Will Terrorists Strike Aviation Again?

[oldxfr8dog]

I think it will happen again, but now we know what to do. Dont open the cockpit door. Do whatever it takes even if they kill everyone on board, but dont open the door and land the plane, and let the police do there job. I think the worst thing that congress ever did was to allow pilots to carry guns. You guys now have a steel reinforced door that cant be opened except from the inside only so why do you need a gun. I like guns and have a few myself but I am not going to go looking for a gun fight. If a terriost is on board with a gun well i am going to keep that door closed and land the plane. That is why we have police, swat, etc. I am a pilot not a marksman, sniper, etc. Chances are he is going to be waiting for so when you open the door. That is my thoughts.

That would be a nice solution, but impractical. The door has to open for "physiologic" needs. A double barrier system could be devised, at great expense. No airline will spend the money. Besides, the intent of the airlines and government isn't to make travel more secure, it's to make the public feel better.
There are ways around that steel door and don't think the bad guys don't know them.
Telling the pilot to "just land the airplane" is like telling your wife to "just go home" if she's attacked in some isolated spot.
Armed pilots are the best deterrent we have.

 

[SuperFLUF]

............I think the worst thing that congress ever did was to allow pilots to carry guns. You guys now have a steel reinforced door that cant be opened except from the inside only so why do you need a gun. I like guns and have a few myself but I am not going to go looking for a gun fight. If a terriost is on board with a gun well i am going to keep that door closed and land the plane. That is why we have police, swat, etc. I am a pilot not a marksman, sniper, etc. Chances are he is going to be waiting for so when you open the door. That is my thoughts.

"They could be waiting when you open the door." That's exactly how it could happen again.

Eventually the crew needs to eat and take a dump. Those doors don't keep anyone out when they are open. How many times does the door open during the flight? Every time it does the entire airplane is at risk.

THAT is why pilots are allowed to voulenteer for rigorous law enforcement training to carry a gun.

Why do you have guns at home? Don't you count on "the police, SWAT, etc." to be at your house within 2 seconds of your cry for help?

The only person you can count on to protect you is.......you.

 

[theo]

I wholeheartedly agree with you. But put on any of the news stations, not 5 minutes will go by without them carelessly disclosing weaknesses in aviation. The media are obnoxious and it amazes me that they are not muzzled a bit. It seems they will not be happy until they scare everyone into not flying. I don't think we will ever see a strong demand for air travel again like we did pre 9-11 until the media decides to talk about something else.

Sorry to disagree but I think air traffic has reached and surpassed pre 911 days already, with this summer looking like record passenger levels.

 

[kelbill]

I think it will happen again, but now we know what to do. Dont open the cockpit door. Do whatever it takes even if they kill everyone on board, but dont open the door and land the plane, and let the police do there job. I think the worst thing that congress ever did was to allow pilots to carry guns. You guys now have a steel reinforced door that cant be opened except from the inside only so why do you need a gun. I like guns and have a few myself but I am not going to go looking for a gun fight. If a terriost is on board with a gun well i am going to keep that door closed and land the plane. That is why we have police, swat, etc. I am a pilot not a marksman, sniper, etc. Chances are he is going to be waiting for so when you open the door. That is my thoughts.

Geez, Learjet Pilot, you need to get a grip. You sound like you were brought up on Democratic talking points regarding government being able to take care of you, 24/7. How is a gun in the cockpit going to make it more unsafe? And how are police and FBI units going to protect you once Ahab starts beating down the door? There hasn't been any accidental discharges to my knowledge, so throw that negative out for now at least. Might Muhammed be waiting for a pilot to take a pee? Sure, but I bet he is much more happy to wait for the door to open on flights without a gun up front. Now he has to guess? Is there one or isn't there? These terrorists aren't the tough guys the media makes them out to be. They are determined and motivated, no doubt, but they like the route of least resistence. A potential gun in the cockpit is another variable for them. An FFDO unloading on a couple of them trying to break in might give the pilot flying enough time to put the plane on the ground while the door is closed again and/or the pax jump up and pound the fools into oblivion. Don't fret, your buddies at the ACLU will have plenty of time to sue the airline for excessive force.

 

[WMT]

If i were you guys i woulb be more worried about the right wing christian fanatic than anyone else. I was flying with this relgious nut the other day and he was telling me about christ and how i need to be saved. I ignored this guy during the whole trip and at the end, he returns to the plane because he mistakenly forgot his gun. He was a FFDO and i would never trust this nut.

Hey, did they ever catch the guy that bombed the abortion clinic for Jesus? I was walking around the terminal couple of days ago and this guy comes chanting about Jesus and how he saved the world, my flight attendant and I almost died laughing in our seat at this guy.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

If i were you guys i woulb be more worried about the right wing christian fanatic than anyone else. I was flying with this relgious nut the other day and he was telling me about christ and how i need to be saved. I ignored this guy during the whole trip and at the end, he returns to the plane because he mistakenly forgot his gun. He was a FFDO and i would never trust this nut.

Hey, did they ever catch the guy that bombed the abortion clinic for Jesus? I was walking around the terminal couple of days ago and this guy comes chanting about Jesus and how he saved the world, my flight attendant and I almost died laughing in our seat at this guy.

Let me get this straight. You flew with a crewmember that was an FFDO and you didn't know it until the trip was over. He forgot his gun and went back for it? Where did he leave it?

 

[kelbill]

WMT, you need to get your phoney stories straight. You appear to be an Atheist-fanatic. Like the other guy said, you fly with a guy but never knew he was an FFDO. Strike one. You are walking around the terminal when some guy starts babbling about Jesus, but you are laughed out of your seat. I thought you were walking. Strike two. Your info listed shows just over 1000 hours along with other nebulous data. Strike three. Not too convinced you are even a pilot.

 

[willard]

The terrorists strike everytime your airline has to fuel it's planes at the current going rate.

 

[Inconceivable]

^----- Bingo!

 

[C-150ETOPS]

If i were you guys i woulb be more worried about the right wing christian fanatic than anyone else. I was flying with this relgious nut the other day and he was telling me about christ and how i need to be saved. I ignored this guy during the whole trip and at the end, he returns to the plane because he mistakenly forgot his gun. He was a FFDO and i would never trust this nut.

Hey, did they ever catch the guy that bombed the abortion clinic for Jesus? I was walking around the terminal couple of days ago and this guy comes chanting about Jesus and how he saved the world, my flight attendant and I almost died laughing in our seat at this guy.

Then call the TSA and tell them exactly what happened. If that is what happened you have a responsibility to report it. If not, run over to the Yahoo chatboards.

 

[HighSpeedClimb]

I think it will happen again, but now we know what to do. Dont open the cockpit door. Do whatever it takes even if they kill everyone on board, but dont open the door and land the plane, and let the police do there job. I think the worst thing that congress ever did was to allow pilots to carry guns. You guys now have a steel reinforced door that cant be opened except from the inside only so why do you need a gun. I like guns and have a few myself but I am not going to go looking for a gun fight. If a terriost is on board with a gun well i am going to keep that door closed and land the plane. That is why we have police, swat, etc. I am a pilot not a marksman, sniper, etc. Chances are he is going to be waiting for so when you open the door. That is my thoughts.

The cockpit door may be bullet proof but not the head right next to it. What if a whacko sends a plug into the cockpit from some other area than straight through the cockpit door??? Doh

 

[FFFO]

I will cautiously add air cargo to the discussion. Whats in the box? Who packed it? Pallets full of shrink-wrapped _____ ? from just about everywhere in the world.

 

[JP4user]

The terrorists strike everytime your airline has to fuel it's planes at the current going rate.

Now that is food for thought.

 

[FN FAL]

That is why we have police, swat, etc.

Ummmm, yea, O.K.

Sheriff's Deputy Mistakes Pistol for Taser

[SIZE=-1]The Associated Press
Friday, June 23, 2006; 3:33 PM[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]

[/SIZE]
BREMERTON, Wash. -- A sheriff's deputy who was trying to get a man down from a tree shot and wounded him after mistakenly pulling a gun instead of a Taser, authorities say.

The deputy, a five-year veteran of the force whose name was not released, was placed on leave while Thursday's shooting is investigated.

Deputies carry both a Taser and a gun on their utility belts. The Taser, or stun gun, is similar in shape to the compact .40-caliber gun the deputy carried, sheriff's spokesman Scott Wilson said.

The victim was listed in satisfactory condition.

The man had been climbed a fig tree and stayed there for hours, talking to himself. Deputies were unsure whether he was intoxicated or psychotic, and they wanted to get him down before he hurt himself or others, Wilson said.

Deputies and rescue workers tried to coax him down for almost two hours, during which he became increasingly hostile, said David Blakeslee, an employee at an auto repair shop nearby
.
Blakeslee said the man climbed down on his own after getting shot.

"He said, `Ow, that hurt. I'm coming down, I'm coming down,'" Blakeslee said.

© 2006 The Associated Press​

 

[inline]

I wanted to hear what major airline pilots think about this matter. Has security changes changed the likelyhood of another terrorist attack via aviation, or will terrorists simply try other ways?

Only interested in " major airline pilot's" opinions? No regional, freight, etc., pilot's opinions?

Here's my .02 worth. The politically correct, DEMOCRAT, head-in-sand, incompetent transportation secretary, Norm Mineta....RESIGNED! He's one reason the TSA has been handcuffed from being more aggressive to weed out potential terrorists. GOOD RIDDANCE!

 

[Focus]

Man, I just dont get it....I see more gun toting pilots these days then I've ever seen during my twenty year career. I have to admit that it is nice to have a gun in the cockpit but once again we have chosen to provide a service for free.......When will it end.....Im currently looking for another career as this ocupation continues to go the way of Greyhound. I never thought I would say that but I am no longer proud to even be a Major Player. This profession is being destroyed by those amongst us who continuously give in to economic pressure AND THEIR OWN SELF INDUCED MACHISMO. I see no end unless our leaders in ALPA stand up and do the right thing. I for one will not subsidize pajama travelers anymore.....My life is too short for that. Good Luck to all. ( yes, I am currently employed and flying a line.)

 

[Wheres the van?]

The reality is this,they have not got bored and gone away,they have multiplyed and have mutated into independent cells with no tangible links to Al queda but with very similar goals as Al queda.they are here in this country watching,learning,probing for there next big spectacular.We cannot afford to let our guard down for one second,there threat may or may not have an Arab face and we must also be alert to that fact.The routine of security checks and added responsibility should not be relagated to just one more task before we go fly they are as relevent today as they were on September 12th,we will enevitably be the last link in the chain and if that day should arrive will you be ready?

 

[FN FAL]

Man, I just dont get it....I see more gun toting pilots these days then I've ever seen during my twenty year career.

You just like using the word tote.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

I see no end unless our leaders in ALPA stand up and do the right thing.

Soemtimes that starts at the local level. And it's done through resolutions introduced at your LEC meetings. Thats where you find out if your thinking is right on track or your peers consider you to be out in left field.

Don't like how your local LEC runs things? Run for office....again, this will tell you if your thinking is square on or if your are waaaayyyy out there.

All the best for getting the changes you want.

Tejas

 

[GunSlinger]

Ty, this thread was not meant for you to answer, Valuejet/Airtran is NOT a major airline.

What a jacka$$! There is always some moron who will turn every thread into a flame session.

Stick to question at hand and learn to forgive the airlines that turned you down.

 

[bustinmins]

This topic has a high probability of exposing sensitive information in a public forum. Recommend any discussions along these lines be taken to a more secure site.

AGREED - Loose lips, sink ships.

 

[jayme]

Only interested in " major airline pilot's" opinions? No regional, freight, etc., pilot's opinions?

Here's my .02 worth. The politically correct, DEMOCRAT, head-in-sand, incompetent transportation secretary, Norm Mineta....RESIGNED! He's one reason the TSA has been handcuffed from being more aggressive to weed out potential terrorists. GOOD RIDDANCE!

Wow, the sweeping changes are MIND BLOWING! Thank God that evil DEMOCRAT is out of there .
What a fcking joke.

 

[FN FAL]

AGREED - Loose lips, sink ships.

Yea, some wacky dudes might get a crazy idea to bring Stanley knives on a airplain and smash em into a building...which would be insane, but it's probable.

 

[HalinTexas]

I guess this discussion is moot.

 

[JediNein]

Dear God, please protect me from your followers.

 

[FN FAL]

I guess this discussion is moot.

Mooed, cowboy, mooed. Long-handled words like moot, obfuscation and interoperability, are for lawyers, legislators, municipal planners and city slickers, not cow pokes.

 

[Rik717pilot]

The real problem is that the radical muslims think that the third Caliphate is about to occur, some what like the second coming of Christ. The radical muslims have declared all out total war against every one who does not think the same as them. It is a world war that will not afford the taking of prisoners. It is time for the "West" to think in like terms and go after total victory and erase the radical muslims from the face of the earth.

 

[Whine Lover]

Agreed.

Deport everyone of 'em.

Put em' all on trains and send them to the "work camps" if they don't leave.

Nuke the entire Middle East. Hell, and all them African/Muslim strongholds too..and France while we're at it.

Destroy the vermin that are left like cockroaches in the street.

Put it all on T.V. and make "American Jihad" the next best thing to "American Idol."

Love,

YKW

 

[Rik717pilot]

I like your thinking Whine Lover

 

[FN FAL]

Agreed.

Deport everyone of 'em.

Put em' all on trains and send them to the "work camps" if they don't leave.

Nuke the entire Middle East. Hell, and all them African/Muslim strongholds too..and France while we're at it.

Destroy the vermin that are left like cockroaches in the street.

Put it all on T.V. and make "American Jihad" the next best thing to "American Idol."

Love,

YKW

Actually, if the church of jebus wants to wage a holy war, they are going to have to raise their own armies and their own monies.