Why the RJDC is sooo nervous

[General Lee]

79%N1,


Man alive, you are angry. Too bad. This is an open forum, and you can discuss your other problems on your own ALPA board etc. Guess what? I enjoy all parts of aviation. I follow what goes on in this whole industry. And you want to take that away from me? Wrong. I will bring my opinion to any thread I want to. If you don't like that--leave.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[wms]

Uh, not using jetways has nothing to do with the aircraft. It has to do with the choices the mainline carrier makes. I heard that Eagle uses jetways at every station they serve. And, people want to get off an airplane quickly, no matter what size they are.

The problem with jetways here (ASA) is the company doesn't put enough emphasis on using them. They have not insisted that all stations with the capability use jet ways. Some stations use them for all aircraft even if it means towing aircraft out of the way, but most stations (esp DAL stations) look for any reason not to, and they're allowed to get away with it. At HOU they make the pax walk up the little stairs with the corrugated steps on the outside of the jetway rather than pull the plane up to it. Many pilots have reported to the company the benefits and safety for them, but have largely been ignored.

 

[On Your Six]

I have to agree with AFIXEDWING.....

My problem all along with Generall Lee and FDJ is that they troll the "REGIONAL" board, where they dont even work at, and look for threads to jump in on, and in some cases hijack, and knock everything we do! Our airplanes suck, pax hate us, were taking paycuts, our companies are downsizing, we're sharing the pain, we're stealing their flying, we dont support the furloughs!!!!!!!!!!!! It gets sooooo tiring! WE GET IT! We are low rank, second class dirt! We steal flying, we make too much compared to Mesa, and everyone hates flying on us! Cant we just have our own discussions about these things without the Delta guys jumping on???? Isnt there Delta stuff to discuss with all the Delta buddies? I know, everyone is entitled to an opinion, but in my opinion they are overkill! Just leave us alone already!

Quit being such a hoser... For your information, what happens on the regional board can impact the major board and vice versa. This is an open forum and opinions from all angles are appreciated. If you don't like it then tune out...

 

[Mikes Apartment]

Hey General,

Why don't you go ride the snake on your 767 with your greek water and leave the regional business to the pros who fly them?
Peace out

 

[sweptback]

The problem with jetways here (ASA) is the company doesn't put enough emphasis on using them. They have not insisted that all stations with the capability use jet ways. Some stations use them for all aircraft even if it means towing aircraft out of the way, but most stations (esp DAL stations) look for any reason not to, and they're allowed to get away with it. At HOU they make the pax walk up the little stairs with the corrugated steps on the outside of the jetway rather than pull the plane up to it. Many pilots have reported to the company the benefits and safety for them, but have largely been ignored.

I was just at HOU and they are using a jetway now. However I think maybe the late flight might get screwed like that, though.

There are a lot of stations that have jetways, but choose not to use them. What we need is for every "connection" only station to use the pseudo-jetway like at MLU, and every "mainline" station to use a real jetway, even if it means moving the jetway between planes or towing them out of the way. SAV does a good job of jockeying the jetway back and forth.

The company says there's 80-some-odd stations that have jetway capability, but says nothing about how many stations use them on a routine basis. Probably half of them are too lazy to move the jetway up to the airplane, or like one station that I forget where, have the jetway, but not the connecting ramp to let people actually board.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

The General, FDJ2 and On Your Six along with ANY person who is a member here can post on ANY section they choose. Should those here who think they should have access to it by invitation only, they need to start their OWN blahblah.com BS site and have it only authorized to the people who THEY think should join.
Public is just what it means. Don't like it? Sorry.

 

[FlyComAirJets]

Talk about spiting your own face.

Just check out this thread's title, originally submitted by guess who, Gee Lee himself. Throw in the usual suspects who just love to jump in with their usual disparaging remarks and you have one big happy anti-RJ bash. The RJDC had nothing to do with that article yet they just have to get their cheap shots in.

On Your Six accurately says, "what happens on the regional board can impact the major board and vice versa." Same thing can be said about the financial situation between mainline carriers and their wholly owned subsidiaries. Still, it's funny how they seem to delight in any negative RJ press.

OK, maybe it's not so funny.

 

[General Lee]

Flycomairjets,


I saw the article and thought it was interesting, and the title of my thread made sense too. The RJDC guys are worried about ALPA bargaining for them without their input, yet at the same time have aspirations of flying larger equipment for a lot less pay at their own airlines. Lawson and his boys would love to fly MD88s, but they don't want to have to go to the right seat at Delta to do it. Sad but true. Inclusivescope may not admit it, but it is true and we all know it. Then guys like Afellowaviator love to say all of his neighbors love the RJ, and this article dispells that.


Hey, we all have had our share of bad articles, look at USAToday's Business section today--what a bunch of hogwash. But, we all get bad press sometimes. And, we all are able to give our opinions on each piece.



Mike'sapartment,

You are the man! I bet you want to nonrev to Greece---for some Greek manlove. You probably are a pro---at playing with your dingaling on those 4 hour RJ flights.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[RJFlyer]

RJflyer,
That is not really the case---you need to re-read the article. It is all right there in front of you--the businessmen and their complaints. Those are the people that really are wanted, since they buy last minute fares that are more expensive. Grandma may not care, but rich Grandpa does!

General, I was not responding to the article, I was responding to NYRangers. You may want to re-read my post. Here it is:

NY Rangers said:
The animosity is comming from pax who can either fly on an rj or a A320, B717, B777 etc, etc. The fact that they are choosing to fly on bigger aircraft ...
...People don't like the rj's anymore, period (unless it serves as their only flight out of their little towns, in wich case they are fortunate to have air service).

I replied:
As has been pointed out many times, people will fly on the airline that gets them to Grandma's house the cheapest - THEY DO NOT FLY BASED ON WHAT AIRPLANE SERVES THE ROUTE. I have commuted on an MD-88 and passengers got on saying "what a small airplane!" Has anyone ridden on Southwest? Not exactly the paragon of comfort and convenience, yet people will stand in lines that stretch to the next terminal and wait in line to fight for their window seat just to save $10 bucks over Delta or American or whoever.

To the average passenger the aircraft doesn't matter, only the price does.

The point is that the last-minute business passenger is no longer your bread and butter, and is certainly not the "average passenger." The average passenger does not care what the airplane is when they buy the ticket, they only care about the price. Maybe they complain when they get on the airplane, but by then it's too late.

And I too fail to see the relevance of the article to "why the RJDC is nervous."

 

[AV8700]

Flycomairjets,


I saw the article and thought it was interesting, and the title of my thread made sense too. The RJDC guys are worried about ALPA bargaining for them without their input, yet at the same time have aspirations of flying larger equipment for a lot less pay at their own airlines. Lawson and his boys would love to fly MD88s, but they don't want to have to go to the right seat at Delta to do it. Sad but true. Inclusivescope may not admit it, but it is true and we all know it. Then guys like Afellowaviator love to say all of his neighbors love the RJ, and this article dispells that.


Hey, we all have had our share of bad articles, look at USAToday's Business section today--what a bunch of hogwash. But, we all get bad press sometimes. And, we all are able to give our opinions on each piece.



Mike'sapartment,

You are the man! I bet you want to nonrev to Greece---for some Greek manlove. You probably are a pro---at playing with your dingaling on those 4 hour RJ flights.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Sorry General, its not true and we don't all know it. The RJDC has nothing to do with flying larger equipment.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Flycomairjets,

. Then guys like Afellowaviator love to say all of his neighbors love the RJ, and this article dispells that.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Maybe the fact that my neighbors said that dispells what is in the article. Ummmm?

You display a lot of blind faith in what mgt. and the news media tells you. Not the characteristics of an independent thinker. I would guess Dan Rather is one of your favotie news anchors.

 

[FlyComAirJets]

Nice try, Gee Lee, but that dog aint gonna hunt.

With three faulty premises, it's no wonder your conclusions are so inane.

First of all, the pilots of Comair and ASA have filed a Duty of Fair Representation case against their union based on past actions. One can't sue over future events as you seem to imply. .

Secondly, this simple DFR case has absolutely nothing to do with your fear mongering end-of-the world hysterics. Where in the RJDC's complaint does it state that the pilots "have aspirations of flying larger equipment for a lot less pay at their own airlines[?]" Instead you make unsubstantiated wild-ass claims about Inclusivescope. Why can't you cite any of these sentiments from him or anyone? Instead you say "it is true and we all know it[?]"

And thirdly, if as you claim, JC and his boys want to go straight to MD88s (what, not the 737?) then why should they care about RJs since they wont be flying 'em anymore? So which is it, we want to fly your airplanes at ASA/Comair or is it at Delta?

Nah, you are just being a provocateur.

 

[General Lee]

That's why CBS is changing it's name to just "BS". (Got that from Conan O'Brien)


No, you really do need to understand that MOST people DON'T want to fly LONG DISTANCES on RJs, and that is the truth. But, I keep saying that I do like RJs for certain routes, and they are better than props.


As far as the RJDC, we ALL KNOW that they eventually want to be allowed to negotiate for their own mainline sized aircraft. If you can't see that---then you ALL are blind. If Ford and Lawson want to drive mainline aircraft, they can---after a long interview and eventual IOE from ME.



Flycomairjets,

I bring up inclusivescope because he is the so called expert on the RJDC. After Grinstein said himself that RJ flights over 2 hours hurt our customers, it is easy to believe that RJs (maybe the 50 seaters at least) won't be as popular in our future fleets, and 70 seaters may be on the decline also. Where else would the RJDC go? Hmmmmmm? They gotta go somewhere, because they know a possible Delta interview for them (Ford and Lawson) will be tough to come by. And, I have never been called a provocateur before----thank you.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Wait a second, was it not GG himself who said he liked the 70 seaters???

 

[AV8700]

[/QUOTE]As far as the RJDC, we ALL KNOW that they eventually want to be allowed to negotiate for their own mainline sized aircraft. If you can't see that---then you ALL are blind. If Ford and Lawson want to drive mainline aircraft, they can---after a long interview and eventual IOE from ME.



Flycomairjets,

I bring up inclusivescope because he is the so called expert on the RJDC. After Grinstein said himself that RJ flights over 2 hours hurt our customers, it is easy to believe that RJs (maybe the 50 seaters at least) won't be as popular in our future fleets, and 70 seaters may be on the decline also. Where else would the RJDC go? Hmmmmmm? They gotta go somewhere, because they know a possible Delta interview for them (Ford and Lawson) will be tough to come by. And, I have never been called a provocateur before----thank you.



Bye Bye--General Lee[/QUOTE]

Don't you have to apply to get an interview? Sorry haven't done that, I'm happy here, don't want your seat or your aircraft. But if I pay dues to ALPA to represent my interest than thats what I should expect them to do.

Good lord, announced today, Comair TLH to JFK in an RJ MY GOD NO!

 

[chperplt]

Good lord, announced today, Comair TLH to JFK in an RJ MY GOD NO

Sure, that's a long flight in an RJ.. Would the nice folks in TLH rather have an RJ on that route, or no route at all? I would think they would prefer the RJ over nothing.

 

[General Lee]

"Good lord, announced today, Comair TLH to JFK in an RJ MY GOD NO!"



I think some point to point RJ flights are good. This one is a good idea because it funnels people away from ATL and allows more seats to be purchased from other connecting flights. The flight time I believe is scheduled at 2hours and 25 minutes, and that may be tough on a businessman's tush, and we will see if it is popular or not. If it is wildly popular, then maybe an MD88 or 737 will be put on that route, if not, then it will go away. I think the RJ is a good route finder or tester. The time enroute is too much according to Grinstein's comments, and I hope it doesn't backfire, but if it fails it will go bye bye.



atr-drivr,

When did Grinstein say he liked the CR7? I think the economics are better on it, but those are the same planes that flew the longer flights from DFW, and people still didn't migrate to them. I like it better than the CRJ-50, but people still would rather fly an American MD-80 than a CR7---and that is obvious. There are other routes that will do well with them, like some of the new SLC routes, but DFW--OAK or DFW--JFK did not pass.


Bye bye--General Lee

 

[FlyComAirJets]

Maybe in your own post first, think later-style, you have stumbled onto the crux of the problem, but hear this: I don't want your job, I just want you to leave my job alone.

 

[General Lee]

Fine. I can understand that. As long as you guys do the same. Deal.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[spinproof]

What, in all this, makes you think anyone wants YOUR JOB!!!! ....Having to loose 20 I.Q. points, reason and a sense of humour seems hardly worth it! ;-)....bye-the-way would you like to answer the question you posed "Snake rider"?

 

[AV8700]

Sure, that's a long flight in an RJ.. Would the nice folks in TLH rather have an RJ on that route, or no route at all? I would think they would prefer the RJ over nothing.

It was sarcasm chopper pilot

 

[AV8700]

"Good lord, announced today, Comair TLH to JFK in an RJ MY GOD NO!"



I think some point to point RJ flights are good. This one is a good idea because it funnels people away from ATL and allows more seats to be purchased from other connecting flights. The flight time I believe is scheduled at 2hours and 25 minutes, and that may be tough on a businessman's tush, and we will see if it is popular or not. If it is wildly popular, then maybe an MD88 or 737 will be put on that route, if not, then it will go away. I think the RJ is a good route finder or tester. The time enroute is too much according to Grinstein's comments, and I hope it doesn't backfire, but if it fails it will go bye bye.



atr-drivr,

When did Grinstein say he liked the CR7? I think the economics are better on it, but those are the same planes that flew the longer flights from DFW, and people still didn't migrate to them. I like it better than the CRJ-50, but people still would rather fly an American MD-80 than a CR7---and that is obvious. There are other routes that will do well with them, like some of the new SLC routes, but DFW--OAK or DFW--JFK did not pass.


Bye bye--General Lee

The mainline flights out of DFW didn't pass either.

Every aircraft Delta has is a route finder, the size of the aircraft has little to do with choice to buy a ticket.

 

[MetroSheriff]

Sorry General, its not true and we don't all know it. The RJDC has nothing to do with flying larger equipment.

BULL$HIT...

 

[bvt1151]

Perhaps you should take the time to read what the RJDC is about, Metro. Its about missrepresentation within the union. You share the most common misconception of the ill-informed masses who believe articles like "The RJDC wants Delta Pilots Families to Starve."

Educate thyself.

 

[surplus1]

And, I have never been called a provocateur before----thank you.

General,

FlyComairJets was far too generous. I would have called you (and quite a few of your buddies) charlatans (big word for quacks), suffering from an acute case of paranoia because the world of your dreams is slowly crumbling around you, you don't know what to do about it, and you're scared out of your wits.

You cling to the musings of GG as though he were the sole source of mother's milk whenever he mentions an RJ, then ramble endlessly when faced with the reality that it is YOUR throat that he's really trying to cut.

I say keep your opinions coming. Each time you voice them they serve to confirm irrational thought based esentially on a perverted imagination, innuendo and outright fear.

PS. They also uncloak your true feelings of umbridled animosity towards the regional pilot groups, especially Comair. Good job.

BTW, while many of your fears may be justified under current circumstance, you're very confused as to the source of your problems. They don't come from the affiliated regionals. Look to management and look within to your own group's prior decisions. That's where the problem comes from.

 

[WillFlyFoCookie]

Quick Question

What does RJDC stand for?

 

[VABB]

First of all, I do NOT hate RJs. I continually say that I think RJs are good aircraft on certain routes.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I agree with the General. I do NOT hate RJ's either. What I do despise is the glut of people out there who are willing to sell their souls and take these jobs just to be able to call themselves airline pilots.

I was sitting in the back of one of those little Brazilia jets at the gate in Houston one day and someone up front said "puddlejumper" and the F/O overheard it. He promptly got on the PA and told everyone that this is not a puddle jumper. He continued to inform us about how fast it goes, how high it goes, that it goes to all these different countries, and that all airlines are getting them. When his little speech was done, I felt like leaning into the aisle and shouting "show us your W2 wage statement from last year!!" That would have humbled that numbskull. Instead, I didn't do that. I did inform the passenger next to me what I was thinking though. She was shocked at how little he was paid and didn't feel too safe knowing that this "little airplane airline industry's" hiring practices are predicated on the lowest bidder.

On a seperate flight, new airline, same wages, the Captain filled us in on the current weather conditions in CVG using phrases like "flight level" and "landing minimums". Yeah, like the average passenger knows what that means. What a dork. I dislike the attitudes of a lot of these "airline pilots" more than anything.

 

[FlyComAirJets]

Just out of curiosity, VABB, were you a revenue paying passenger on that "that little Brazilia(sic) jet" flight?

 

[VABB]

Just out of curiosity, VABB, were you a revenue paying passenger on that "that little Brazilia(sic) jet" flight?

Unfortunately yes, but it was for business and I had no say on which airline I could take.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Good.