Why are foreign airlines so much better than US?

[airlinepilot]

probably because they have more babes as FA's

 

[IronCityBlue]

probably because they have more babes as FA's

I think you mean why are some foreign airlines better than some US airlines. I've been on foreign airlines and some of them rock, and some of them are downright scary. But yes, many countries are allowed to discriminate very severely on the types of FA's they hire, and others are able to pass along some of their third world slave labor costs to the consumer at the same time.

That said, I think over the last 10 years, US carriers have gained back much of the ground they lost for a while to many foreign competitors. While high Load Factors and on time issues continue to plague our system, overall our product is getting better. With the exception of SkyBus (whose horrible product is starting to become pretty Euro-typical by the way for domestic flights) most US airlines have refreshed their fleets (and even the older planes at NWA and Delta have been refreshed inside...UAL has totally let their 737's go, and I'm not sure about CAL since I haven't been on them in a while, but they always seem to win service awards, etc).

The last big boom cycle in the late 90's has resulted in modernized terminals in just about every large airport in the country and many smaller ones as well. US carriers are rapidly upgrading their international first classes to compete with foreign offerings, and our coach products are comparable to most other countries and in many cases far superior, even to some European airlines.

But US airlines simply will never have the "advantage" of hiring exclusively thin, single, attractive female FA's with no kids and a timid desire to make you feel special about yourself. But I don't think that's an advantage we necessarily need to survive and compete anyway. Of course many guys go to Hooters for the scenery, but on any given night most people go to places like Applebees, TGIFriday's and Chili's anyway.

Not only that, but worker's rights and women's rights issues are only going to increase going forward. You simply won't be able to get a gaggle of 21 year old thin, attractive female FA's on all your flights on foreign airlines for too much longer anyway.

So in short, some foreign airlines are better than some US airlines, but we are better than many already, and catching up to the rest rapidly.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

some foreign airlines are better than some US airlines, but we are better than many already, and catching up to the rest rapidly.

keep telling yourself that over and over again, remember to click your heals while you are at it

 

[IronCityBlue]

keep telling yourself that over and over again, remember to click your heals while you are at it

Oh yeah, you are with ANA. Your stews have hot skills, and love you business traveller long time. You will take over the world with your American Frequent Flyer...Jackpot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :laugh:

 

[Ex737Driver]

Didn't know that they were. Thanks for the heads up. Bring on the cheese-eatin' surrender monkeys.........

 

[imlars]

Socialism might have something to do with it.

 

[FlyWolf]

Charging the passenger for the cost of doing business plus a little profit might have something to do with it.

 

[regionaltard]

Low hag coefficient.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Charging the passenger for the cost of doing business plus a little profit might have something to do with it.

You are on to something

 

[Lear70]

Charging the passenger for the cost of doing business plus a little profit might have something to do with it.

Gotta 2nd that idea...

Not only that, but worker's rights and women's rights issues are only going to increase going forward. You simply won't be able to get a gaggle of 21 year old thin, attractive female FA's on all your flights on foreign airlines for too much longer anyway.

Don't count on that...

Most women in other countries don't seem really *hip* on the women's rights thing. Most of them have seen how the women in U.S. and Europe have fared trying to combine a full-time career with home life and don't want any part of it. They're happy to find a husband, settle down, and be the "happy home maker".

Don't shoot the messenger... I personally like my wife home with the kids as well.

 

[McNugget]

keep telling yourself that over and over again, remember to click your heals while you are at it

ANA is outstanding. Economy class is better than Business on U.S. carriers.

 

[DallasGatr]

probably because they have more babes as FA's

We have a winner........

 

[DrewBlows]

Ryanair is a foreign carrier and they are pretty much the worst airline ever.

 

[dojetdriver]

Gotta 2nd that idea...

Don't count on that...

Most women in other countries don't seem really *hip* on the women's rights thing. Most of them have seen how the women in U.S. and Europe have fared trying to combine a full-time career with home life and don't want any part of it. They're happy to find a husband, settle down, and be the "happy home maker".

Don't shoot the messenger... I personally like my wife home with the kids as well.

Funny, I remember reading an article in the USELESSAToday/Mcpaper that pretty much said that. SOME women FINALLY figured out that they can't do BOTH.

Never should have let them vote.

 

[Lear70]

Funny, I remember reading an article in the USELESSAToday/Mcpaper that pretty much said that. SOME women FINALLY figured out that they can't do BOTH.

Never should have let them vote.

I wouldn't necessarily go *THAT* far... I know several women who are a LOT smarter than me, especially politically.

Women these days grew up in the 80's and 90's with a sense of entitlement, which Hollywood didn't help, glamorizing the female species (we're just about the only country that falls all over itself for hot women - witness the stupid airTran thread about some chick in tech pubs going on right now). So now women realize they can do everything they want (work and have kids) AND try to rule the male species... which doesn't work so well when they get older and there's a lot of younger, cuter, single girls available.

Which is probably why they especially don't like younger, thinner, cuter girls being the hiring requirement at international carriers. They may cry "discrimination" but, deep down, they know why and resent not only their aging but the fact that they can't do anything about it. It's simply business economics and the international carriers know what sells.

Not to mention the international carriers are still focused on product and service, and charge accordingly.

I'm sure there's plenty of professional female aviators on this board who this thread will offend but quite a few will understand the basic idea that guys don't like drama and most girls in this country are drama queens.

Given the choice between drama (witness most flight attendant galley gatherings) or young, cute, and friendly, who do YOU think the business customer is going to choose?

 

[johnsonrod]

Meanwhile, Skybus is offering two types of nuts...

Emirates Airline (Dubai) will offer showers in-flight for their first class passengers when the Airbus A380 joins their fleet this fall on their Dubai to New York route. The carrier claims it will be the first commercial airline to install the facility. Emirates has been criticized by environmental groups who say that the “mile-high shower” is not eco-friendly. It is reported that the aircraft will have to carry an extra 2,000 pounds of water to supply the showers. This equates to a payload that equivalent to twelve (12) extra passengers. Emirates has yet to reveal the exact details of its A380 first-class cabin, but has promised that it will be even more extravagant than Singaopre Airlines’ (Singapore) cabin.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Not to mention the international carriers are still focused on product and service, and charge accordingly.

Ding, Ding, Ding! We have a winner

Ryanair is a foreign carrier and they are pretty much the worst airline ever.

RyanAir? You missed the point of the thread by oh! lets say, a different hemisphere. We are talking about full service airlines, not LLC's. And if you look at their numbers of on time departures, loss of baggage and customer satisfaction, they are actually not that bad compared with our legacies and you will get the same level of service that you get on our legacies on domestic flights, pretty much come in sit down and shut up.
If you meant from a workers perspective, yes it is pretty bad. The pay and working conditions are almost as bad as Virgin America or Skumbus. More than $100,000 Euros $160,000 US don't go that far in Europe these days.

Didn't know that they were. Thanks for the heads up. Bring on the cheese-eatin' surrender monkeys.........

It took ALPA negotiation for you to be able to have drinking water on your flights, you are going to have to bring your own cheese to feed those monkeys with and make sure none of the FNG's get bitten by them since the rabies shots are on their own dime

 

[dojetdriver]

I wouldn't necessarily go *THAT* far... I know several women who are a LOT smarter than me, especially politically.

Women these days grew up in the 80's and 90's with a sense of entitlement, which Hollywood didn't help, glamorizing the female species (we're just about the only country that falls all over itself for hot women - witness the stupid airTran thread about some chick in tech pubs going on right now). So now women realize they can do everything they want (work and have kids) AND try to rule the male species... which doesn't work so well when they get older and there's a lot of younger, cuter, single girls available.

It's called the pussification of the American Male.

 

[FlyinGuy]

Yeah...East African Airways and Sub Sahara Airlines those guys ROCK!!!

 

[IronCityBlue]

The foreign airlines will rule the universe uncontested because of their young FA! All your business traveler are belong to them!

 

[skyward80]

I think age has very little to do with service. It's the attitude. Many of the FAs you meet on US airlines have LOUSY attitudes. Hey, let's face it, the US airline industry has been a LOUSY place to work since the end of the 90s, but taking it out on the pax will not solve anything.

New seats, etc. are all nice, but I think most people would look past the inside of the airplane if they got excellent service. (Most people = economy pax, business class pax expect a little more.)

One of the best flights I had in recent times was in a POS B762 operated by USAirways. The two FAs in the back were friendly, knew how to make/take a joke, and treated me like... are you ready... A CUSTOMER (vs another annoying mouth to feed).

Do I have to pay extra for a smile and a bit of patience? I hope not.

Skyward80

 

[d328pilot]

Answer these questions and it will provide some insight:

1. When is the last time you herd a flight attendant say "I am here primarily for your safety?" I have never herd that in Asia. Customer service is their job and if a Cabin Attendant didn't do her job, she would be fired.

2. When is the last time you saw a mechanic run to your airplane? It is abnormal to see one walk when you have a maintance problem here.

3. Have you had to wait for the ground staff to meet your airplane lately? I have never had to wait for a gate, jet bridge operator, GPU, etc since I have been in Asia.

Providing customer service is job #1 in Asia. If you dont do it, you are show then door, period. The company is staffed properly, and you will never hear someone say " That is not my job."

In addition, the customer here is willing to pay a premium price for a premium product. The combinations are the reason why Foreign carriers fly circles around US carriers.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Answer these questions and it will provide some insight:

1. When is the last time you herd a flight attendant say "I am here primarily for your safety?" I have never herd that in Asia. Customer service is their job and if a Cabin Attendant didn't do her job, she would be fired.

2. When is the last time you saw a mechanic run to your airplane? It is abnormal to see one walk when you have a maintance problem here.

3. Have you had to wait for the ground staff to meet your airplane lately? I have never had to wait for a gate, jet bridge operator, GPU, etc since I have been in Asia.

Providing customer service is job #1 in Asia. If you dont do it, you are show then door, period. The company is staffed properly, and you will never hear someone say " That is not my job."

In addition, the customer here is willing to pay a premium price for a premium product. The combinations are the reason why Foreign carriers fly circles around US carriers.

You focus on many good points for foreign airlines but what you fail to see is that if foreign airlines don't have the same class of passengers that US domestic airlines carry. Let's switch paxs and see how well Emirates does with Billy Bob from Texas who is going to get his fifth mini vodka if he has to get it himself, bygum.

 

[RompXS4D]

Also the majority of the foreign carriers are still subsidized by their government. So the service is priority number one like it was in the US prior to deregulation. The only competition prior to '78 was who had the best meal and the hottest "Stews."

 

[Lear70]

And people wonder why deregulation was such a "bad" idea...

Well, they wanted cheap tickets,,, they got 'em. Hope they enjoy their ride on Skybus, etc.

When airlines finally raise prices, it'll be interesting because the general public has gotten used to the idea of easy access to air travel. Can't wait to hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth!

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Also the majority of the foreign carriers are still subsidized by their government. So the service is priority number one like it was in the US prior to deregulation. The only competition prior to '78 was who had the best meal and the hottest "Stews."

And our carriers are not? How do you think that places like Appleton Wisconsin, gets six flights a day with 4 RJ's and 2 SAAB's? The government subsidizes (or rather, you and I) the vast majority of these feeding domestic routes to keep continuous service and the prices low. International airlines are subsidizes in a manner that they are not overburdened by taxes like we are here in the US. In other countries you see the task of security for example, done by their respective military and police forces and they are not taken from the 40 cents per dollar that we pay here in the US in taxes to hire as a TSA agent that we all know is not very far off your typical rent a cop from a mall. Is not a matter of transporting "Billy Bob" in a cattle car, it is a matter of a failed business policy that simply doesn't work. $99 tickets to Vegas doesn't pay for the fuel, simple as that.

 

[IronCityBlue]

In any case this is a dead horse arguement unless cabotage really gets going. Even then, the finest Asian carriers with 21 year old hot FA's who rub most honorable businessman's feet in first class will still have to deal with US gate and ramp agents, and may likely be forced to hire US based flight crews at some point. When on equal footing labor wise, there will be zero advantage.

 

[F9 Driver]

Fuel costs have gone up about 75% in dollars this past year while only about 40% in Euros over the same period.


Yeha - let's keep lowering the interest rates...

 

[IronCityBlue]

Fuel costs have gone up about 75% in dollars this past year while only about 40% in Euros over the same period.


Yeha - let's keep lowering the interest rates...

True dat. One "good" thing may be that the US experienced it first, and will likely hit bottom with the housing bubble first. Other countries are just now starting to feel the pinch of our housing bubble, plus many will have their own pop at the same time. Our fake wealth 30% annual appreciation (speculation) monopoly money botique mortgages were packaged up and sold as high priced securities all over the globe. We're not the only ones holding the bag. Our currency, however low it goes, will likely be on the upswing when the unholy alliance that is the Euro starts to decline substantially.

 

[Sig]

Billy Bob from Texas who is going to get his fifth mini vodka if he has to get it himself, bygum.

Are you nuts? You mean "nuthur Kerrrs Latt!"