Why hire military over your competition?

[SWA Bubba]

I'm not even throwing stones, but just out of curiosity, was the captain involved in the LGA crash ex-military? I heard that captain was the most avoided captain at SWA.

Actually, she was only the highest avoided in her domicile, OAK. Of course, generally, people only list captains to avoid in their own domicile.

Bubba

 

[pilotyip]

Because nowadays they all have four year college degree's.

college degree, college degree, who said college degree? I know lots of guy hired at majors without college degrees.

From my experience, Civilian RJ people know that management is full of BS and they have seen the games that management plays.

Military people seem to be more believing that management will lead them and take care of them. They haven't experienced the games that management plays.

Management likes obedience and clean slates.

That is probably because in the military you have leaders not managers. Where looking out for your people is the golden rule.

 

[Data]

college degree, college degree, who said college degree? I know lots of guy hired at majors without college degrees.


That is probably because in the military you have leaders not managers. Where looking out for your people is the golden rule.

Oh crap, here we go with the college thing again.

 

[jonjuan]

college degree, college degree, who said college degree? I know lots of guy hired at majors without college degrees.
.

Sure, but they are typically the ones involved in the accidents.

 

[SWA717]

I have been a captain for 14 years and have flown with my share of military and civilian. You get good and bad from both sources. I believe that in this day and age of aviation, selecting either has no advantages.

 

[pilotyip]

Oh crap, here we go with the college thing again.

Hey! I didn't start this

 

[Bringupthebird]

I think it goes back farther than that. The person who is picked by the military, didn't just show up in their flight suit and ask if they could fly that jet off the carrier. Their preparation went back probably into grade school as they participated in the types of activities that would make them competitive candidates for military flight training, and that preparation had a definite impact on their character. Civilian pilots who may have had similar character-molding upbringing are probably equally competitive in this respect for an airline job. A pilot whose sole attribute is their logbook makes for a pretty dull resume for HR to consider.

Qualified, undoubtedly; but dull.

 

[densoo]

From my experience, Civilian RJ people know that management is full of BS and they have seen the games that management plays.

Military people seem to be more believing that management will lead them and take care of them. They haven't experienced the games that management plays.

Management likes obedience and clean slates.

There's a lot of truth to this. Took me five years, a major downturn, and an unwarranted and vindictive furlough to make me realize there's no patriotism in the airline business, just pennies they want to save, mostly from labor. Before furlough, zero sick calls. After furlough, maximum sick calls to comply with company policy. And sometimes I'm actually sick.

 

[flyboyike]

I'm curious why all of the majors continue to hire almost exclusively military...

Not from what I've seen, if for no other reason than there aren't that many military guys available anymore.

 

[t-bone]

Are customer skillz unique to 135? I'm sure the hundreds of 121 furloughees post 9-11 did just fine at Netjets and the other frax.

Not unique, but on a different level. And it's something the 135/fractional guys bring to the table others may not.

 

[Dan Roman]

Sure, but they are typically the ones involved in the accidents.

Ahh the internet, anyone can just make up anything they want......my experience with non college educated pilots is that they tend to be well above average sticks. The reason being is they tend to have a background of wanting to fly at an early age and they started right after high school. A couple of the best pilots I ever flew with started flying Twin Beech's right out of high school and progressed to the legacy airlines.
That said military pilots are just as good as civilian pilots (or vice versa). Once you are with an airline it's hard to distinguish.

 

[dicko]

I'm curious what type of training you are doing? At my airline I can't imagine our training failure rate is above 1%.

That's an interesting question isn't it ? Yip is the Standards Manager. Therefore he sets the tone and the standards in training. He's responsible for that wash out rate. He's also ex military.

Quite the conundrum. But at least he looks after his people, which is after all, "the golden rule". Unless you're not providing them with the comprehensive training that they need to pass. Then it's really about gold and rules.

 

[pilotyip]

That's an interesting question isn't it ? Yip is the Standards Manager. Therefore he sets the tone and the standards in training. He's responsible for that wash out rate. He's also ex military.

Quite the conundrum. But at least he looks after his people, which is after all, "the golden rule". Unless you're not providing them with the comprehensive training that they need to pass. Then it's really about gold and rules.

I suppose you might look at it that way, but you have to remember who we are, we are a bottom feeder and we do not attract astronaut candidates. There are always people hired who are not as experienced as we would like, so we take a chance on them. We have fairly high standards and if you do not met them you do not complete the program.

How many 135 on-demand cargo operators train and check under 121? How many have LOFT as part of initial and recurrent. We really try to do it right. Over the 17 years I have been here we have hired 53 ex-military guys, one failed training, he was a VFR only helo driver. IFR was just too much. We have hired over 450 civilian background pilots, of that 29 have been eliminated before the end of IOE. Most of the that is in the DA-20. In the hiring bust times of 2009/2010, we hired very experienced guys, no failures.


Our training program bends over backwards to try and get peopel through but some are just not ready for the jump to 121 jet operations.

I think the real proof of our standards is the list of places our piltios have gone after flying at JUS, SWA, DAL, AAL, UAL, FedEx, UPS, NJ, JB, Atlas, etc.

 

[el raton]

Are customer skillz unique to 135? I'm sure the hundreds of 121 furloughees post 9-11 did just fine at Netjets and the other frax.

As would 135 and 91k pilots at a 121 operation...it's not rocket science.

 

[el raton]

Sure, but they are typically the ones involved in the accidents.

That was flame, right?

 

[Daddy]

from my experience, civilian rj people know that management is full of bs and they have seen the games that management plays.

Military people seem to be more believing that management will lead them and take care of them. They haven't experienced the games that management plays.

Management likes obedience and clean slates.

bingo!

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

Quite the conundrum. But at least he looks after his people, which is after all, "the golden rule". Unless you're not providing them with the comprehensive training that they need to pass. Then it's really about gold and rules.

Now, you're not suggesting that a certain airline does not provide comprehensive training and therefore contributes to a higher washout rate? Funny, I've heard the same thing. I did notice that that certain airline is acquiring a few FPT's from "Alteon" (wonder where they are getting those from?) to be available in the training center later this year (when another airline no longer needs them). BTW, a female was promoted in the training dept., oh the humanity! Somebody is moving into the latter part of the 20th century .

 

[waveflyer]

Piltios is pretty funny yip

 

[pilotyip]

Piltios is pretty funny yip

Funny, not all all, it is a term of special designation for those pilots who have moved on in their careers to place like SWA. BTW Must have been a decent post if wavy can only find fault in speeling

 

[CCDiscoB]

Not from what I've seen, if for no other reason than there aren't that many military guys available anymore.

What?? Where did you get that tidbit from? There are plenty of military guys available.