I hope it stays that way. I've been through a 11 before so its not new to me, but at least we can join the club of airlines who have been chapter 11! Thanks again!

 

[f9r]

Appreciate the support. I continue to be amazed at how things work in this business. Despite the optomistic numbers in revenue, cost reductions and bookings looking forward the credit card processor (First Data Corp) decides it's prudent to hold back 100% of the transactions (yes, all of it) starting May 1 based on one analysts opinion. This essentially pulled the cash flow rug right out from under us leaving no other choice.

Those that have and those that will, I never knew what that meant until now.

Thanks again for the support and good luck to all.

 

[another cfii]

So what are the options for F9 now? Find new capital or replace your current CC (Can you even do that?) It's indeed a changed industry when the airlines now are run by a bunch of itchy finger wall-street punks that decides when to bail. To them, all we are just "expendable investment"...

 

[IronCityBlue]

Exactly. Being a public company today is like making a deal with the devil. Who will always come to collect. You are at the mercy of day trading blood suckers who contribute nothing of value to humanity (other than their winnings from legalized gambeling) and millions of computers are pre-set to buy and sell like reactionary robots. Analcysts oftentimes wield more influence than company founders and the entire structure is set up so that execs come first, shareholders second, and labor is purely a liability.

That philsophy may help to make the next quarterly numbers (to stay on the good side of the pre set computer trader trip points) but long term it ruins many companies. The entire system is flawed. You can be running a great company, and make 10 million in profits, but if you initially predicted you would make 11 million in profits, your stock tanks. If your company is growing, but your rate of growth is less than it was last year, your stock can sometimes tank.

We need a comprehensive reform on the trading market, including more transparancy for investors, more shareholder equity (true DIP) during bankruptcy, and less reward for pure, sometimes by the minute speculation.

 

[starchkr]

Thanks everyone for the support...we will survive!!!

Tell you what though, waiting at the gate on thursday night to do the red-eye to FLL and pulling the company email release off the printer fresh from the GO before it went public was quite the humbling experience. Made a pretty upbeat and energetic trip turn somber really quick!

 

[yaks]

"So what are the options for F9 now?"
Ch. 11. The bankruptcy judge can impose status quo on the vendors (first data) thus fixing the problem.

 

[starchkr]

yaks, i'm absolutely no expert or even a novice on this one, but i believe that is what he can do. Keep everything the way it was before the BK was filed.

 

[jmreii]

Exactly. Being a public company today is like making a deal with the devil. Who will always come to collect. You are at the mercy of day trading blood suckers who contribute nothing of value to humanity (other than their winnings from legalized gambeling) and millions of computers are pre-set to buy and sell like reactionary robots. Analcysts oftentimes wield more influence than company founders and the entire structure is set up so that execs come first, shareholders second, and labor is purely a liability.

That philsophy may help to make the next quarterly numbers (to stay on the good side of the pre set computer trader trip points) but long term it ruins many companies. The entire system is flawed. You can be running a great company, and make 10 million in profits, but if you initially predicted you would make 11 million in profits, your stock tanks. If your company is growing, but your rate of growth is less than it was last year, your stock can sometimes tank.

We need a comprehensive reform on the trading market, including more transparancy for investors, more shareholder equity (true DIP) during bankruptcy, and less reward for pure, sometimes by the minute speculation.

All of us are investors(stakeholders) one way or another; I absolutely have no problem with someone or a investor flushing their money down the the toilet as long as it's not my money. Bank of America will be nice about collecting their money, I would not. I got my mind on my money and money on my mind.

 

[FBN0223]

yaks, i'm absolutely no expert or even a novice on this one, but i believe that is what he can do. Keep everything the way it was before the BK was filed.

I am no expert either but even with a great product and excellent employees some modifications to the Frontier's business plan must be in order.

 

[IronCityBlue]

All of us are investors(stakeholders) one way or another; I absolutely have no problem with someone or a investor flushing their money down the the toilet as long as it's not my money. Bank of America will be nice about collecting their money, I would not. I got my mind on my money and money on my mind.

I agree that whoever is owed money will come to collect, that wasn't my point. I was just pointing out that the current state of being a public company is almost always a trap. Get money now, great! But then a whole lot of people who could care less about your company then own you. And all they care about is selling what they own to someone else, who only wants blood money by any means necessary. Couple that with an overall investment mindset that mandates growth or death, and when you realize that no business can grow indefinitely, and many times the best that can be done is to delay the inevitable.

I am an advocate for increased shareholder rights, especially in bankruptcy. But our overall trading infrastructure needs to be changed to cut out the day trading scum bags with their little preset computers who contribute nothing to society and only suck the blood out of viable companies by forcing them to follow analcysts and chase quarterly numbers. Unless of course the perpetual cycle of liquidation, start up, liquidation is in some way beneficial for our country.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Too bad F9 isn't ALPA. If anyone has BK experience its ALPA!

 

[FBN0223]

Too bad F9 isn't ALPA. If anyone has BK experience its ALPA!

No kidding!!! After NWA, DAL, UAL and a few others in last couple of years maybe they've finally figured out how it all works. F9 union guys and gals might want to make a few calls to those who have recently been down that road. In our case at NWA, you'd find out everything not to do.

 

[captain dad]

I am all for unions but not ALPA. In my experience with ALPA (10 years) and knowing their past history, ALPA is good at one thing; takin care of ALPA. My dues got me two large pizzas, a six pack, and two concessionary contracts. Thanks Worthless.

Airlines need a national seniority list. Won't happen but that's what they need.

Just my opinion, I could be right.

Good Luck.

 

[Jet41]

I am all for unions but not ALPA. In my experience with ALPA (10 years) and knowing their past history, ALPA is good at one thing; takin care of ALPA. My dues got me two large pizzas, a six pack, and two concessionary contracts. Thanks Worthless.

Airlines need a national seniority list. Won't happen but that's what they need.

Just my opinion, I could be right.

Good Luck.

Well said

 

[Larcifer]

I am an advocate for increased shareholder rights, especially in bankruptcy. But our overall trading infrastructure needs to be changed to cut out the day trading scum bags with their little preset computers who contribute nothing to society and only suck the blood out of viable companies by forcing them to follow analcysts and chase quarterly numbers. Unless of course the perpetual cycle of liquidation, start up, liquidation is in some way beneficial for our country.

You should join us scumbags it beats relying on this sh**y industry to raise a family. You'd be surprised at how much I contribute to society and those that cannot support themselves.

 

[WSurf]

I am all for unions but not ALPA. In my experience with ALPA (10 years) and knowing their past history, ALPA is good at one thing; takin care of ALPA. My dues got me two large pizzas, a six pack, and two concessionary contracts. Thanks Worthless.

Airlines need a national seniority list. Won't happen but that's what they need.

Just my opinion, I could be right.

Good Luck.

Don't forget about your magazine now!

 

[IronCityBlue]

You should join us scumbags it beats relying on this sh**y industry to raise a family. You'd be surprised at how much I contribute to society and those that cannot support themselves.

Unethical airline CEO's and oil future speculators also, as individuals with their paychecks, contribute to society. But to be in that position in the first place requires a whole lot of pain for a whole lot of other people. Drug dealers buy goods and services with their "earnings" too. Look, congrats on being good ad manipulating the system. I just think the system should be changed to restore integrity to our investment infrastructure rather than hyperspeculative cyber gambeling which is basically what it is today. I would rather see that change come about rationally and in a controlled manner, but quickly and unilateraly with a rapid onset depression will also work I guess. Of course, maybe helicopter Bernake can bail us out with more phony money, and besides, we can always borrow more from China to pay our boiler room oil futures driven energy cost hyper inflation. Oh yeah, that's right, its all India and China. India and China, just keep telling ourselves that.

 

[Cardinal]

Not exactly shocking, but NASDAQ has said "BuhBye."
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/080415/latu096.html?.v=101DENVER,

Frontier Receives Notice of Delisting
April 15 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- On April 11, 2008, Frontier received a Staff Determination Letter from The Nasdaq Stock Market ("Nasdaq") indicating that, as a result of the Company's filing for protection under Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code, Nasdaq has determined that the Company's securities will be delisted from Nasdaq in accordance with the discretionary authority granted to Nasdaq under Marketplace Rules 4300, 4450(f) and IM-4300.

Company does not intend to appeal this determination, and, as a result, trading of the Company's common stock will be suspended at the opening of business on April 22, 2008, and a Form 25-NSE will be filed with the Securities Exchange Commission to remove the Company's securities from listing and registration on Nasdaq.

 

[StaySeated]

This will end the day-trading pot of gold, but it was fun while it lasted. Average volume before bk, around 680,000. After the plunge it was trading at over 25 million shares a day and monday saw a 99% rise in value from .48 to almost $1. Sweet. Helped fund my impending unemployment account.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I am all for unions but not ALPA. In my experience with ALPA (10 years) and knowing their past history, ALPA is good at one thing; takin care of ALPA. My dues got me two large pizzas, a six pack, and two concessionary contracts. Thanks Worthless.

You to! Wow... I just don't blame DW. My negotiating committee and MEC implemented my concessionary LOA's.

Airlines need a national seniority list. Won't happen but that's what they need.

We've been debating a National Seniorty List on other threads... it just doesn't seem workable.

Let me guess... F9 pilots who are not part of ALPA would be on a NSL and they would now get jobs at the New Delta? With Seniority? At UAL or CAL? With seniority?

But you hate ALPA, the most expensive magazine in the world, so lets say the NSL isn't ALPA controlled or managed. Who would manage it? The ATA? Frontier isn't even a member! Zero CapHill presence.

The gov't? FAPA isn't a member of CAPA and has zero CapHill presence.

Just my opinion, I could be right.

but you're not.

Good Luck.

Good luck is right. Hopefully FAPA can get on the Creditors Committe.

Best of luck to all F9 pilots... I hope you land on your feet.

 

[StaySeated]

Hopefully FAPA can get on the debtors committee.

Best of luck to all F9 pilots... I hope you land on your feet.

I believe you meant Creditors Committe and yes, FAPA is a member.