Why we are victims of the oil industry

[FN FAL]

How come other industries who live/die on oil prices and airplanes (fedex,UPS) are thriving right now?? -- because unlike the airlines they actually have a business plan. shocker. they pass on the costs. people pay still...wow, what a revalation.

Americas economy is moving along just fine, even with the HUGE increase in the price of oil.

Don't you know, the airlines and the public are "entitled" to that oil.

 

[AvroJockey]

Keep on Riding!

Avro Jockey, your points are very well-made. But, I have to disagree on two things:

1) "If American oil companies and Bush are colluding against the consumer, why hasn't any branch of local, state, or federal government brought antitrust charges against said companies?"
The answer is because all levels of government are benefitting hugely by the taxation associated with these high prices. The local, state, and federal government are just as greedy as the oil companies and oil-producing nations. Why should they complain while getting this exorbatant tax revenue?

2) "In short, quit your bitching, quit begging for so-called entitlements, control your own destiny, and drive a Yugo!"
I have no problem driving a Yugo. And, I bike everywhere I can. And, I believe in controlling one's own destiny. So, you know what I did? I started a business years ago, to control my "own destiny." Good for me. Now, that business is failing, too, because people aren't spending like they used to. It's a micro-example of the macro-devastation that's occurring to business and consumers. The oil industy has unnecessarily screwed so many employees, and now you can't even "control your own destiny," as you propose. Note the word unnecessarily.

I commend you on your personal responsibility; it seems this mindset has eluded today's society. Malice has replaced it, and it's blind to any hierarchy. Government and corporations are conforming to the "moral" fabric that US citizens have re-woven, and the result is such things as contract abrogation, and indictments of senior Executive Branch officials. Our government is for the people, and by the people. So when we complain of the corruption and greed in government, society must first look in the mirror and confess. It's the classic pot calling the kettle black.

But anyway... You seem like a smart person, but I would like to give a little advice, if you would entertain it. Get back on the bike, and keep on trying! Very few succeed on the first, second, or even third try. If you want it bad enough, you'll learn from your mistakes, and forge on.

 

[FN FAL]

In short, quit your bitching, quit begging for so-called entitlements, control your own destiny, and drive a Yugo!

Yogos are nice, I just picked up a really cool Zastava M92 and it's the bomb.

 

[Bankangle]

I read recently but cant remember the orgin of the article but it stated that.. the folks that have all this oil and that are associated with the negative public backlash with the high prices..... Make the smallest profit off of it. It was the western oil companies that made the largest profit off of oil.

???

 

[jetflyer]

Runwayjockey,
Great posts.
The oil companies shut down the refineries on purpose. They reduced the number of refineries from 324 in 1981 to 149 in 2003.

They get most of their profits from the refining. They're publicly traded companies and want to maximize their profits. This is their job.

The government needs to GET INVOLVED before our country comes down. The government needs to stop CATERING TO LOBBYING GROUPS.

The government needs to do what is right for the American people.

In the short term, more refineries NEED TO BE BUILT.

We need to drill in ALASKA, OFF BOTH COASTS, EVEN FLORIDA.

We need to require all new HYBRIDS be BUILT WITH THE NEW PLUG-IN CAPABILITIES, which have the option to be plugged in an outlet in your garage and can run on the batteries only for the first thirty miles. There are groups in San Francisco modifying Priuses and other hybrids to do this now. Honda is looking into doing it in the future. This technology is VERY HATED by the Oil Companies, so guess what greed will probably bury this technology too.

We need to build nuclear power plants to power these vehicles.

People that propose a Hydrogen future don't realize that Hydrogen is an energy carrier. YOU HAVE TO USE AN EQUAL AMOUNT OF ENERGY TO CREATE THE HYDROGEN. Right now Natural gas is the most common energy source used to create hydrogen.

HYDROGEN will happen but its 10-20 years away. Do research. The cheapest cars are still over a million. Mass production will help, but they also can't keep the hydrogen from EVAPORATING out of the tanks. If you leave the car sitting for a month and come back the tank will be empty!!! Hydrogen is the smallest element and simply escapes ANY container. You can't keep it a liquid because it has to be kept very, very cold and it takes energy to keep it that cold. There are other experimental ways they're planning to overcome these problems. We need to dump BILLIONS into finding out the solutions.

We need to use the nuclear power plants to create the hydrogen for the future. Natural gas is too expensive to be used and is still a limited resource as we're seeing now. Nuclear power plants take about 5 years to construct. We need to get started!!!!

We need to turn COAL to oil and use carbon sequestration to capture the carbon.

We need to turn OIL SHALE to oil and again use carbon sequestration technologies to capture the carbon.

The Oil Sands in Canada are great but if you double their estimates from 10 years from now they still are only going to produce around 4-5 million barrels a day. Plus the Oil sands require NATURAL GAS. There is plenty of natural gas in the world but North America has tapped out its natural gas and it is supposed to begin a decline in North America even before oil does for the world.

We need to build MANY LNG(liquified natural gas) PORTS to import natural gas. We're going to have to import much, much more in the future from other areas of the world which have plenty. We better build the tankers and ports NOW!

ETC. ETC. ETC. I could go on for 4 hours about what needs to be done.

Ethanol from Corn is not the answer.

It takes 11 acres of corn to produce enough ethanol to power a car for one year!! Plus it has been found to have a negative EROEI (energy returned on energy invested) You use more energy creating the ethanol than you get out of it. Ethanol from CORN is not the answer, they just have the best lobbying group and many voters in Iowa, a SWING STATE.

Bio-diesel from SOY is better, but not much better. Biodiesel from ALGAE IS THE BEST, and has the highest EROEI. Switchgrass and Palm Oil is also great, but guess what they don't have POWERFUL LOBBYING GROUPS!

SCREW POLITICS@!@# I hate DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS. THEY'RE BOTH BRINGING DOWN AMERICA. LET'S BE AMERICANS AND FIX THIS SERIOUS PROBLEM, NOT AFFILIATED TO SOME RETARDED POLITICAL GROUP.

Those of you that think there is no problem don't know what is coming. The problem is only just beginning.

The world's spare capacity is gone. OPEC is NOT holding back supply. This is not Opec's fault. It's America's fault for allowing our dependence to become so great on oil. Opec wants to bring down the price of oil. They're all PUMPING FULL TILT!! THEY CAN NOT KEEP UP WITH DEMAND. They WANT to keep the price in the 40s so people don't switch to electric cars or build a hydrogen economy.

The price of oil is high now because the demand for oil MUST MEET the world's supply. There simply isn't enough oil. Well that and we don't have enough dam-n refineries because of greed.

Refineries are the short term problem. Oil production for the world maxing out and beginning an inevitable decline is the long term problem. It's only a matter of when not if.

I believe we will pass peak in 2010-13 at around 94+/- Million barrels a day up from today's 84 MBD according to estimates from ASPO and a new country by country, oil field by oil field study out of Finland. That's when things are really going to get fun.

We have to hurry.

Jet

 

[FN FAL]

An asteroid is going to hit the earth in 2025 and that will help shake out some new oil.

 

[USNFDX]

You left wing Bush-Basher are truley Hypocritical IDIOTS......If you were honest and true to your core Idealism...You should be FU$k'n thrilled with $3.00 a gallon gas. Go back and read Al Gore's book.

I'm pissed at the president because he wouldn't shut down the borders, he spends like a liberal, but more importantly he keeps trying to apease the left.

It's nice to blame your problems on somebody else (GW). Take charge of your own life, instead of being a victim all the time.

You want blame for high gas, If your to the left, go look in the mirror and smile. You got exactly what YOU asked for!

 

[jimcav]

Yeah not only are the Bush bsahers hypocrites but they sound like a bunch of idiots. Not for their opinions but the blind hatred they have. Maybe the GOP is in bed with big oil, but lets face it, were talkin politics here. There is corruption on both sides. How about the moral compass of the Dems, Sen Kennedy. The scumbag who while drunk drove off a bridge ,crashed into a pond, ran away leaving a young lady to die a horrific death. Who in their right mind would elect and reelect this fookin scumbag to serve 2 generations in the US Senate? The party of the "intellectual elite", thats who. If you live in a glass house don't throw stones.

 

[Dizel8]

Regardless of which side of the fence you love or despise, America needs to form a comprehensive energy plan for the future. Last time, it was OPEC screwing with us, this time it is supply and refining capability, who knows what it will be next time?

While there is probably plenty of oil in the ground, at least for the near future, there can be little doubt, that increasing demand has the potential to keep the prices higher than what we would like.

There are plenty of energy sources available to us, solar, wind, wave and the big one, Nuclear power. Certainly some of them, at present, are not as cheap as oil, however, given the incentive to research, we may see technological breaktroughs that make it economically feasible.

Had we truly started research in 1972, back when OPEC was squeezing us, who knows where we could have been today? We missed one wake up call, hopefully we will heed this one!

 

[414Flyer]

Our current plight is a function of two things:

1) A completely clueless president (clueless about the attack on the common mans pocketbook by big oil) and an equally inept congress. Their job is to preserve the good of our country and lead. They have let the oil companies take advantage of the entire nation. Expect a revolution if prices don't come down.... AND STAY DOWN.

So how is Bush responsible for the price of a worldwide traded commodity? Are you saying the high prices of oil are only in the US?

We have no right to cheap gas, just because we have always had it, and hence drive the biggest cars in the world and choose to live sometimes far distances from work.

How would the President and Congress lower the price of oil around the world, which is about the only way it is going to drop here too. I do not see any capability for US to get oil for 25-35 a barrel, when the rest of the world pays 60.

And production cost does not figure into the value of something. Value is based on demand/supply for an object, not how much it costs to make it. Every well probably has a different production cost, but that does not change the end value of the product. Do you see gold having a different value based on the mine it comes from?

If consumption goes down, they'll raise the prices to make up for the loss in consumption.

No, its ever increasing demand which is getting us to this point of high prices. Oil is a commodity which is very sensitive to demand or lack of, and prices go up and down disportionately. Oil production is fairly steady and going down in some fields. There is no big gap anymore in demand and maximum production capacity like there used to be.

A 10 percent drop in demand in the US, would have a pretty substantial drop in world crude prices. Gas prices are already dropping here, one reason is people driving less.

For those who say it is Bushes fault, tell us what Bush could do.

Should he go to the UN and demand that China and India are not allowed to have cars?

Should he try to get congress to pass a law that US refineries can only buy oil from other countries at 35 a barrel?

Actually Bush has tried to increase suppply, its the Dems (with the exception of Teamsters union) oppose oil exploration and production. Groups like Greenpeace want to end all domestic production.

 

[414Flyer]

I know that sounds good, but I don't believe that lowering consumption does anything for the long term. If consumption rate per person goes down, all they need to do is lower the supply to meet the new lower rate; thus keeping us sucking on the oil nipple for many, many more years.

So how exactly do oil companies keep you dependent on them? Are they supposed to stop sellling gasoline to you ? No one holds a gun to your head and makes you buy a car, or makes you buy fuel. Gasoline conservation was at one time seen as patriotic, now people whine if they have to do things like conserve or car pool.

 

[ACWild]

.
.
.
Mr. Hat - USA Today did an analysis of the hybrids and the two issues that stood out were the fact that the advertised EPA mileage on the sticker wasn't even close to what people were getting in actual driving. That seemed to be due to the fact that the EPA allows the manufacturer to really "stack the deck" in their favor during proving runs. The other factor was the hybrid premium of $5000-$8000 you pay up front doesn't make up for the higher gas mileage over the expected five year life of the vehicle.
.
.
..

My Civic Hybrid is rated at 47/48. In reality, especially after the software updates it's averaging 54 to 56 mpg. It has a lot to do with the fact that I do highway driving and don't floor the gas pedal. Now when I get stuck in stop and go traffic, all bets are off.
The govornment quietly supports alternative energy. NJ payed 70 percent upfront for my photovoltaic solar cells. Also, as an extra incentive, they created an S-RECs program that pays me for the electricity that I generate even though I'm the consumer. Kind of like double-dipping, since I also get money for the excess electricity that I generate from the utility company.
No if every household incorporated this system, we would have an abundance of electric power. Then we could convert more of our appliances that rely on other power sources to electric thus freeing up another energy source for things that absolutely require it.

 

[turbodriver]

Having lost two mainline-flying jobs due to mismanagement and oil prices, it's infuriating to see oil priced as it is.

Exxon Mobil's 2nd quarter profit was a whopping 7.64 billion dollars! And, the other oil companies were just as busy laughing all the way to the bank, as they held all consumers and companies by the you-know-whats.

The bottom line is that we are being scammed, by oil-producing nations (with OPEC at the top of the list) and the oil companies. When it costs an OPEC nation around $1.50 to produce a barrel of oil, and they sell it for the current price of around $65 per barrel, that's pure greed -- especially considering that it just wasn't too long ago that oil was priced at $17 per barrel.

I got fed up and wondered why the oil industry does to us what it does. I recently read a book, Over A Barrel: Breaking The Middle East Oil Cartel, by Raymond Learsy. It explains everything about the oil scam that we're forced to pay for every day. It describes, in great detail, the gross extent to which the oil-producing nations and the oil companies are in collusion to break us of our pocketbooks.

I greatly urge all other pilots to read this book, to get an education on what's really going on. I have no ties to the publisher, so I'm just recommending it as a mere reader. But, please, go out and get a copy and read it (it's not a Bush-bashing book, as it's written by a conservative and former Reagan appointee). It will change your outlook on what's going on in this nation.

So you want to know why we're oil victims you say......

It's probably been said but I'll say it again.

Because a oil man in in the white house who won't explore new technology which will get us off the oil spigot.

Plain and simple.

 

[USNFDX]

So you want to know why we're oil victims you say......

It's probably been said but I'll say it again.

Because a oil man in in the white house who won't explore new technology which will get us off the oil spigot.

Plain and simple.

Plane and Simple...You're a bunch of hypocrits

I didn't know it was the Gov't job to explore new technology. Again if you were true to your idealism.....$3.00 a gallon is good thing...it's good for the environment, and will spur R&D for alternative more enviromentaly friendly alternative energy sources.

You libs all for alternative sources, as long it's not your own backyard. What happend to the wind farm in Long Island Sound??????????

 

[Dangerkitty]

My Civic Hybrid is rated at 47/48. In reality, especially after the software updates it's averaging 54 to 56 mpg. It has a lot to do with the fact that I do highway driving and don't floor the gas pedal. Now when I get stuck in stop and go traffic, all bets are off.
The govornment quietly supports alternative energy. NJ payed 70 percent upfront for my photovoltaic solar cells. Also, as an extra incentive, they created an S-RECs program that pays me for the electricity that I generate even though I'm the consumer. Kind of like double-dipping, since I also get money for the excess electricity that I generate from the utility company.
No if every household incorporated this system, we would have an abundance of electric power. Then we could convert more of our appliances that rely on other power sources to electric thus freeing up another energy source for things that absolutely require it.

What a minute. I am a little confused here. I have been doing alot of Hybrid research lately and I read that with a Hybrid you actually get BETTER mileage in the city becuase the electric part of the Hybrid was powering the car much more than the gas engine is. This becuase you are at slower speeds where the electric side of the Hybrid is driving the motor. On the highway usually the gas engine is the only thing powering the vehicle becuase the electric cannot power the vehicle above certain speeds.

So when you state "All bets are off when it comes to stop and go traffic" what do you mean. It was my understanding that that is were you get the best MPG's becuase you were basically all electric.

Also, where did you get the software upgrade? Did you go to Honda and they installed it for you?