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Why some jetBlue pilots post such extreme negativity.

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Smarta$$

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 26, 2005
Posts
2,268
I hate to blow your cover to the world, but you 10 or so extremists are exaggerating the problems we have and making things sound far worse than they are as a strategy to starve jetBlue of new hire\applicants (not working) and embarrass current jetBlue pilots into voting a union (which is coincidentally the main prescription you all cite to fix what ails us).

You all want a union, I get it. I have always leaned that way, but if things were even CLOSE to as bad as you pretend they are, YOU would quit, I would QUIT, the union votes of past would have passed easily.

But alas, you haven't quit.

We have things to address, especially healthcare. But you are engaged in a strategy of starving the beast and embarrassing pilots into voting the way you want. It is too dishonest and too extreme.

You pretend like every problem will be fixed with a union. You pretend like all these union airlines have had a great run, and that they are happy.

I have met THOUSANDS of miserable legacy pilots over the years, all union. They have significant problems, just different ones. I recognize that for all the problems they have had, they have maintained better benefits, but often NOT better pay. Sometimes yes, often NO.

At the end of the day, I will likely vote for a union. But at least I won't be diluding myself and others that we won't still have problems, lose some of the jetBlue that WE enjoy, likely create some new problems we didn't anticipate, but we will probably have better benefits...

But you will still be miserable, that much I guarantee.

To those reading these forums and trying to decide about jetBlue. Read every opinion. They all have something to contribute. I love my job at jetBlue and see a good future here. A union vote will eventually pass here, but if it doesn't, it will be because things are still good enough, despite having terrible healthcare coverage and some other holes in our benefits.

But understand that there are about 10 guys on here that are engaging in a strategy to make it seem FAR worse than it really is, in a concerted effort to starve the company of new applicants, new hires, and to embarrass current JB pilots into voting union. They want a union no matter what, and will tell you that a union here will be perfect, will fix everything that ails us, will create no new problems for us, and that everything at other union majors is so perfect, and they are all so happy with their careers.
 
I should also add that NOBODY cares that much about YOUR career. They say these things pretending to be giving you advice, but really it is for THEIR own career benefit.
 
Juicer 1 says life is great and you could be off reserve in a month and then you will hold 18 days off.

a simple check of the facts shows the bottom line holders have between 12 - 14 days off and about 74 hours of credit.

When emotion loses to the facts the juicer then invents a grand conspiracy and starts to call names. Ie becomes even more emotional.

Just be cautious that is all nothing more or less.
 
Juicer 1 says life is great and you could be off reserve in a month and then you will hold 18 days off.

a simple check of the facts shows the bottom line holders have between 12 - 14 days off and about 74 hours of credit.

When emotion loses to the facts the juicer then invents a grand conspiracy and starts to call names. Ie becomes even more emotional.

Just be cautious that is all nothing more or less.

E-190 guy 2nd to the last line in bos for Jan
15 days off 84hours.
Not saying its great but not as bad as you say.
 
Let's review the facts.

RETIREMENT:
JetBlue acknowledged our deficiency 5 years ago but didn't do anything to fix it until Summer 2012. JetBlue hired a third party to study our retirement and then chose to ignore recommendations thus leading to our substandard retirement package. Furthermore, the so called fix is not in your PEA (Pilot Employment Agreement) which means it could be taken away via email.

Industry standard retirement is 13.5% plus profit sharing. These numbers are brought down by US Air and WN to some extent. WN pays a lower percentage but with their higher wages they obviously make up for it.

INSURANCE:
This has been beaten to death but JetBlue pilots now have the worst health insurance coverage in the industry. The most popular and cost effective plan is over $300 a month with a family deductible of $2600. There is some seed money but only guaranteed for three years. Max out of pocket for this plan is $6000. If you have a major medical expense it could cost you $8600 plus monthly premiums.

If you go out on medical you will be paying COBRA after 6 months and then elgible to rejoin the regular plan after 18 months of COBRA. A typical COBRA plan for a family will cost north of $1500 a month.

Typically major airlines enjoy health care benefits that are negotiated into their CBA that control costs for the life of the contract.

LTD and STD

JetBlue pilots pay exorbitant premiums for short term disability. Often times it is problematic to get paid while others have no issues.

LTD is not tax free. Typically most major airlines have tax free disability insurance and do not pay for a seperate STD plan.

VACATION:

JetBlue pilots can bid vacation annually and will be awarded based on seniority. This vacation time comes from a PTO (Paid Time Off) bank and is earned on a monthly basis. PTO is used for vacation and sick time. Compared to the rest of the industry JetBlue pilots earn a substandard amount of vacation and sick time. Industry average combined is 208 hours vs JetBlue at 144.

Also JetBlue does not allocate enough vacation and is allowed to vary peak vacation weeks to off peak by any amount desired. Example; 6 JFK 320 vacation slots per week throughout the summer. In October over 40 slots per week are available.

Typically these variances are controlled by a CBA and do not allow for such dramatic swings in availability.

Furthermore JetBlue pilots can bid up to 6 weeks of vacation and the most senior get all choices before next bidder gets 1. A 10 year Captain (which is top 25% seniority) can not hold one week off in the summer or holidays.

WORK RULES

JetBlue pilots work to the FAR limits while most major airline pilots enjoy better rules.

SCOPE and MERGER

JetBlue pilots have the so called 5 documents. These documents have ambiguous and unproven language.

PAY

For the last few years JetBlue pilots have boasted higher hourly wages then many major airlines. Those days are now over with the recent contracts at Delta and United. Many JetBlue pilots are now seeing lower w2's thanks to the decreased bid divisors and almost non-existent open time.


These are facts. We are entitled to our own opinion but not facts.
 
Juicer 1 says life is great and you could be off reserve in a month and then you will hold 18 days off.

a simple check of the facts shows the bottom line holders have between 12 - 14 days off and about 74 hours of credit.

When emotion loses to the facts the juicer then invents a grand conspiracy and starts to call names. Ie becomes even more emotional.

Just be cautious that is all nothing more or less.

That was never MY quote. You are quoting someone else.

However, since you are quoting "facts", at least your version, the BOS E90 FO awards for January, a slow month, show 15-17 days off for the most junior lines, and credit of 74-82 for the bottom lineholders. So once again, you are exaggerating the reality to make it sound as bad as possible. That is your goal, to show the worst possible spin on any subject.
 
"One month on Reserve and then 18 days off" was this distortion.

A320 JFK is between 12-14.

Them the facts now go away and start crying or call me names or accuse me of something that you just invented. Get emotional.

Juicer 1 is refers to juicers in general not you specifically. Got it!
 
"One month on Reserve and then 18 days off" was this distortion.

A320 JFK is between 12-14.

Them the facts now go away and start crying or call me names or accuse me of something that you just invented. Get emotional.

Juicer 1 is refers to juicers in general not you specifically. Got it!


The guy that said 1 month of reserve and 18 days off works for Virgin America and NEVER claimed to work for jetblue, you mis-interpreted that. The reality is on the airbus at blue 8-12 months of reserve to a junior line, which is probably 14 days off and 80 hrs credit.(depending on how commutable you want it, more commutablility = less days off) E190 probably 4-8 months.

Things are not all rosey at Jetblue, they though are not as bad as some make it. I am decidedly pro union but I would also not hesitate to recommend this place to friends at just about any regional save for certain situations. (IE they currently live in base at the regional and would be commuting to jetblue... not worth it.)
 
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