US Airways Jul 16 recall class

[abefly]

BTW there's a new APL at the ALPA site today.

Hey Swaayze...do you know how many recalls there have been since the merger? Or on this new apl how many people are below dave odell? We on the west have no idea how many have come back.

 

[LittleDeuce]

Recalls

ALL the pilots on the APL are junior to save Dave if the award stands

 

[abefly]

ALL the pilots on the APL are junior to save Dave if the award stands

I know that...but how many furloughed pilots as of the merger date are back on property?

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Last I heard was that only 300 of the total 1800 have accepted recall.

 

[Swaayze]

That's about right, I think low 300's have accepted recall. It's often tagged at the end of the East ALPA hotline if you can stand to listen.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Please help me I got my final recall letter. I am under such major duress. What should I do?

Ok I will stay on the west thank you.

Aw.hell. That means we're stuck with you...



PHXFLYR

 

[PHXFLYR]

Not me. The east is poison for me because I was at AWA during the merger. I'll stay out west thanks.

But, a newhire might do ok out there because he or she didn't receive any "windfall."

Plan on staying out west...and I live back east!! Jumpseating on those guys once a week is about all I can stomach. Couldn't picture having to work with them.

PHXFLYR

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Aw.hell. That means we're stuck with you...



PHXFLYR

Yep Sunshine your stuck with me.:nuts:

 

[flynAAvy]

Fellow Professional Pilots,

I didn't have time to read the entire thread so I apologize for rehashing what probably occured upstream.

First, I am a west metal Bus FO and will gain absolutely nothing in seniority if this thing goes through. Nor do I expect to. Except a little more than a $2/hr pay raise!

Secondly, I am furloughed AA (not TWA) and those two pilot groups finally grew up, acted professionally and get along just fine now, for the most part. Once the east/west start flying together, we'll realize that we're all just here to make a buck and that we're lucky to have a job. AA is a class act in my opionion and I'd probably go back if I ever get the call, but I love our stupid airline. We have good folks working for us, both east and west (ok... maybe not the Philly rampers). I think we can pull this off. I commute and sit the jump seat on east metal every week. The guys are great. Nobody has ever been rude and we talk about the airline, chicks, movies, whatever. Behind the door, we're just all normal dudes, in my humble opinion.

Chug-a-lug Doug and his cronies are just trying to wheel and deal their way to their fortunes. They have no idea how to run an airline. Jeff was the brains behind the whole operation and, unfortunately, passed away from cancer last year. (He was a Navy pilot, by the way).

Lastly, and this is huge. For those of you who are thinking of returning to US... I flew Kirby a couple of weeks ago (his wife got wasted in first class). He's my age and a multi-millionaire, so apparentely I am an idiot, and he is not. Anyway... straight from the horse's mouth... He thinks our airline will be called another name by the end of the year. U all can think about that all U want but it sort of makes me rethink my professional future. Just my .02.

Good luck - fly safe.

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

I have heard the same thing about the name change from lower levels of course, but same thing being said.

 

[steveg]

When Sausage starts to prognosticate I have to chime in. You ARE an idiot, and all TWA pilots hate all AA pilots forever and ever (you really aren't considered a pilot). I have absolute proof that you are going to bid PHL 330 Captain next week and take over the East operation. In fact I think I saw you working the ramp in PHL last week.



PS. Ran into Carb Heat tonight, he was a blathering idiot. Went on about missing DS so much and crying and all, said he was going to look for (stalk?) him in Hawaii. I guess the old Pres. only talks to DC now, I'm hurt.

 

[johnnyb]

straight from the horse's mouth... He thinks our airline will be called another name by the end of the year.

So ... he risks jail by giving out insider info to complete strangers?

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Swaayze? What did you decide?

 

[Swaayze]

Still deciding, check PMs.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Hey FlynAAvy,

Jeff wasn't a Navy pilot.He was a P3 weenie. My Navy friends tell me they don't count!! Seriously,though. He was one great Operations guy and is sorely missed by this line pilot. A big loss.


PHXFLYR

 

[FurloughedAgain]

I received an email this morning from a friend who is struggling with the decision whether or not to accept recall. After 5 years, very few of us have landed at places where the decision is crystal clear.

Those who ended up at FedEx, UPS, Southwest, Alaska, NetJets... their decision is easy. So many more found themselves at Jetblue, AirTran, Frontier... flying as Expats overseas... flying 17 day trips at Kalitta... stepping 10 years back in their careers and flying as regional First Officers...flying corporate or charter... -- our decisions are not as clear.

Well, I haven't gotten the letter yet but I have gotten several phonecalls this week from friends who have. We are all struggling with this decision.

I still have my newhire class photo on my desk from Jan 99. It seems as though it was yesterday. I really felt as though I had won the lottery -- earned the brass ring.

The other day I picked up a Lear from maintenance and looked at it long and hard. I wondered whether I could fly this airplane for the remainder of my career. Would I feel like a failure if I retired from a 17,000 pound airplane? Would I even still be able to climb INTO it's tiny cockpit when age begins to steal the required acrobatics required to maneuver into the tiny cockpit?

My wife asked what I would do if we didn't have kids -- that's a no-brainer. I'd go back in a flash if I was single with no kids. But that's not the hand I was dealt, so I can't think like a single man. At least here I'm home most nights. I should be around for little league games, school plays, first steps, etc.

I'm 85% sure that i'm staying here. But i'm heartbroken at the prospect. That resignation will be the hardest thing I write, and I imagine it'll take a whole bottle of Jack Daniels to get me through it.

I realize that for the America West pilots, this thread means nothing. They were thrust into an airline they never wanted to work for. For many of us (ok, those of us who grew up in Pennsylvania anyway), US Airways was the realization of a lifelong dream. Giving it up voluntarily isn't easy -- even if it is so clearly the right thing to do.

FurloughedAgain

 

[flynAAvy]

I actually thought he had an F-14 background, but I could be wrong. I know he got his MBA from Harvard or someplace like that. Smart guy. You're right... he's sorely missed.

On further note, we just posted a $263 million profit so I guess we'll get an extra cookie in our crew meal or something. The 49 announced captain seats on the vacancy bid will help too. Maybe this place isn't too bad.

SteveG, how is the sex-change hormone treatment going? We're all praying for ya... We need to go to the Library soon btw. I seriously need a pitcher of Dos Equis right now. It's been a while. We need to have DS pay though. I hear those widebody Hawiian dudes make serious dinero. DS are you out there...?

Sausage

 

[MCDU]

!00 % Mike W. is going back. Otherwise he would not post all this.

Marty

 

[LittleDeuce]

Going back

!00 % Mike W. is going back. Otherwise he would not post all this.

Marty

I agree completly. He will come back because his heart is here.

Despite our issues right now, I am glad I'm back.

I just wish he was not senior to me!

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Wish I was as confident in my decisions as you guys appear to be.

 

[PHXFLYR]

I received an email this morning from a friend who is struggling with the decision whether or not to accept recall. After 5 years, very few of us have landed at places where the decision is crystal clear.

Those who ended up at FedEx, UPS, Southwest, Alaska, NetJets... their decision is easy. So many more found themselves at Jetblue, AirTran, Frontier... flying as Expats overseas... flying 17 day trips at Kalitta... stepping 10 years back in their careers and flying as regional First Officers...flying corporate or charter... -- our decisions are not as clear.

Well, I haven't gotten the letter yet but I have gotten several phonecalls this week from friends who have. We are all struggling with this decision.

I still have my newhire class photo on my desk from Jan 99. It seems as though it was yesterday. I really felt as though I had won the lottery -- earned the brass ring.

The other day I picked up a Lear from maintenance and looked at it long and hard. I wondered whether I could fly this airplane for the remainder of my career. Would I feel like a failure if I retired from a 17,000 pound airplane? Would I even still be able to climb INTO it's tiny cockpit when age begins to steal the required acrobatics required to maneuver into the tiny cockpit?

My wife asked what I would do if we didn't have kids -- that's a no-brainer. I'd go back in a flash if I was single with no kids. But that's not the hand I was dealt, so I can't think like a single man. At least here I'm home most nights. I should be around for little league games, school plays, first steps, etc.

I'm 85% sure that i'm staying here. But i'm heartbroken at the prospect. That resignation will be the hardest thing I write, and I imagine it'll take a whole bottle of Jack Daniels to get me through it.

I realize that for the America West pilots, this thread means nothing. They were thrust into an airline they never wanted to work for. For many of us (ok, those of us who grew up in Pennsylvania anyway), US Airways was the realization of a lifelong dream. Giving it up voluntarily isn't easy -- even if it is so clearly the right thing to do.

FurloughedAgain

I am really having a hard time figuring out how you think retiring from a career flying a 17,000 lb Lear around for a living can be construed as a failure. If you could support your family comfortably doing something you truly enjoy doing (ie flying an airplane...and not neccasarily for an airline) and have their love and support in your endeavors what more do you need? And for that matter,what difference does it make where or what you fly. I guess being from PA there's a little bit of the flying for the "hometown team" allure to your decision,but to go as far to say that you wonder if you would consider yourself a failure if Lear flying was the extent of your career?? No way. Not if your wife and kids support you. Anyway..'nuff from me. Good luck with your decision



PHXFLYR

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Clearly you're correct. Just need to figure out how to say goodbye to that childhood dream.

And then figure out what to do with all of the free time formerly spent reading all of these message boards!

Thanks

 

[B-atch]

Clearly you're correct. Just need to figure out how to say goodbye to that childhood dream.

And then figure out what to do with all of the free time formerly spent reading all of these message boards!

Thanks

I feel your struggle brother. I too have had long sleepless nights weighing my options. I will tell you this. It is apparent from your previous posts, that US Airways is were you want to be. All I can say, and take this as advise from a total stranger, is go back and chase your dream. If Airways fails you once again, then you will know that the dream was unreachable, and you will be able to put it to rest. I suspect that if you remain in your current employment, and Airways evolves in a positive way, you will always second guess yourself for choosing poorly.

Go back!! A major job is a major job!! If Airways folds, you could always find a Lear job again..
Life goes around ONLY once. Live it!

This is advice from someone with two kids, and JUNIOR to you!!!!

 

[Green]

I received an email this morning from a friend who is struggling with the decision whether or not to accept recall. After 5 years, very few of us have landed at places where the decision is crystal clear.

Those who ended up at FedEx, UPS, Southwest, Alaska, NetJets... their decision is easy. So many more found themselves at Jetblue, AirTran, Frontier... flying as Expats overseas... flying 17 day trips at Kalitta... stepping 10 years back in their careers and flying as regional First Officers...flying corporate or charter... -- our decisions are not as clear.

Well, I haven't gotten the letter yet but I have gotten several phonecalls this week from friends who have. We are all struggling with this decision.

I still have my newhire class photo on my desk from Jan 99. It seems as though it was yesterday. I really felt as though I had won the lottery -- earned the brass ring.

The other day I picked up a Lear from maintenance and looked at it long and hard. I wondered whether I could fly this airplane for the remainder of my career. Would I feel like a failure if I retired from a 17,000 pound airplane? Would I even still be able to climb INTO it's tiny cockpit when age begins to steal the required acrobatics required to maneuver into the tiny cockpit?

My wife asked what I would do if we didn't have kids -- that's a no-brainer. I'd go back in a flash if I was single with no kids. But that's not the hand I was dealt, so I can't think like a single man. At least here I'm home most nights. I should be around for little league games, school plays, first steps, etc.

I'm 85% sure that i'm staying here. But i'm heartbroken at the prospect. That resignation will be the hardest thing I write, and I imagine it'll take a whole bottle of Jack Daniels to get me through it.

I realize that for the America West pilots, this thread means nothing. They were thrust into an airline they never wanted to work for. For many of us (ok, those of us who grew up in Pennsylvania anyway), US Airways was the realization of a lifelong dream. Giving it up voluntarily isn't easy -- even if it is so clearly the right thing to do.

FurloughedAgain

why not take the recall and just bid quality of life for the rest of your career? I'm not sure what you're making now but assuming a new contract is somewhere on the horizon you should be able to make 80k or so on a low credit line. Or you could go the long call route and sit at home making guarantee.

Take it....There will always be corporate jobs looking for an airline pilot. Assuming Jack Stephen and gang don't destroy the airline from within there could be a bright future on the horizon. The widebody fleet is gowing to grow from 19 to 40 plus aircraft and they will be fenced out from us west for some time so you should have some opportunity there. In the next five years you should be flying under a decent contract with a wide array of flying to choos from including China, Hawaii, Domestic, Latin America, Carribean, Europe, and India.

But the big what if is another merger....If your corporate job is a great gig then pass on the recall but if it's just so so i say take it...

 

[PlaneDrvr]

why not take the recall and just bid quality of life for the rest of your career? I'm not sure what you're making now but assuming a new contract is somewhere on the horizon you should be able to make 80k or so on a low credit line. Or you could go the long call route and sit at home making guarantee.

Take it....There will always be corporate jobs looking for an airline pilot. Assuming Jack Stephen and gang don't destroy the airline from within there could be a bright future on the horizon. The widebody fleet is gowing to grow from 19 to 40 plus aircraft and they will be fenced out from us west for some time so you should have some opportunity there. In the next five years you should be flying under a decent contract with a wide array of flying to choos from including China, Hawaii, Domestic, Latin America, Carribean, Europe, and India.

But the big what if is another merger....If your corporate job is a great gig then pass on the recall but if it's just so so i say take it...

Well, just a thought, as I don't work there, but have several friends that do; If you really think that there is a "new contract on the horizon," you need to take a good look at the 'reality.' That 'new contract' is wayyyyyyy over the 'horizon.' From what I have heard from all of the people that I have talk to at US Air (east), there are just NOT the votes there for any new contract, if it means losing seniority with the new list.

Again, just a thought and based on my communications and observations; as anyone looking at coming back should take a 'realistic' view of the situation.

For what its worth.

DA

 

[Cheeta]

I feel your struggle brother. I too have had long sleepless nights weighing my options. I will tell you this. It is apparent from your previous posts, that US Airways is were you want to be. All I can say, and take this as advise from a total stranger, is go back and chase your dream. If Airways fails you once again, then you will know that the dream was unreachable, and you will be able to put it to rest. I suspect that if you remain in your current employment, and Airways evolves in a positive way, you will always second guess yourself for choosing poorly.

Go back!! A major job is a major job!! If Airways folds, you could always find a Lear job again..
Life goes around ONLY once. Live it!

This is advice from someone with two kids, and JUNIOR to you!!!!

Well there is no doubt that your a real man by putting your wife and kids first....so that makes you a succsess above all.

I agree with B-atch..go with your dream. sound to me like you will make it work for your family no matter what.

my 2 cents...good luck!

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Come back. It's acrimonious true, but I bet things'll get better.

 

[Green]

Well, just a thought, as I don't work there, but have several friends that do; If you really think that there is a "new contract on the horizon," you need to take a good look at the 'reality.' That 'new contract' is wayyyyyyy over the 'horizon.' From what I have heard from all of the people that I have talk to at US Air (east), there are just NOT the votes there for any new contract, if it means losing seniority with the new list.

Again, just a thought and based on my communications and observations; as anyone looking at coming back should take a 'realistic' view of the situation.

For what its worth.

DA

PlaneDvr.....

Lets talk 'realistic.' NEVER in the history of Alpa has a binding arbitration been overthrown with regards to seniority. Now I do agree that Us Airways has thrown a tempertantrum of an unprecendented scale BUT eventually they will get tired of rolling around on the floor screaming and they WILL realize that the only ones being hurt in the process are themselves!!!!! The east feels victimized and that they have somehow been screwed in the process. The fact is they got a much better deal than most.

Parker is making money hand over fist. The company is making money hand over fist. Investors have and stand to make a ton of money. AWA pilots are making 15% or so more than Airways pilots. SO the only real losers if a new contract is not realized are the Us Airways pilots. Those ARE the facts.

If AAA wants to cut off its nose to spite its face that is their perogative. But I do not think that the majority of individuals smart enough to operate multi million dollar aircraft are going to willingly cost themselves 40k+ per year, vacation, work rules, and scheduling improvements during the sunset of their careers.

So I think it's a safe bet to say that somebody accepting recall is likely to see growth and a new contract over the next 5 years. The contract might not come till 2008 or even 2009 but eventually the pipe dream will wear off and AAA pilots will come to the table. Parker will not give them a contract out of joint negotiations...

 

[Heavy Set]

Clearly you're correct. Just need to figure out how to say goodbye to that childhood dream.

And then figure out what to do with all of the free time formerly spent reading all of these message boards!

Thanks

Go back to USAir. You can go back to any Lear if it falls through again. That nagging feeling in your head will continue with you forever unless you give it a try again. You can always find a Learjet operator. And, if you move your family to a base you will see them more than if you commute. USAir is profitable and not going to tank anytime soon. I am flying a Lear because I am too old to get hired at a legacy (upper 40s) and have any chance to upgrade on something big. I flew the 747 for Tower Air and loved it, and still miss it, but Tower went away. Starting at Kalitta could be an option for me, but 17 days in a row on the road on reserve may be tough for me and the family now. If you are young enough and could make a career out of it, I would say go back.

 

[PositiveRate]

FurloughedAgain,

Take it for what it's worth, but it sounds like your trying to rationalize why not to go back when what you truly want is to work for this company again.

You only live once. If you have the support of your wife, I would seriously consider returning. Despite all of the labor strife, the company is much stronger now then when you were furloughed. Also, as pointed out by others, the lear jobs will always be there. The major job is a bit more elusive.

Good luck with your decision.