Alpa Executive Council Says No To AAA's Request To Vacate Arbitration Award.

[AutoBus]

Both, actually. I believe that Nicolau didn't adhere to ALPA merger policy and handed the West a major windfall by not including sufficient fences in the award. I also believe that the EC should have recognized this and determined that the award was invalid due to the arbitrator not adhering to the required provisions of the policy. Of course, this is all a matter of opinion and interpretation, so I can understand the EC coming to a different conclusion. It's certainly not an easy situation.

So in your little dream world how would you combine the lists? (this should be interesting)

 

[regionaltard]

Therein lies your problem!! Now from current rep to former rep, have you even bothered to read the ENTIRE award?? All of the protection were contained within the award itself. You seem to be one of those who fails to understand the real difference between longevity and seniority further as a former rep you should also know merger policy and that in 1991 Date of hire was removed!! Further, you should know and fully understand all of the dynamics of this unique case and why the ruling came down as it did.

Now how can the UAL, NWA and the DAL merger committees all state that given all of the information they conclude that the award is fair yet you as a former rep never having even read the entire award feel justified in your assessment that it violates section 45???

WD`

What Whiskey said. Anyone who believes that the award should have contained fences that the East didn't argue for needs to famliarize himself with How Arbitration Works by Elkouri & Elkouri. Someone who fancies himself as a union leader needs to know this stuff. Mitigating the damage the East did to themselves was not the neutral's role. By stubbornly clinging to their DOH pipe dream (even after they were cautioned that it would not fly) AAA essentially turned this into a baseball-style arbitration, and they lost. They almost certainly could have emerged from this with a better deal but it would have had to have been something they strategized for and articulated, not a consolation prize for trying to hit it out of the park and striking out instead.

 

[Tomct]

Just a quick question. What if AWA waited for another 3-6 months and just picked apart the remainder of what would have been left AFTER CHAPTER 7. (Liquidation) The east guys should THANK their lucky stars that they were purchased and NOT on the street! Sorry, but you are WASTING your time with this Bull SH!T!! Start focusing on getting something that WILL happen....like maybe a BETTER CONTRACT!!

 

[Turtle21]

Just a quick question. What if AWA waited for another 3-6 months and just picked apart the remainder of what would have been left AFTER CHAPTER 7. (Liquidation) The east guys should THANK their lucky stars that they were purchased and NOT on the street! Sorry, but you are WASTING your time with this Bull SH!T!! Start focusing on getting something that WILL happen....like maybe a BETTER CONTRACT!!

Now there is a pipe dream.

 

[Wiskey Driver]

Just a quick question. What if AWA waited for another 3-6 months and just picked apart the remainder of what would have been left AFTER CHAPTER 7. (Liquidation) The east guys should THANK their lucky stars that they were purchased and NOT on the street! Sorry, but you are WASTING your time with this Bull SH!T!! Start focusing on getting something that WILL happen....like maybe a BETTER CONTRACT!!

Tomct,

Many have asked that question over the last two years. The deal with that is two fold while the labor groups would have been a little better off allowing all to be pink slipped and then offer immediate employment. The pain would arise from having allowed the certificate to go away in a ch 7 and then apply for routes under the AWA certificate. The second pain would be the thought of other carriers attempting to pick away at the carcus like buzzards on a kill.

Now what I can tell you is that something is in the pot now. Parker and Kirby have been spending a great deal of time in Chicago. This saga is far from over and we may see the biggest blow to the east side yet with a UAL combination. I can see several parts of both sides go away to make an even leaner stronger International carrier. Copy this post and show it again after the first of the year.

WD.

 

[PlaneDrvr]

Just a quick question. What if AWA waited for another 3-6 months and just picked apart the remainder of what would have been left AFTER CHAPTER 7. (Liquidation) The east guys should THANK their lucky stars that they were purchased and NOT on the street! Sorry, but you are WASTING your time with this Bull SH!T!! Start focusing on getting something that WILL happen....like maybe a BETTER CONTRACT!!

Again, Don't have a dog in this fight; but, take my word for it, the original US Airways was NOT going to "liquidate, Go Out of Business" how ever you wish to put it. I have done consulting work for years, and did in fact work for a company at the time that did work for US Air, during the merger in question; and for obvious reasons I cannot devulge 'specific details' but wasn't going to happen.

But, the 'ignorant and un-informed' always 'believe' what they want. Think about it, if it was 'believed that US Air was Never going to survive' what benefit was there to the company (US Air and AWA both), in having people talk of that??? 10 point to the one smart enough to come up with the right answer!!!

Anyway, Not sure why people are spending so much time arguing about a 'list' that doesn't really mean anything?? Without a 'combined contract' the list is totally meaningless, and the way that I see it, there was 'very little chance' of getting a Serious (real money and bennies) contract before the list $hit came about; and now there is pretty much "Zero" chance now.

Just my $0.02 for what's it worth, now 'rant away'

DA

P.S. That whole 'de-certify alpa' thing is probably a good thing, as alpo hasn't represented the interests of its members for a long time, and either needs a "Big Wake-up Call" or to just DIE.

 

[Wiskey Driver]

Again, Don't have a dog in this fight; but, take my word for it, the original US Airways was NOT going to "liquidate, Go Out of Business" how ever you wish to put it. I have done consulting work for years, and did in fact work for a company at the time that did work for US Air, during the merger in question; and for obvious reasons I cannot devulge 'specific details' but wasn't going to happen.

But, the 'ignorant and un-informed' always 'believe' what they want. Think about it, if it was 'believed that US Air was Never going to survive' what benefit was there to the company (US Air and AWA both), in having people talk of that??? 10 point to the one smart enough to come up with the right answer!!!

Anyway, Not sure why people are spending so much time arguing about a 'list' that doesn't really mean anything?? Without a 'combined contract' the list is totally meaningless, and the way that I see it, there was 'very little chance' of getting a Serious (real money and bennies) contract before the list $hit came about; and now there is pretty much "Zero" chance now.

Just my $0.02 for what's it worth, now 'rant away'

DA

P.S. That whole 'de-certify alpa' thing is probably a good thing, as alpo hasn't represented the interests of its members for a long time, and either needs a "Big Wake-up Call" or to just DIE.

So basically what you are saying is that those SEC filings were false and that really AAA had more than enough capital to not only emerge for BK but sustain as well?? Man I guess any day now the exchange commission will announce the fraud and people will be indicted soon huh??

Wake up man they were dead and the casket was headed to the ground!!

WD.

 

[Contract]

what was the name of the company you did consulting work for Planedrvr? Certainly that would not be confidential information....LOL

 

[JT8D]

Tomct,



Now what I can tell you is that something is in the pot now. Parker and Kirby have been spending a great deal of time in Chicago.

WD.

The last time "something was in the pot" Parker got his ass handed to him on Capital Hill and then went ripping around Scottsdale drunk in his Beamer... followed by being sentenced to do time at a jail for women.

I don't think "something in the pot" over there is necessarily a good thing.

 

[xanderman]

Something in the pot!?!? Yeah! It's called a turd...

 

[FDJ2]

Parker and Kirby have been spending a great deal of time in Chicago. This saga is far from over and we may see the biggest blow to the east side yet with a UAL combination. I can see several parts of both sides go away to make an even leaner stronger International carrier. Copy this post and show it again after the first of the year.

WD.

Won't happen. I'm not saying Parker and others may not be drooling at the possibility and might even make a formal proposal, but it aint in the cards, at least not in the near term.

 

[Turtle21]

.. Think about it, if it was 'believed that US Air was Never going to survive' what benefit was there to the company (US Air and AWA both), in having people talk of that??? 10 point to the one smart enough to come up with the right answer!!

Uh, the price would be below actual value? Of course it wasn't going Ch7.

In fact, I think another trip through bankruptcy would be good before the next merger.

 

[Wiskey Driver]

Won't happen. I'm not saying Parker and others may not be drooling at the possibility and might even make a formal proposal, but it aint in the cards, at least not in the near term.

I'm not so sure this time. I never thought you guys were a good fit as the route structure just didn't make sense. I am still tired form this one and I feel it that it's about to happen all over again...

WD.

 

[FDJ2]

I'm not so sure this time. WD.

The issue is that neither carrier is a failing carrier facing possible liquidation without the merger. There is no mood on Capitol Hill to allow large network carriers to merge unless one is facing imminent liquidation without the merger. It goes beyond whether they would be a good fit or not. While some may wrongly question the power of Congress in mergers, let me assure you it far exceeds that of the DOJ, DOT and Wallstreet. As one Senator put it during the LCC attempted hostile takeover of DAL, "Wallstreet doesn't make public policy," and neither does the DOT or DOJ I might add. Believe me when I tell you, if Congress is opposed to the merger it wont happen.

Some of the issues in such a merger are, the follow on mergers of other network carriers it would spark, service overlap, reduce service due to "synergies", job loss, and in LCC's case, the inability to successfully execute their current merger.

JMHO, but the more likely scenario is a code share agreement with UAL similar to that achieved by DAL,CAL and NWA.

Of course I've been wrong before, just ask my wife.
I'll leave you with the last word on the matter.

 

[AA717driver]

FDJ--Wall Street IS what makes public policy--if it's in their interest.

Every 'Congresswhore' is owned by someone. Generally, it's by a company or companies that are in the F500.

Take a look at where your Representative and Senator's spouses work. Who's BOD are they on? What group do they lobby for?

If anyone here STILL believes the legislative process is even the slightest bit uncorrupted, you're either ignorant or delusional. Just look at the net worth of those in Congress. They didn't start with that kind of money and they shure as he!! didn't get there by saving their pay. TC