Where do Ameriflight pilots end up?

[Toobdrvr]

okay...

I tried to stay away, but I gotta' bite on this pay raise issue...

While I stongly support a pay increase for all my former "freight dog" comrades, to use it as a solution to AMF's turnover situation is flawed. AMF is by essence a "stepping stone" for the vast majority of their pilots. Sure, there are a few who stick around, but not nearly enough to keep the place running. For most of us who left, it involved an initial pay cut so that we could move on to a position of higher prestige (big shiny jets, air conditioning, clean hands, flight attendants, etc). And yes, ther is a higher future earning potential.

But tell me honestly, if AMF offered you the same earning potential as an airline, would you still stick around, flying the old freighter, enduring your friends and family askng you if you are going to be a "commercial" pilot some day? I wouldn't. I'd still go for the prestige. Sure there may be a few who would stay, but would it be enough to keep the place going?

I have always found that a pay increase is a bad motivator. Sure the people who are there feel the initial boost and they are initially happier, but it fades in about 6 months. You also eventually have a new generation of pilots come in and the "new" pay increase is actually their base line. In time, they too will think a pay raise is a good idea. Eventually, you have a system of increasing cost for the same productivity...

Since Dogs Bollocks has been at AMF since I was first there (I think I know you), he can probably remember that the pay cale has actually been bumped up twice since we started, yet here we are again...

No, I really feel that AMF should accept itself for what it is regarding pilot retention (actually, they have always known it in BUR), but they could help a little with job enrichment such as improving schedules and more FOs.

Okay, this was waay too long. I'm done. Fire away...

 

[citabriapilot]

Well said Toob. I agree that a pay raise wouldn't keep me around for the long term. I'm more interested in QOL and a pay raise won't address the issue of 5-6 day work weeks and the early/late hours that accompany it.

For the short term, though, I'd be happier to see more jumpseat agreements. With the little time off I do get, making a trip back to the east coast for the weekend would be a nice way to re-boost my system. Southwest just doesn't always cut it. Throw in the option for a few non-stop flights on multiple carriers and I'd be happy while I wait for the "prestige"...

 

[Captain Morgan]

I was interested in the CVG Metro Captain's position at one point, but the thing that got me was the 3 weeks on and 1 week off. I can't commute on that from BUF. If I could, I'd be there by now. Maybe a better TDY schedule would be good, like 7 on and 7 off. 3 weeks is a long time. Also, I know that AMF is not conducive to commuting, but I can't move a family just like that. Commuting is a given in the industry and it would be nice if they were a little more responsive to it. Otherwise, they are always going to be targeting people that are young, single, and don't have alot of responsibilities for employment. Usually those people want to party at night and have a life on the road in terminals with a stew and have nights off to drink with friends. Right now the industry is allowing those people to go right to that lifestyle without having to endure life in a freighter. I just want to make a living and feed my family. Anyway, i'm done whining so enjoy the rest of your evening.

CM

 

[time builder]

I do see some career freight dogs around, they're flying Caravans. I still can't decide if it's their pay/QOL, or inability to progress from a single engine plane that keeps them from leaving.

 

[Frank Towns]

To reply to toobdrvr's remark about flying shiny jets, and responding to the "are you someday going to fly commercial?" question. I still get asked that question after I tell someone I fly for mainline UPS.
I guess even after all these years you never do get respect as a freighter.

 

[Popeye0537]

I was trolling the airline pilot central website and using the info on Regional vs AMF payscales it appeared to me that if you worked for one of the better regionals as an RJ F/O on the second year payscale you are at parity if not ahead of a BE99 Capt.

Once you make Capt then the payscale easily surges ahead of what the Metro guys make. Case in point, I used to fly with an BE1900 F/O out of BFI, three years ago he went to Express Jet, he now earns $65000/yr as a Jungle Jet Capt-about $20000/yr more than my 8yr Metro payscale!

Thats why I left, beside getting only 2 days off a week. Showing at 6am on monday and getting off at 9pm friday didn't leave much time for the weekend.

Now I may not get weekends off every month but the 15-19 days off a month sure do make up for it.

I don't think that 121 time is "watered down"....when I left AMF, metro guys were getting interviews with SWA but they weren't getting hired. One guy said SWA wanted "crew time" in something a little heavier. I would have stayed and was offered the 120 but I had to look at who I was going up against for a given job. If its a 121 gig, a guy from Skywest he will win out most every time. If it's the frac's/LCC its a toss up.

 

[barnyard]

if AMF wants pilots to stick around, they need to pay at least as much as Regional captains make (in my opinion, at least 50K for turboprops).
quote]

Great Lakes yr 1 Beech FO : 15$/hr x 75 x 12 = 13500

Great lakes yr 1 Beech CA : 26 x 75 x 12 = 23400

23400+13500= 36900

1st year Amflight Metro/1900- $40,440!

Just remember AMF'ers when you see the Lake's 1900's, you're making more than both pilots combined!

Be Safe out there!
Barnyard

 

[Toobdrvr]

Yard!

...was wondering when you'd show up. Ha!

Hope to see you soon Bro!
A

 

[TheDogsBollocks]

if AMF wants pilots to stick around, they need to pay at least as much as Regional captains make (in my opinion, at least 50K for turboprops).
quote]

Great Lakes yr 1 Beech FO : 15$/hr x 75 x 12 = 13500

Great lakes yr 1 Beech CA : 26 x 75 x 12 = 23400

23400+13500= 36900

1st year Amflight Metro/1900- $40,440!

Just remember AMF'ers when you see the Lake's 1900's, you're making more than both pilots combined!

Be Safe out there!
Barnyard

I thinks its bad form to use arguably the worst regional on the planet as the benchmark for pay comparison.

 

[SDCFI]

I thinks its bad form to use arguably the worst regional on the planet as the benchmark for pay comparison.

I think he was being phaseeshous (too lazy to look up spelling). Anywho, considering I'm making the same, or even slightly more, as a first year FO at Flexjet than I was as a 4 year Metro Captain at AMF, with a better schedule to boot says enough. I tell people Amflight was a good job, but basically there was nothing they could have done to keep me there. There's only so much you can do with 135 freight in general. Seeing as how the Lear Captains there top out at 70-80k flying the same crappy airplanes on the same crappy schedules there's no incentive to stay. That's not a knock on AMF, just reality. I enjoyed my time there, most of it anyway.